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HeartBlade

Sr Member
That's a lie. Pretty sure I told you that a few posts back. JJ never wrote a script for 8. He says that he and Lawrence Kasdan had some ideas. And that the direction that Rian went was very much what they were thinking. Greg Grunburg, said that JJ told him that he loved Rian's script so much, that he wished he was directing episode 8.

So Daisy Ridley is a liar?
Not that's not point of her character. The point of her character is that you can be what you want, no matter where you come from. Your past, whether that's being a nobody, it being the granddaughter of the most evil man in the galaxy. Your past doesn't define who you are, unless you let it. The whole of this trilogy is about Rey journey of self identification and self worth.
Having self identified as a nobody is very different from being the grand daughter of the big bad genius.

Mastering one's emotions is not even close to being similar to Rey accepting and making peace with the notion that she is come from nothing. And you don't see her having mastered her emotions. In fact it's quite the opposite. Her emotions get the better of her on numerous occasions in episode 9. Which occurs over the time span of year, just stop with several days to weeks crap.
Time gap between 8 and 9 is about a year genius.

Meanwhile, time gap between 6 and 7 is 30 years. So in 30 years, give or take a couple, Luke is still unable to master his emotions despite his continued training as a jedi master. Meanwhile, Rey is able to come to terms with being a nobody and so needs additional internal conflict in 1 years time. That is what you are telling me.

you are also telling me that having your entire self-identity and self-worth be questioned is easier to control and get over that controlling your emotions to not strike down your ne

This, still is not a good comparison. In mystery film,(not a novel, two very different mediums) we do not know who the culprit is. And the film reveals who that is. However Palpatine is not someone who must be revealed to us as the culprit. That was already done in the OT and the PT. He's not a character that is new to us, or what he is. He is a very well established prior. To reintroduce him in such a manner, would be redundant, and altogether unnecessary. Revealing, or confirming for some, at the end is perfectly acceptable. Though I do believe it would gone over better if that had been done in the film itself rather then the trailer. Imagine going in blind and. It not knowing about him at all. Such a chilling revelation.
Lol except Palpatine was dead. Vader/Anakin meant to bring the end of the sith? Ring a bell? Thrown down a reactor shaft in a death star which then exploded? If an old character that was initially written off as dead suddenly comes back, there better be a good explanation. If Mace Windu suddenly turns up alive, people will call BS and ask questions because he was assumed dead.

and thanks for ignoring film examples like Sixth Sense which gave multiple examples of good foreshadowing. Or Dark Knight rises where the escapee was actually a girl and thus not Bane but Talia. Or hints in the words Eli speaks in Book of Eli before he reveals his condition. Or Christian Bale actually acting as 2 slightly different people in the prestige and the blatant hints that become obvious after the reveal.

Each film has introduced, save Revenge of the Sith, something new about the Force. Force visions are nothing new, in the films. And items and locations often trigger those visions. This is both the case in Legends and Canon. See characters like Cal Kestis, and Quinlan Vos. Having someone such as Rey, strong in the Force as her, coming in contact with such a Force filled item, with such history as the Skywalker lightsaber, is bound to lead to something trippy.
So you are still relying on legends to make your case. If we are referring to the games as canon, is starkiller the strongest jedi second only to Anakin?
Finn was the Luke character of the film? Hahaha! Yeah no....Rey was always the Luke character in the story. I don't where this delusion is coming from.
Lol you have got to learn to read and comprehend. I state that Finn is a main character in TFA, like Trailer opens with Finn. Finn is the first character we meet in the movie. The movie starts from his perspective. Just because Finn doesnt have force powers doesnt automatically not make him a main character.

Finn is also the one initiating the action that drives the story in TFA. Its his initiative to leave the first order and free Poe that kicks off the story. He goes searching for BB that Rey just happened to pick up. He gets Rey’s help with Rey supporting Finn. He is the one that gets BB to the resistance. He is the one that agrees to join the rescue mission. He is the one with the lightsaber and engages Nines and later Kylo Ren. Finn is the active protagonist in TFA. Now see how different he is in TLJ and RoS where things happen to him.

i also mention dual main characters, that Finn is as prominent as Rey in TFA. Rey takes a more passive role, not wanting to leave Jakku, getting captured by Kylo Ren and being the damsel. Rejecting the call. Its only when she starts to tap into the force and use mind control and later calls the lightsaber dos Rey start to take the mantle of protagonist (hence the surprise when she gets the lightsaber to duel Kylo Ren).

Funny how im also not the only one to notice this.


Finn has a similar arc over three films.


TFA- Finn just wants to get away from the First Order. But his friendship with Rey brings him back. He goes to Starkilller base for her, not the Resistance, not the galaxy, but for her. He fights Kylo to protect Rey.

TLJ- literally opens with Finn asking. "Where's Rey." That's his focus for most of the movie. Saving the fleet, so when Rey returns she had somewhere safe to be. Everything he does is for Rey. He has yet care about the galaxy at large, or yo officially join the cause. At the end of the film he does, seeing how the downtrodden look and are inspired by the Resistance, even if they are just children. And seeing DJ, live free don't join. And Finn sees where that mentality leads to. So when he's called a scum, he replies with "Rebel scum." He's joined the cause. This idea that he has reverted back to being a coward, is complete lie, and has no basis in the film.

