ESB Bladed Stunt Graflex Lightsaber "The Core!"

Discussion in 'Star Wars Costumes and Props' started by thd9791, Dec 27, 2018.

  1. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    IMG_8231.jpg

    IMG_8232.jpg

    Doesn’t look like holes in it... *...

    But I think the blades were attached pretty good to the 8mm rod because they chose to hack them off rather then just detach them. The good ol’ V2 nipple treatment

    Tom check this out though!

    IMG_8230.jpg

    Set screw in the “nipple” of the blade! Never noticed that before, but exactly like Brandon said!
     
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  2. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I think we discovered the core in the saber was probably older than the separate one. I think you can see the holes while it sits on the table, with no real collar visible like on the one installed.
    Archives.jpg
     
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  3. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Ahhh!! I got ya Tom! Seeing these holes in the nipple make me believe the 8mm rod is fixed to the core, then fixed to the saber, and the poles slide down the 8mm rod and locked inplace with a set screw like Brandon says

    Seeing the blade in the core on the table... I wonder how it’s held in since you can’t see any hex screws in the core...
     
  4. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    this confusing part is why I opted for a threaded connection. Granted, i used a full threaded rod instead of just having the part in the handle threaded with a smooth rod poking out, but that was one way it could stay in place without any visible set screw
     
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  5. Aison

    Aison Active Member

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    Nice thread! Always wanted to make a stunt bladed version. Our eyes and ears are important to nut this one out. I remember seeing a recent lost esb doco, where Mark was dueling with a v2 type stunt, and I heard what sounded like wood hitting wood, and they were hitting pretty hard. Would be good to simulate wood hitting wood and compare the sound to the scenes sound. I am sure they used all types of blades and methods until they found something that worked. Another thing I noticed when seeing the stunt footage from rotj, though I cannot remember what doco it was. They did not appear to be as aggressive when hitting blades together from memory. This though could have just been due to the style of choreography. ESB blades look painted to me. If blades were taped up, this would also make them stronger. Length of a wooden blade also will affect its strength. If I were to make a type of stunt out of a dowel blade, I would opt to have it threaded at or toward the bottom of the 3 cell, this would make it stronger. I can only speculate.
     
  6. Aison

    Aison Active Member

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    The first blade on that table in the pic with the tang, could that be a ESB stunt blade?
     
  7. kurtyboy

    kurtyboy Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I've been mulling over these details as well. Still wondering if there's a slight recess in the top of the core for the outer blade sleeve/nipple. The one in the close up looks recessed, but is that just a recess in the filler? Why is the core covered in filler anyway?
     
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  8. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    this is a good question. It seems to match the Post ANH promo shots pretty well. I think the core that's inserted into the blade is like.. a re-worked ANH stunt or something made right at that time. it doesn't look like solid metal, like you said. I wonder if it's wood... no that would be too weak. The blade even looks smooth, like it still has some reflective material on it.

    I don't see that sleeve portion (with the little set screw) on the core lying on the table, it looks like the blade goes right up against or into the core. The blade is all rusty or nicked up too.

    I have a seond ski pole here. I kind-of want to coat this one in scotchlite, like glue it on and wrap it around the blade and glue again?


    I was thinking that might have been for an Obi Wan/Luke shared stunt. That would snake right down the neck and into the motor area. it could also be for a graflex, now that I think about it. It has to go down at least a few inches to get past the socket
     
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  9. thegnome

    thegnome Jr Member

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    Have you thought about using multiple skate board bearings with different amounts of lubricant to make them move at different speeds so the blade would continue to move in it’s circular orbit while slight may still work. Using a motor just sounds like a nuisance. I don’t know, just a thought.
     
  10. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    That’s what I’m using, the bearings really quiet down the drive shaft in my v2
     
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  11. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Can't find the good image, but I may have been closer than I thought when it comes to blade thickness
    Screen Shot 2019-03-01 at 9.35.45 AM.png
     
  12. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Now hold on. No bolts? Maybe same as the short bladed wampa, said to be just clipped into the bunny ears of the belt hangers? ANH/Tube stunt?

    ESBface.jpg

    Also, SethS FOAM GRIPS
    foamgrips.jpg

    Also, anyone have a better res version of this? Shows the tip of the blade with the white material coating it
    ESBDuelend.jpg
     
  13. SethS

    SethS Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Now that I know about the big grips I can't believe the amount of photos they are in that I've stared at for years!
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2019
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  14. kurtyboy

    kurtyboy Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Anyone know how long the 8mm rod might extend into the removable blades in the Roger C Archives video? Would it be as long as the stub on the Yuma saber?
     
