Lets talk all things Star Wars

[Ron]

I mean at least they don't make me sick when I think about them (looking at you Batman v Superman).

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but Chris Terrio, who wrote the BvS screenplay, cowrote the TROS screenplay.

 

[Psab keel]

BvS was awful. Just awful. Hopefully JJ had more input that Terro did.

 

[Joek3rr]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but Chris Terrio, who wrote the BvS screenplay, cowrote the TROS screenplay.

He also did Justice League.....which wasn't bad......

To be honest though, i think BvS is all on Zack Snyder.

 

[sztriki]

Finally got it, done and dusted. Harmy's despecialized, neat package and to me very importantly contains the original Hungarian dubs that are not too great but the ones I grew up with. Flicked through the movies, pretty decent picture and audio and the Hungarian voices just gave me a massive blast from the past. See later if TN1 comes out with the whole trilogy and maybe I can transfer the audio tracks and make a similar set. Until then (and prob until later) I'm really happy with these.

And I think it's time these go in the bin...

 

[Bigdaddy]

View attachment 1059707

Finally got it, done and dusted. Harmy's despecialized, neat package and to me very importantly contains the original Hungarian dubs that are not too great but the ones I grew up with. Flicked through the movies, pretty decent picture and audio and the Hungarian voices just gave me a massive blast from the past. See later if TN1 comes out with the whole trilogy and maybe I can transfer the audio tracks and make a similar set. Until then (and prob until later) I'm really happy with these.

And I think it's time these go in the bin...
View attachment 1059708

I love how the "new" box doesn't have ANH on it. My Harmy versions are on a hard drive, seeing those makes me want to transfer them to discs and print the covers just so they have a presence on the shelf.

 

[Bigdaddy]

Happy birthday Inquisitor Peregrinus it's a beautiful day in the PNW, hope you're enjoying it!

 

[Inquisitor Peregrinus]

Just spending the day putting out figurative brushfires, so yay.

Also, on the subject of screenwriters... They often don't have the power over the story people attribute to them. They can suggest, but ultimately the person who got the whole thing rolling tends to have final say, whether that's the director or producer or studio suits or what. The biggest example of this I can point to is John Logan. He wrote the screenplay for Star Trek: Nemesis. That movie has a couple good moments, but overall is dreck. The very next film he wrote was the Last Samurai, which is one of the less egregiously inaccurate historical fictions I've seen and still makes me cry in a good way every time I see it. He was the same. The people he was working for were vastly different.

 

[vader45]

Interesting video. I don't agree with most of it, but enjoyed it. Art is subjective, so I'm glad he was able to pull out some stuff like this and enjoy the movie for it. However, I really doubt half of the themes he is explaining were actually intended to be part of the film. Rey and Luke had egos? No way, Luke was blatantly self-loathing. Poe and Kylo yes, but not Rey or Luke. Among the themes that I do believe were included, I found them way too cliche to be contributing any meaningful commentary, and I mean this especially for the ridiculously oversimplified references to war-profiteering.

I also see this argument a lot that those who didn't like TLJ wanted something familiar whereas those who enjoyed it supposedly appreciated how it was different. I can't get behind this at all. I wanted something different, and I've wanted it since Disney took over. Yet some of the things that peeved me most about TLJ were all the blatant ripoffs of previous Star Wars movies. I saw very little that was new or creative in TLJ.

The worst ripoff was of the ROTJ throne room scene. Kylo/Vader kills Snoke/Emperor while Snoke/Emperor nearly kills Rey/Luke during which they observe a space battle taking place outside a window. Even the dialogue was absurdly similar with the talk of "fulfill your destiny" and all that. AT-AT's attacking a rebel/resistance base on a white planet with speeders trying to defend it? That was there. Dark side cave vision on a secluded planet during Jedi training in the second act of a three act story before the trainee runs off to save her friends? That was also there.... At least we had the first ever high speed chase in space....

The overall plot is a rehash of ESB. The hero goes off on another planet to train while the others are running away from the bad guys. And the battle of crait as you said is battle of Hoth. It's just at the end of the film.

 

[Joek3rr]

The overall plot is a rehash of ESB. The hero goes off on another planet to train while the others are running away from the bad guys. And the battle of crait as you said is battle of Hoth. It's just at the end of the film.

The battle at the end of the film, for me anyways. Makes it more like ATOC. But that's just me.

 

[NeoRutty]

I'm still not sure how much to bug him, but I just found out the guy I've been working with the last 2 years has worked on the original trilogy.

I was at a lunch with a bunch of people to talk to the guy who runs development at the company we work for. At one point he goes, "well, if you need to know anything, talk to 'W', he's been doing this since Star Wars"...

He keeps talking, but I'm sitting across from the guy (at the end of the table) ... I'm like "Wait what? Did you really work on Star Wars?"

"Well Empire and Jedi... When I was hired my first job was to add "A New Hope" to the opening crawl...."

*drops food out of open mouth*

"You were at pinewoods?"

