Lets talk all things Star Wars

[Joek3rr]

Yeah me too. Kind of funny but when I was a very little kid, we had a VHS tape that we watched endlessly that one of my uncles recorded off the TV, or maybe it was a VCR to VCR copy I'm not sure. But the beginning got cutoff somehow and it didn't start until halfway through the crawl so I never knew about "A New Hope" in the title. He wrote "Star Wars" on the tape, my toys said Star Wars, everybody I knew called it Star Wars. The storybook I used to check out from my elementary school library said Star Wars. On TV it's called Star Wars. It's Star Wars.

Then my parents bought me that early 90's box set with the fold out sides that I'm sure all of us still have and "whoa what's this 'A NEW HOPE'?". I felt like I made a major discovery haha. But even after that I never called it ANH or heard anyone else call it that. I feel like ANH caught on in '97 with the SE.

To be fair, I don't think it was retitled 'A New Hope' until '97. Prior to that it was just Star Wars. Though funny the theatrical poster made for the '97 re-release didn't say 'A New Hope on it.'

Come to think about it. I wonder how many people went 'huh?' When watching ESB for the first time in '80 and seeing "Episode V" go across the screen. Considering that 'Star Wars' wasn't called Episode IV yet.

 

[Psab keel]

If I recall, the subtitle of Episode 4: A New Hope was added to the re-release in like 1979 before Empire came out? Something like that. It was added not too long after the film first premiered when the movie was a hit and George wasn't worried about getting his sequels made. I think the only reason Fox didn't let him do it in the first place is because they thought it would be too confusing and the audience would wonder if they'd missed 1,2, and 3. Though the idea of catching the story 4 episodes in was something common to the serials that he was paying homage to.

 

[Solos blaster]

OT fan here, born in '79, have limited memories of seeing ROTJ in the theater in '83, called ANH, "Star Wars" all the way up until I got started on message boards in '99 and started seeing ANH used and SW being "moved" to the all encompassing title of the franchise and not so just the movie title anymore, particularly in the post-TPM world. I'm not afraid to say I liked Rogue One lol.

I hated Finn(after his escape with Poe) in TFA and liked Rey. I bought and positively debated(go through the post release TFA thread), on Rey's skills for the most part in TFA. In TLJ, I grew to like Finn and probably would've liked him even more if he hadn't been robbed of his sacrifice by Rose. Lost interest in Rey with her INTESNSE growth in Force abilities with almost no training.

And here's why:
I feel as though this "Living Force" concept is killing the mystery of The Force in the way the midichlorians killed it in the PT. This idea that The Force can "will things" to happen or gives people innate and immeasurable means to accomplish their will....frankly, I find it kind of disturbing. Mostly, because it destroys the person's ability to choose, but also because IMO, it destroys any need for good character growth in storytelling. Any incredible feat or ability a person performs becomes, "Well the Force wanted it to happen", or more sickly:

Writer 1: "We need something really awesome to happen."
Writer 2: "Lets have XXXX lift a sinking island from a river and save all the inhabitants at the last minute!"
Writer 1: "Yea that sounds awesome, but that person doesn't know how to do that or even show the ability or have trained to do it."
Writer 2: "We'll just say the Force willed it, or have it implied that the Force wanted it to happen."
Writer 1: "That'll work."

It all just feels like a contrived, short cut to get from A to B.

I feel like the biggest problem with the ST was the inclusion of Luke, Han, and Leia. Lucasfilm wanted it, the Fans for sure wanted it, but the Crew didn't know how to successfully use them without overshadowing the new cast. With the revelation of not wanting to include Luke in much screen time showing that they didn't know what to do, they should've either:

1. Use all three OT heroes(together) for the first film(even keep Han dying), then have them fade into the background(or die), as the trilogy progresses while the new cast steps up more and more with each film. I mean, FFS if you're going to blatantly rip off ANH, go all out and use the characters to the fullest too. Use up all the nostalgia you can and THEN move on with the new cast.

