Lets talk all things Star Wars

[batguy]

If I was a billionaire I would commission some shots/fixes for ANH, but they would have to look period-correct.

Imagine an alternate timeline where George Lucas was given an extra 2 months and another $5 million bucks for the original production. Basically the same movie, but less corner-cutting and rushing on the details. That's the one I want.


Vader & Obi-Wan's duel? Yes, improve it. No, don't make it look like something from the prequels. Just bring it up to the level of ESB and ROTJ. Make it look like they had pro swordfighting stunt doubles for Guiness & Prowse, the Vader suit was more mobile/cool, and they weren't trying to baby the wooden lighsaber blades.

Mos Eisley? Yeah, it could have been bigger. But make it bigger with more real props/sets, glass matte shots, optical composites, stop-mo animated creatures, etc.

Luke's landspeeder and the vaseline blob? Don't make it look perfect, just make it look like the best hand-animated job that was possible back in the day.

 

[blewis17]

Seeing Fett was cool, but his look directly into the camera was stupid. Star Wars doesn't need to break the fourth wall. Han's cynicism walked that line between the realism of the world and balancing it with his sarcasm was the perfect blend to give the material some levity.

ESB Somehow got away with breaking the fourth wall perfectly with C-3PO on Hoth. It was quick/fast, and for some reason didn’t pull me out of the movie.

 

[Ron]

I've thought about getting the blurays, because I don't want to give any more money to Disney. But how much quality am I losing, if I don't get 4k?

You'll be losing some. How substantial it is I couldn't say. I haven't watched the 4k ones myself. I'd like to at some point just for comparison purposes if I can get a hold of a set somehow. Reviews I've watched range from it's a slight improvement over the blu ray to it's a significant improvement. It's really hard to see the difference unless you're actually watching it on your TV. The big thing you'll be missing out on is Dolby Atmos if that matters to you. The High Dynamic Range you get on 4k is also nice. When it comes to the prequels, I don't think you'll be losing much as it doesn't seem like they're much improved, especially ep. 2 & 3 which as you know were shot digitally and can't really be much better other than upscaling from 1080p. Considering how obsessed George was with pushing technology in filmmaking, it's odd he didn't account for how limited shooting digitally at the time was.

I think the ideal way to go with having the complete saga is download the TN1 4k restorations and buy the 2011 blu ray for the prequels & deleted scenes/documentaries/extras. I don't think any of the Disney made sets have all the supplemental material that 2011 set has.

 

[Psab keel]

I'm lost. When did 3PO break the fourth wall in Empire?

 

[ScourgiousJinx]

I'm lost. When did 3PO break the fourth wall in Empire?

On the way to the Falcon during the Hoth escape he turns to the camera and says "how typical" after the doors close behind Han and Leia. I always thought he was just complaining to himself out loud but some consider this is a 4th wall break. I doubt it was intended as such but have been wrong before.

 

[Psab keel]

He turns towards the camera, but to me it never felt like he was addressing the audience or looking out of the screen. I always took that as him turning aside and just grumbling as he always does. He also doesn't have eyes and it's not like you see them change focus the way a human would.

This is totally news to me that people ever considered this a 4th wall break. Threepio is always talking to himself too. I think that's why I never considered it a wall break when he just happened to turn to camera. Perhaps if he never complained and suddenly turned to camera to do it, that would stand out much, much, more.

 

[Ron]

Yeah, I was struggling to figure out which part with 3P0 is fourth wall breaking. I wouldn't consider that to be one at all.

 

[Inquisitor Peregrinus]

He also had to not be looking at the door for them to be able to re-open it and yank him through unawares.

 

[blewis17]

Yeah, I was struggling to figure out which part with 3P0 is fourth wall breaking. I wouldn't consider that to be one at all.

I've always felt is was a 4th wall break, and I can't unsee it.

 

[Treadwell]

*DROIDS!

"If they traced the robots here, they may have learned who they sold them to..."

 

[blewis17]

 

[ghostryder]

 

[Sluis Van Shipyards]

On the way to the Falcon during the Hoth escape he turns to the camera and says "how typical" after the doors close behind Han and Leia. I always thought he was just complaining to himself out loud but some consider this is a 4th wall break. I doubt it was intended as such but have been wrong before.

I'm pretty sure he's just talking to himself. More of his commentary on how droids are treated.

 

[Joek3rr]

You'll be losing some. How substantial it is I couldn't say. I haven't watched the 4k ones myself. I'd like to at some point just for comparison purposes if I can get a hold of a set somehow. Reviews I've watched range from it's a slight improvement over the blu ray to it's a significant improvement. It's really hard to see the difference unless you're actually watching it on your TV. The big thing you'll be missing out on is Dolby Atmos if that matters to you. The High Dynamic Range you get on 4k is also nice. When it comes to the prequels, I don't think you'll be losing much as it doesn't seem like they're much improved, especially ep. 2 & 3 which as you know were shot digitally and can't really be much better other than upscaling from 1080p. Considering how obsessed George was with pushing technology in filmmaking, it's odd he didn't account for how limited shooting digitally at the time was.

I think the ideal way to go with having the complete saga is download the TN1 4k restorations and buy the 2011 blu ray for the prequels & deleted scenes/documentaries/extras. I don't think any of the Disney made sets have all the supplemental material that 2011 set has.

All the reviews I've read, rave about the Dolby Atmos. There's a nice screenshot comparison for ESB.

Here's some interesting discussions I found.

https://www.reddit.com/r/hometheater/comments/fwy8xj

And another interesting comparison. Star Wars - Episode IV: A New Hope (Comparison: Blu-ray Edition (Fox) - 4K-Remastered Blu-ray (Disney)) - Movie-Censorship.com.