  15. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    My honest belief on the v2 and v3 the 8mm rod is somehow impregnated into the blade.. don’t know if it’s part of the blade, or inserted and glued in.. all I believe is it can’t come out of the blade, the 8mm rod goes all the way down into the hilt and attached to the electric motor near the clamp section

    The actual emitter basically floats, it is only held onto the nipple by 2 set screws under the emitter plate (nipple in turn is held onto the blade)

    That’s how I take it

    There is one photo were I believe I see a set screw (which would be under the gaffers tape today) but the veterans say it’s not a set screw and just gunk

    If we can prove it is a set screw then mechanically I will change my mind on how the rod is attached along with the emitter

    But as of right now I think the rod goes all the way down the hilt
     
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  16. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I worked on toms core. Tom has a genius idea on how it was put together

    I strongly believe in toms setup

    If they didn’t use a threaded rod to screw in then they simply used the hex head bolts to not only secure the core to the graflex but lock the 8mm rod that holds the blade into the core
     
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  17. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    into the blade? Honestly, I tested a threaded rod in there... too long and the other end rattles against the inside of the blade, and too short andI felt stress at the hilt end. For me I did about a hand or two's length inside the blade with 3 set screws along it
     
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  18. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Okay, so I don't have pictures yet but I got Kurtyboy's choice for reflective material. It's a white reflection, and very strong. I know it's technically glass, but DO NOT rub this material with your fingers. I feel like I touched a cactus.

    In ESB ...
    Screen Shot 2019-03-04 at 7.06.04 PM.png Screen Shot 2019-03-04 at 7.06.14 PM.png

    Is this just white with the orange lighting affecting it? Luke is behind him and has one too

    Anyway, I ordered strip that was not wide enough. I'm using my girlfriends hair rubber bands to wrap and glue it to 2/3 the circumference of a kids ski pole so it doesn't peel away. I guess we can do a test from one side and not the other!

    I ordered a 4" strip so I can wrap it like giftwrap and glue the hell out of it.
     
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  19. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Dude, don’t ruin your girls hair bands!! ;)
     
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  20. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    SHHH! I think it's okay, I mean, the bag had like 100, and they're the $2 5mm ones. OP will deliver if not :D
     
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  21. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Hey buddy my lips are sealed! Secret squirrel ;)
     
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  22. Mouse Vader

    Mouse Vader Active Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    In the 1st pic there appears to be a stage light in the foreground (someones head blocking most of it) the edge of it showing the same colour as the blade, also the bottom of the clapper board, same hue.

    Remember film (& digital cameras) require the correct white balance to show it as the brain sees it. Your head does this constant colour adjustment automatically & without you noticing.

    ALL COLOUR is ILLUSORY, even which language you learn affects what you 'see'. Roses are red & violets are blue was written when a lot of what we now call (& see) as purples were encompassed by blue, orange (ginger) & many similar colours covered by red. Viewed colours are also affected by adjacent colours. There's a lot pinky/orange going on in those pic's.

    If that material is irritating your skin I'd not use it, your skin is telling you 'stay away'. You don't want to inhale any of those beads. Glass maybe inert but any fine particle in your lungs is bad news. Encountering it briefly is one thing - having it kicking round in your home is another. 1970.s health & safety was relatively lax & people paid for it in the 1990's & 2000's. I've seen 1st hand what Pneumoconiosis does to people, it's very nasty & can take decades to surface before killing you. The stuff I bought seems to work just as well & I can see no sign of shedding. I was thinking of getting some myself but after what you've just said I'm steering clear I have enough lung trouble as it is.
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2019
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  23. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Yea, thank you for that. Up close it has the grainy look IMG952203.jpg
     
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  24. Mouse Vader

    Mouse Vader Active Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    It would be really interesting to see how that stands up to being knocked about, but if you try it I'd do it outside pref. with a face mask.
     
  25. kurtyboy

    kurtyboy Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Must be different material then. All the 3M stuff I've ever had over the years is silky smooth. It's what they sew onto high visibility vests and can be machine washed.
     