"yes"

"What did you do?"

"I was production... optical effects miniatures... bunch of stuff"

...

"props?"

"no..."

At this point it was clear I was going to start distracting from the talk we were supposed to be getting...so I left it at...

"oh... well you're my new hero... expect to hear from me later"

Ha

 

[Joek3rr]

Well yeah I agree. My analogy wasn't meant to suggest that Star Wars should emulate modern warfare to a T because like you said then you'd have spacecraft firing at each other from a thousand miles away and that wouldn't be very exciting to watch although Star Trek does it well. But I could see dogfighting still being necessary in the futuristic setting of Star Wars because light fighters appear to be faster (edit: I should say more importantly they're more maneuverable} than projectiles so lining up behind them and hitting them with cannon fire is your only option.

I think if they had just simply replaced the SF17s with Y-wings, it would've worked better but they wanted that scene of the sister releasing the bombs. Anyway it looks like we've exhausted the topic lol. We'll just have to agree to disagree on that one.

The genesis of that scene is actually pretty cool. Or at least I think it is.


So Rian is at Skywalker Ranch. Waiting for a meeting. If I recall this was his first time at the Ranch. And he's perusing the library and comes across this book

And Rian knows how George imitated WW2 films and documentaries for space ship stuff. So Rian decides right there and then that his film, inspired by the book would show the first heavy bomber in Star Wars. Anyways I thought that was kinda cool.

I heard the ideas that Y-wings would be better. But would they? I mean they're still slow, lack maneuverability, would still have to fly in formation, and still have to get fairly close. And you would need a lot of them. According to Legends the BTL-A4 Y-wing carries 20 proton bombs. Whereas the SF17 carries 1,048 proton bombs. You would need 52.4 Y-wings to carry the same amount as one SF17.

But what do I know, I'm most surely biased. As I love WW2 bombers, so anything similar is just awesome!

 

[ConvergencePro]

To quote RLM
"One thing that should be noted here. It seems like Rian Johnson is a pretty good guy. Everyone had nothing but nice things to say about him... He liked to laugh, and maybe he was just a little bit nervous to be working on such a big production... He also just wanted to write a good script and make a movie that was unexpected. Maybe a little refreshing? A different take on StarWars.. And for that I give him respect..
The problem was that he failed spectacularly at it on every level."

And Rian knows how George imitated WW2 films and documentaries for space ship stuff. So Rian decides right there and then that his film, inspired by the book would show the first heavy bomber in Star Wars. Anyways I thought that was kinda cool.

I heard the ideas that Y-wings would be better. But would they? I mean they're still slow, lack maneuverability, would still have to fly in formation, and still have to get fairly close. And you would need a lot of them. According to Legends the BTL-A4 Y-wing carries 20 proton bombs. Whereas the SF17 carries 1,048 proton bombs. You would need 52.4 Y-wings to carry the same amount as one SF17.

But what do I know, I'm most surely biased. As I love WW2 bombers, so anything similar is just awesome!

So again this is a prime example of good in theory and bad in execution. There's nothing wrong with wanting to emulate a WW2 bombing run in SW but it needs to be done in a realistic and believable way within the universe. Those ships being as unbelievably slow and tin can as they are with such other advanced tech around them was utterly bizarre to watch. Especially when we have the already mentioned Y-wings and B-wings. It already feels weird the resistance are seemingly using slightly upgraded 40+ year old tech when their government was the one in charge for at least 30 of those years (we all know this was done for nostalgia and nothing more) and now you introduce bombers that feel even more outdated than the ships that were outdated in the OT?? It's absolutely strange

 

[Psab keel]

I'm still not sure how much to bug him, but I just found out the guy I've been working with the last 2 years has worked on the original trilogy.

I was at a lunch with a bunch of people to talk to the guy who runs development at the company we work for. At one point he goes, "well, if you need to know anything, talk to 'W', he's been doing this since Star Wars"...

He keeps talking, but I'm sitting across from the guy (at the end of the table) ... I'm like "Wait what? Did you really work on Star Wars?"

"Well Empire and Jedi... When I was hired my first job was to add "A New Hope" to the opening crawl...."

*drops food out of open mouth*

"You were at pinewoods?"

"yes"

"What did you do?"

"I was production... optical effects miniatures... bunch of stuff"

...

"props?"

"no..."

At this point it was clear I was going to start distracting from the talk we were supposed to be getting...so I left it at...

"oh... well you're my new hero... expect to hear from me later"

Ha

Dude. I don't even have the words to describe how awesome that is! If he is willing to share any insight that you would relay to us peons by all means I would love to hear about his experiences!

 

[Joek3rr]

To quote RLM
"One thing that should be noted here. It seems like Rian Johnson is a pretty good guy. Everyone had nothing but nice things to say about him... He liked to laugh, and maybe he was just a little bit nervous to be working on such a big production... He also just wanted to write a good script and make a movie that was unexpected. Maybe a little refreshing? A different take on StarWars.. And for that I give him respect..
The problem was that he failed spectacularly at it on every level."