OR

2. Do not use the OT characters at all and go 50-100+ years into the future with a fresh start. Personally, I think this would've been the best course of action, considering the ages of the OT cast(and with the loss of Carrie Fisher left them unable to continue as Leia). It also leaves the state of the Galaxy and the Republic/First Order easier to explain or accept it as things are versus it looking like **** and having to read ancillary materials to find out what happened during such a short time frame(and it still sucks).

Surprisingly though, I can get behind high levels of microscopic symbiotes that would increase a person's physical abilities/reactions that increase both organisms' chance for survival. *shrugs*

Sorry, all that came from me just wanting to say I liked Rogue One lol.

 

[Joek3rr]

If I recall, the subtitle of Episode 4: A New Hope was added to the re-release in like 1979 before Empire came out? Something like that. It was added not too long after the film first premiered when the movie was a hit and George wasn't worried about getting his sequels made. I think the only reason Fox didn't let him do it in the first place is because they thought it would be too confusing and the audience would wonder if they'd missed 1,2, and 3. Though the idea of catching the story 4 episodes in was something common to the serials that he was paying homage to.

Wookieepedia says the episode number and title were added for the April 10, 1981 release. Cool!

 

[Joek3rr]

So I hope I don't open a can of worms.

If I do....Sorry I guess?


So last night I'm doing my workout and looking for something to watch. I decide to watch a review of TLJ that YouTube has been recommending for months and months and months.....and last night I capitulated and watched it.

During the review, I reminded of something I find rather interesting. Obviously many fans weren't too thrilled about Luke. But I was reminded that being frustrated with Rian or TLJ for this is misplaced. As Rian took the hand he was dealt with and wrote a Luke that could still be the hero. (8:30 is the timestamp for this part if you'd care to watch just that section.) If you don't care to watch it, I'll explain his thoughts.

The main reason Luke is on that island because he believes that he and Jedi are bad for the galaxy. He believes so strongly and he's closed himself off to the Force, and he scuttled his X-wing. If you take issue with this, then what's the alternative? TFA clearly set up that Luke had disappeared, and people were trying to find him. Given this, you have to ask yourself, 'why is Luke here?' He[Stephen] gives a couple of optional reasons.
1) is he hiding?
Obviously no, Luke is not a coward, and that is far more out of character. And what would he be hiding from, the First Order hadn't risen to prominence yet nor are they public yet, so he isn't hiding from them. So that doesn't work
2) is he just sad, bummed out about Kylo? That's part of the reason he's there. But if that were the only reason, having him sulk on that island without trying to do anything to correct it. That doesn't work either.
3) is he being held there against his will? That would make Luke out to be an incredibly weak Jedi. Plus he could have just telepathically asked Leia for help. So that doesn't work either.

So with those 3 things out of the way Luke must:
1)Be closed off from the Force. Or he would come off as seriously callous or cowardly, as he would have sensed the death of Han, and rise of the First Order, the destruction of Hosnian system. And to have Luke sensing those things and still not come and help or at a minimum call out to Leia and ask for a Star Wars Uber.

2) And he needs a really good reason to do that. And the only way that works is if he sees his use of the Force as a negative and his intervention on the behalf of the galaxy, also a negative.

So if you really have a problem with Luke in TLJ, your problem isn't with Rian and TLJ. It's with JJ Abrams, Lawrence Kasdan, Michael Arndt, and George Lucas. Your problem is with the decision to have Luke missing, at the beginning of this story. Rian was just given the responsibility of explaining why. Not an easy burden.

 

[Halliwax]

 

[Joek3rr]

View attachment 1038105

I just go where the evidence takes me.

Really, everyone that dislikes Luke in the ST. You should be paying attention. When you go after Rian or TLJ for "ruining" Luke, all your doing is shooting the messenger. And discrediting yourselves. Give credit/blame where credit/blame is due. I'm not trying to rob you of feelings towards what they did, I'm trying to help you. To see another side, another perspective, and heck maybe even help your arguments at the same time.

 

[Psab keel]

I take issue with the entire sequel trilogy and had my reservations about the story told in TFA even when it came out so no its not entirely Rian and TLJ that I have a problem with but there were other ways he could have told his story. My argument has largely been was this trilogy even necessary? Wouldn't it have been better to not make sequels but tell a whole new story set in another time or different part of the galaxy?