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  26. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    This stuff is fabric at least. it came in a tightly wrapped roll from someone who just threw it in an envelope. They said it was "3M Sew-on 8910" 1.5" They're on that famous auction site.
     
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  27. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Quantity: 1 yard (If you order more than one yard, the reflective trim will be one continuous strip).

    Also available is 1, 2 & 6 inch width on eBay

    Description:

    3M Scotchlite Reflective Material - 8910 Silver Fabric is composed of wide angle, exposed retro-reflective lenses bonded to a durable cloth backing (65% polyester 35% cotton).

    not adhesive "tape"

    Physical Performance:

    3M – 8910 silver fabric is certified to meet ANSI/ISEA 107-1999 level 2 retro reflective performance and EN 471 Class 2.

    Care and Maintenance:

    · Machine Wash

    · Only non-chlorine bleach when needed

    · Tumble dry low

    · Medium iron

    · Dry-clean, normal cycle
     
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  28. Mouse Vader

    Mouse Vader Active Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    If it was pricey I'd try for a refund on the grounds that it's not M3 & is shedding hazardous dust. My cheap stuff isn't at all grainy & like Kurtyboy's is smooth to the touch no irritation.
     
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  29. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Tom is this the stuff you use in your other thread?!
     
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  30. Dann

    Dann Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    So, best place to find the REAL stuff?
     
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  31. Mouse Vader

    Mouse Vader Active Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Proper scotchlite also appears to be made in China ;

    3m scotchlite reflective tape adhesive 580 series, 3m scotchlite reflective tape adhesive 580 series Manufacturers in LuLuSoSo.com - page 1

    so what I bought may be the same stuff just unbranded.

    Genuine scotchlight also seems to have 'scotchlite tm' printed on the back:

    3M 8910 Silver Fabric | 3M Scotchlite Reflective

    I've just ordered a small sample of genuine stuff so I can compare with my Chinese one. I'll update when it's here.

    Just be careful on fleabay to make sure it's marked properly & you should be fine.
     
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  32. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Just checked, my fabric strip is printed on the back with 3M Reflective Material at an angle, looks legit.
     
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  33. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I'm not sure I understand the differences between all those grey/silver types of 3M reflective fabric on their site. Does anyone? I definitely have 8910, up close it looks grainy but it is smooth.
     
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  34. Mouse Vader

    Mouse Vader Active Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I think the dif numbers relate to surface finish - material base - sticky or not etc. I must admit I didn't look too closely as they're confusing.

    Fabric should be polycotton mix so looks & feels like cotton. My Chinese stuff doesn't & is prob. plain polyester.

    Reflective Material
    is rather strange wording for me & sounds fake. I've come across ref. to scotchlite or M3 or combination of both. It's the irritating nature of the dust that bothers me. Haliwax's 8910 tape shed loads but he didn't get any irritation.

    (we still talking about the stuff that felt like cactus right?)
     
  35. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Yea,

    Just for kicks, I decided to use up the rest of my sample. I didn't rub it like I did before (the same pressure you'd use to sand something, it was to get the bubbles out and get it smooth ) and wasn't bothered at all. Its hard getting it to stick to a pole
    20190307_141734.jpg 20190307_141808.jpg
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2019
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  36. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I should also say the fabric logo matches the picture of the fabric logo on the 3M website
     
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  37. Mouse Vader

    Mouse Vader Active Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Maybe that much pressure & rubbing was making the beads act like sand paper on your hand. If normal handling is no problem & the logo matches as you say then it doesn't sound so bad.

    I'll be interested to see how that turns out compared to the pictures we have.
     
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  38. Dann

    Dann Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    So, "the same pressure you'd use to sand something" is a really relative phrase.

    I'm getting a little nitpicky here (and please don't take any offense, there's NONE intended, I promise!), but, you're not really supposed to use much pressure at all when sanding, you're supposed to let the grit of the paper do the cutting for you. If you're pressing down any more than to make good contact with what it is you're sanding, then you're applying too much pressure, and either need a new/fresh piece of sandpaper, or you need to move to a coarser grit. Or you need to re-teach your brain the correct method. (Which is something I'm constantly trying to do)

    I'm willing to bet that none of us gets a new sheet of sandpaper when we actually need to. I do it all the time. I have to remind myself, OUT LOUD, that I'm being an idiot and that the project/job/task would go much faster if I simply threw the scrap in my hand away and got a fresh one!