TROS- Finn's ending is not to dissimilar to Han's. And the fact you are unwilling to acknowledge that FACT, is telling. Now a member of the Resistance, he takes the leads the fight as a general. The man that would have run away, now charges headlong, leading others, in the fight against tyranny.
you forget to mention that in RoS, he doesnt take any action himself. Erase Finn from the story and does anything really change? If no, Finn isnt even a secondary character. Han is the driving force in RotJ to get the gang to save him and show off how much Luke has grown. Han does take a backseat but he leads the ground force while Lando leads the air force and Luke confronts Vader. The weight and impact on the story are completely different.

I know you love the Sequel trilogy but stop trying to debate the story on story structure merits. You get it wrong pretty much every time.
 

alienscollection.com

Legendary Member
starwarsdream.jpeg
 

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harrisonp

Sr Member
I swear I've been here before....

So what would you guys all like to see in a post TROS world?

I personally think a large (100+ year) time jump and then broad strokes adaptation of the NJO era would be interesting.
 

Psab keel

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
I'd like to see someone come along and create something new that wasn't Star Wars, but had the same type of cultural impact. Plus it would be preferable that it didn't originate from a pre-existing property and was initially intended to be a film series, rather than based on a book, though a well made book adaptation into a franchise wouldn't be too bad if it was interesting enough.

I love Star Wars and I think there is life in the props and costumes but as a story I'm not much interested in it to want to see any new content.
 

harrisonp

Sr Member
I’m with you 100% on the “make new” point. I’m reading the Ketty Jay series right now (steampunk air pirates etc) and it’s exactly the kind of thing I would rather see existing in the space Star Wars occupies.
 

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Usagi Pilgrim

Sr Member
That and Ben wasn't having a bad dream. Luke was seeing what could be the future.
...& That was the point of that meme.

Vader ABSOLUTELY slaughtered untold numbers, but Luke was able to 'see the good in him'.

Ben had done NOTHING, but was being seduced by the Dark Side. He succumbed to it, granted, but where was Luke's sense of the GOOD that was evidently always there in Ben?

Luke in the OT was ALWAYS presented as the picture of optimism... From dreaming of getting away from home, 3 guys 2 droids & a Wookie saving a girl from an Imperial prison,the small fighters taking down the battle station, receiving training from a lost Jedi master, saving his friends without all his training, confronting his biggest enemy, saving his buddy from a gangster's fortress, & finally ridding the Galaxy from the source of evil & rescuing his father from said darkness.

He recognized that there was a need to train Force-sensitives to basically be Jedi, as opposed to falling to the Dark Side, & he took on that responsibility, but then when he sensed that ONE special student slipping, it seemed like a lifetime of optimism that had been repeatedly proven true was forgotten, & the worst part... What he felt was ultimately wrong.


Ben saved Luke's most powerful student & was instrumental in destroying what Luke couldn't.

That's my biggest problem & what I think others mean when they say it was written by one who didn't know Luke Skywalker.
 

Joek3rr

Sr Member
...& That was the point of that meme.

Vader ABSOLUTELY slaughtered untold numbers, but Luke was able to 'see the good in him'.

Ben had done NOTHING, but was being seduced by the Dark Side. He succumbed to it, granted, but where was Luke's sense of the GOOD that was evidently always there in Ben?

Luke in the OT was ALWAYS presented as the picture of optimism... From dreaming of getting away from home, 3 guys 2 droids & a Wookie saving a girl from an Imperial prison,the small fighters taking down the battle station, receiving training from a lost Jedi master, saving his friends without all his training, confronting his biggest enemy, saving his buddy from a gangster's fortress, & finally ridding the Galaxy from the source of evil & rescuing his father from said darkness.

He recognized that there was a need to train Force-sensitives to basically be Jedi, as opposed to falling to the Dark Side, & he took on that responsibility, but then when he sensed that ONE special student slipping, it seemed like a lifetime of optimism that had been repeatedly proven true was forgotten, & the worst part... What he felt was ultimately wrong.


Ben saved Luke's most powerful student & was instrumental in destroying what Luke couldn't.

That's my biggest problem & what I think others mean when they say it was written by one who didn't know Luke Skywalker.
And that was Luke's immediate conclusion after the revelation? That there was still good in his father? Or did it take him time to come to that point?

Yeah, no. Luke is not ALWAYS presented as the picture of optimism. Quite the opposite. He's extremely pessimistic, up until ROTJ. And even then, Luke's initial reaction is to always, quit, give up. It takes him time to come around.
 

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JoeG

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Yeah, such an optimist. Like that time Yoda asked Luke to lift his X-wing out of the swamp and Luke said it was impossible. Then, even after Yoda shows him it's not impossible, Luke still doesn't believe it. So much optimism.
 

ALLEY

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
I swear...some of the defenders of Disney Star Wars, in this thread, have got to be secret members of the Lucasfilm Story Group.

To see someone park oneself, almost exclusively, in this thread and then spend hours and hours arguing against every critical observation made regarding the Sequel Trilogy is like watching a parent instinctively running to the defense of their child.
 
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