Plus I've addressed on multiple occasions how Rian could have handled the mess of Luke being on that island without going in the direction he did. I really don't feel like retreading it though because it doesn't change anything. The film is out and we got what we got. Love it or hate it, it's over.

Why do we keep going over the same topics again and again? Joek3rr I get that you love this movie, but you don't have to convince anyone to change their mind. People are going to bash this trilogy no matter what you say. And people are going to love it no matter what I say.

How many threads have devolved over the subject matter in this movie and what has ANY of it accomplished? We are at an impasse. Let's just move on, shall we? And find common ground on something else.

 

[Halliwax]

My issue is you won’t let this go... we all get you love TLJ, you don’t need to promote this every single day

I love pizza.. you don’t see me bumping threads saying how great it tastes and how much I love it

Beating a dead horse man, it’s just getting old

 

[Psab keel]

Which is why I mentioned yesterday that I'm glad I didn't start talking about it on my YouTube channel because we've had almost two years of fans ranting about it. I didn't want to add myself to the chorus and just feel like let's move on already.

I acknowledge that I am guilty of arguing about it, but it's largely because we keep going over the same things and I'm tired of having to explain my position over and over.

We've all made up our minds one way or another. Shall we move on please?

 

[Bigdaddy]

It's subjective OPINIONS, there's no evidence to follow. I could post videos about why TLJ sucks all day long, it doesn't make me "right".
Personally I don't bother with review videos anyway. I'm perfectly capable of forming my own opinion about something inane as a peice of entertainment without needing to justify my view because someone on YouTube agrees with me.
It's just an echo chamber.
FWIW: I love pizza too!

 

[Joek3rr]

I take issue with the entire sequel trilogy and had my reservations about the story told in TFA even when it came out so no its not entirely Rian and TLJ that I have a problem with but there were other ways he could have told his story. My argument has largely been was this trilogy even necessary? Wouldn't it have been better to not make sequels but tell a whole new story set in another time or different part of the galaxy?

Plus I've addressed on multiple occasions how Rian could have handled the mess of Luke being on that island without going in the direction he did. I really don't feel like retreading it though because it doesn't change anything. The film is out and we got what we got. Love it or hate it, it's over.

Why do we keep going over the same topics again and again? Joek3rr I get that you love this movie, but you don't have to convince anyone to change their mind. People are going to bash this trilogy no matter what you say. And people are going to love it no matter what I say.

How many threads have devolved over the subject matter in this movie and what has ANY of it accomplished? We are at an impasse. Let's just move on, shall we? And find common ground on something else.

My issue is you won’t let this go... we all get you love TLJ, you don’t need to promote this every single day

I love pizza.. you don’t see me bumping threads saying how great it tastes and how much I love it

Beating a dead horse man, it’s just getting old

I apologize for always bringing this stuff up. I just saw this video last night and it got my little grey cells going.

Plus there's always new people dropping by, that may want to talk about it.

 

[Bigdaddy]

I apologize for always bringing this stuff up. I just saw this video last night and it got my little grey cells going.

View attachment 1038114

Plus there's always new people dropping by, that may want to talk about it.

You do know there is a thread to specifically discuss TLJ right?

 

[BipeFlyer]

My issue is you won’t let this go... we all get you love TLJ, you don’t need to promote this every single day

I love pizza.. you don’t see me bumping threads saying how great it tastes and how much I love it

Beating a dead horse man, it’s just getting old

Dammit Halliwax, I'm tired of hearing about how much you love pizza. [emoji6]

 

[Frogfreak]

Mmmmmmm!!! Pizza is amazing though!

 

[Frogfreak]

I love pizza.

Who else loves them some pizza? And what type is your favorite?

 

[Halliwax]

Lol what the hell have I done

 

[Frogfreak]

Lol what the hell have I done

View attachment 1038153

What the heck? You must really "love" your pizza!

 

[Bigdaddy]

Who else loves them some pizza? And what type is your favorite?

Mon calamari!

 

[Frogfreak]

(Gasp) someone hide admiral ackbar!