 

[Master Boda]

I've always felt is was a 4th wall break, and I can't unsee it.

Same here,it was the only time I felt pity for C-3PO.

 

[Joek3rr]

Thought it might be fun to see a few more comparisons. While you can't see the increased resolution, the difference in color grading is very interesting.

Then to show the difference in the resolution. Make sure you zoom in on these.

 

[Master Boda]

All the reviews I've read, rave about the Dolby Atmos. There's a nice screenshot comparison for ESB.

Here's some interesting discussions I found.

https://www.reddit.com/r/hometheater/comments/fwy8xj

And another interesting comparison. Star Wars - Episode IV: A New Hope (Comparison: Blu-ray Edition (Fox) - 4K-Remastered Blu-ray (Disney)) - Movie-Censorship.com.

I can’t speak for the 4K but after watching the Blu-ray I was amazed at how clean it was. I noticed a lot of things I had never picked up before,at least check it out as I don’t think you will be disapointed.

 

[Solo4114]

I was re-watching ANH (SE on D+) the other day and I have a Star Wars hot take.

After watching the Tatooine scenes I realized where I think George Lucas went wrong with the SE re-edit. In the SE edit, Lucas made 2 major changes to scenes with Han Solo; he changed Han shooting Greedo and he added the Jabba scene in DB94.

In many interviews Lucas says he changed the Han/Greedo scene because he didn't want Han to seem like a cold-blooded killer and instead, after the edit, Han shoots Greedo in self-defense after Greedo shoots at Han first. Obviously this change did not go over well with fans who, understandably, know why Han shot Greedo (based on the dialog between Han and Greedo)

With the addition on the Jabba scene, many fans felt the scene is unnecessary because all the dialog between Han and Jabba only re-hashes the same story points literally just discussed a few minutes early between Han and Greedo.

My hot take is.... if I had the power to influence and re-edit ANH for George Lucas back in 1997 for the Special Edition I would have added the Jabba scene and removed the Greedo scene and killed 2 birds with 1 stone. I would have removed the Han-shooting-Greedo action per George's new outlook as this eliminates the issue altogether and moves the dialog and story points about Han owing Jabba money out of the Cantina and into DB94.

Yeah, it's a wonky re-edit. I get why Lucas did it in '97. I don't get why he kept it beyond there. In '97, the point was to demonstrate how kewl his new CGI could look and to work as a test-run for Jabba in TPM (and maybe to juice building the wireframe for the model). Beyond that, though, the scene is entirely duplicative and was from the outset. It exists in the Brian Daley radio adaptation for NPR, too, and that was where I first encountered the actual dialogue and thought "Wait, why are we doing this? We literally heard all of this 2 seconds ago." It's just totally unnecessary from a narrative perspective. The only reason to include it is to add another creature effect.

But, I think I'd still keep the Greedo scene. Your idea's interesting, but I think the Greedo scene serves the story better. Plus you'd have to deal with "Why'd you have to go and fry poor Greedo like that?" That line would need to come out as well. But with the original version, Han gets a character arc, Jabba is a far off influence like the Emperor (mentioned, felt, but never seen), and you move Han out of the cantina.

It almost feels like Lucas wanted to include it so you could see Han leave the cantina, enter the hangar, and then that "explains" why he's there when Luke and Ben show up, even though it's unnecessary. It's just one of those "kill your darlings" things. He may love the scene, but it's unnecessary and the better version is the original. Not because it's the original, but because it provides the better story, especially as part 1 of a 3 part tale.

 

[Joek3rr]

You guys are going to love this! I really enjoy EC Henry's head canon for the obscure ships.

 

[batguy]

Yeah, it's a wonky re-edit. I get why Lucas did it in '97. I don't get why he kept it beyond there. In '97, the point was to demonstrate how kewl his new CGI could look and to work as a test-run for Jabba in TPM (and maybe to juice building the wireframe for the model). Beyond that, though, the scene is entirely duplicative and was from the outset. It exists in the Brian Daley radio adaptation for NPR, too, and that was where I first encountered the actual dialogue and thought "Wait, why are we doing this? We literally heard all of this 2 seconds ago." It's just totally unnecessary from a narrative perspective. The only reason to include it is to add another creature effect.

But, I think I'd still keep the Greedo scene. Your idea's interesting, but I think the Greedo scene serves the story better. Plus you'd have to deal with "Why'd you have to go and fry poor Greedo like that?" That line would need to come out as well. But with the original version, Han gets a character arc, Jabba is a far off influence like the Emperor (mentioned, felt, but never seen), and you move Han out of the cantina.

It almost feels like Lucas wanted to include it so you could see Han leave the cantina, enter the hangar, and then that "explains" why he's there when Luke and Ben show up, even though it's unnecessary. It's just one of those "kill your darlings" things. He may love the scene, but it's unnecessary and the better version is the original. Not because it's the original, but because it provides the better story, especially as part 1 of a 3 part tale.

IIRC once the decision was made to cut the Jabba scene (in 1976-77), they expanded the subtites & stuff in the Greedo scene to include that exposition. So there was never a point in the ANH production where both scenes (as we know them) were intended to be in there together. The combo first became a thing in 1997.

GL says he intended to insert a creature effect over the Jabba actor in 1976 and they ran out of resources. But the existing footage was definitely not filmed that way. The actor was in costume, the camera moves freely, Harrison walks in front of him, etc.

I don't recall ever seeing any concept art (dating back to ANH) for Jabba as a creature. IMO that's telling. GL must have been in the late stages of the movie before he went with that idea.