    I think I heard Adam Savage talk about that at least once, too. He's totally right. We're all guilty of it. It's not like it's all that expensive, so why in the heck do we insist on using that same dagummed worn out and folded over piece of sandpaper over and over again?!

    So anyway, I'm guessing you're talking about MORE pressure than is truly appropriate/recommended for sanding, and maybe more like the amount of pressure used when burnishing something. Or pushing air bubbles out from under a vinyl sticker/decal?

    Or am I totally wrong, and you meant exactly what you said? Hahahaha
     
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  39. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    no offense taken! I'm very guilty of that all the time.

    for this, I meant light sanding pressure. A more accurate description would be ... put your hands together, and squeeze them together a little to make that fart noise that we all made as a kid. I slid my hand down the blade with light pressure to get out any wrinkles or bubbles, Mouse Vader might be right, it could have very finely sliced up my hand. The fabric is very smooth at first glance, it almost looks waterproof. upon closer inspection you can see the granules. I used up all my fabric for this test blade so I can't image the back of the fabric, but I can image the stuff better, one sec.
     
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  40. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Here it is on the back of a couch in the sun

    Like I sais, it's a decently thick fabric that's sleek/slippery looking and feeling. That's why I was so surprised it hurt to rub it 20190307_164703.jpg 20190307_164809.jpg 20190307_164639.jpg 20190307_164657.jpg
     
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  41. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I'm going to wait for my girlfriend and her iphone to catch it, but the afternoon sun is streaming in through my living room window and the blade is catching it. looks kind of neat :)
     
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  42. Dann

    Dann Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Ha! Thanks for the clarification. And MAN, that's an ugly couch! ;) I'm kidding,I know nothing about stylish furniture.

    I've always wanted to make a blade like this, with the Scotchlite. I always thought it was tape, and only in the past couple years did I learn different!

    I always think about that old picture of the dude in the archives holding the ROTJ Vader Stunt, before the blade was chopped off.

    I remember first seeing that picture sometime around 1996. Who is that guy? Gus Lopez? Frank Cerney? Brandon? I feel like I read who it was once, long ago, I just cannot remember!


    EDIT: Also, "that fart sound you used to make when you were a kid". Take out the "used to" and "when you were a kid". I can still make myself (and other folks, too!) giggle when I do that.
     
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  43. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Hahahaha

    I think I still have that picture. I know, its a special feeling holding a reflective lightsaber, and thats why I'm doing this project. It excites me more than a light-up chassis would.

    *, can't find it - I did find a pic I'm posting to the OT thread.
     
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  44. Mouse Vader

    Mouse Vader Active Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    My 8910 sample arrived this morning. Looks just like yours & very dif. from my cheepy stuff. M3 has more stretch to it. I prefer the cheep stuff to M3 in terms reflectivity. M3 is much more silvery & grainy looking. Fabric is dif. enough to mean I'll have to get some for the balsa wood blades test (boo, more expense).

    Can you give a link to the fleabay listing please? As 1.5" wide is hard to find.

    DSC08677.JPG


    with flash.

    DSC08678.JPG


    now with shorter exposure (& flash).

    DSC08679.JPG


    fabrics.

    DSC08681.JPG


    Close up.

    DSC08683.JPG


    reflecting daylight.

    DSC08676.JPG
     
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  45. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    IMG_8575.jpg

    Seams like there was a small group of guys who got a tour back in 1991

    The dv6 kid can also be seen with HIC, and his buddy wearing Lebos head cpu in other pics

    Being in ‘91 they must have cut the blade off some time later to display the dv6
     
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  46. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Tom, and mouse I’m loving this fabric. I haven’t ordered any yet but seriously plan to

    How much heavier does it make the blade?

    Tom Does it roughly feel the same as your 3m tape covered blades?

    I only ask because with my Guinness legend the blade is to finicky, and has to be super balanced.. the heavier the blade the harder to balance
     
  47. kurtyboy

    kurtyboy Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I think it's more likely the blade was simply removed, but the rod was cut down as it was possibly as long as the Yuma stunt rod, and wouldn't have looked good on display.
     
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  48. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Could be
     
  49. vadermania

    vadermania Well-Known Member

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    Why do you think the blade was cut off? Perhaps it was just "unscrewed" from the metal pin sticking out of the shroud?
     
  50. vadermania

    vadermania Well-Known Member

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    What you said.
     
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