So again this is a prime example of good in theory and bad in execution. There's nothing wrong with wanting to emulate a WW2 bombing run in SW but it needs to be done in a realistic and believable way within the universe. Those ships being as unbelievably slow and tin can as they are with such other advanced tech around them was utterly bizarre to watch. Especially when we have the already mentioned Y-wings and B-wings. It already feels weird the resistance are seemingly using slightly upgraded 40+ year old tech when their government was the one in charge for at least 30 of those years (we all know this was done for nostalgia and nothing more) and now you introduce bombers that feel even more outdated than the ships that were outdated in the OT?? It's absolutely strange

They aren't unbelievably slow. Actually their speed compared to other ships, is about right when trying to portray a heavy bomber.

For instance, the BTL-A4 Y-wing flies at sluggish 70 MGLT. While the T-65B X-wing flies at 100 MGLT. While the speed of the SF-17 hasn't been stated yet(that I know of) I'd hazard a guess that it's about the same as a Y-wing. Which is about on point when you look at their real-world counterparts. The B-17G has a top speed of 287 MPH, while the P-51D has a top speed 440. The cruising speeds are 182 MPH, and 362 MPH respectively.

 

[Inquisitor Peregrinus]

I heard the ideas that Y-wings would be better. But would they? I mean they're still slow, lack maneuverability, would still have to fly in formation, and still have to get fairly close. And you would need a lot of them. According to Legends the BTL-A4 Y-wing carries 20 proton bombs. Whereas the SF17 carries 1,048 proton bombs. You would need 52.4 Y-wings to carry the same amount as one SF17.

The bolded bit is a thing that's always bugged me. Where did the "Y-wings are slow and clumsy" thing even come from? I know they became bombers when Kenner needed to add a play feature to their toy version, but this? The original ILM comparison chart shows X-wings and Y-wings having the same top speed, and the movies support this. Clone Wars and Rebels show them being just as maneuverable, too.

I will agree with the underlying premise: "Finding a way to show heavy bombers in Star Wars would be cool." The execution needed a few more revisions before committing, for roughly the reasons mentioned. Are they attacking in a roughly two-dimensional plane? Why? Would there be a way to do a Space Box Formation that takes better advantage of the three-dimensionality of space? Was it really narratively necessary to lose all of them? I argue no. Ditto the Total Party Kill of Rogue One. Even thirty percent casualties would be egregious. Good writing can work with that. Failure 9f the fighter escort to provide sufficient defense, the surviving bombers potentially getting nibbled away over the film, one of the pilots of a crippled bomber opting to kamikaze, etc. Lots of dramatic potential in not wiping them all out...

 

[Joek3rr]

The bolded bit is a thing that's always bugged me. Where did the "Y-wings are slow and clumsy" thing even come from? I know they became bombers when Kenner needed to add a play feature to their toy version, but this? The original ILM comparison chart shows X-wings and Y-wings having the same top speed, and the movies support this. Clone Wars and Rebels show them being just as maneuverable, too.

I will agree with the underlying premise: "Finding a way to show heavy bombers in Star Wars would be cool." The execution needed a few more revisions before committing, for roughly the reasons mentioned. Are they attacking in a roughly two-dimensional plane? Why? Would there be a way to do a Space Box Formation that takes better advantage of the three-dimensionality of space? Was it really narratively necessary to lose all of them? I argue no. Ditto the Total Party Kill of Rogue One. Even thirty percent casualties would be egregious. Good writing can work with that. Failure 9f the fighter escort to provide sufficient defense, the surviving bombers potentially getting nibbled away over the film, one of the pilots of a crippled bomber opting to kamikaze, etc. Lots of dramatic potential in not wiping them all out...

That's a good question. Probably the games? Maybe Star Wars X-wing?? All I know is all the games I've ever played from X-wing to Rogue Squadron to Battlefront 2, the Y-wing is slow and ungainly.

 

[Ron]

I'm still not sure how much to bug him, but I just found out the guy I've been working with the last 2 years has worked on the original trilogy.

I was at a lunch with a bunch of people to talk to the guy who runs development at the company we work for. At one point he goes, "well, if you need to know anything, talk to 'W', he's been doing this since Star Wars"...

He keeps talking, but I'm sitting across from the guy (at the end of the table) ... I'm like "Wait what? Did you really work on Star Wars?"

"Well Empire and Jedi... When I was hired my first job was to add "A New Hope" to the opening crawl...."

*drops food out of open mouth*

"You were at pinewoods?"

"yes"

"What did you do?"

"I was production... optical effects miniatures... bunch of stuff"

...

"props?"

"no..."

At this point it was clear I was going to start distracting from the talk we were supposed to be getting...so I left it at...

"oh... well you're my new hero... expect to hear from me later"

Ha

So can we just forward our questions for him to you here or would email work better?

Seriously though that's so cool! 2 years and he never mentioned it? I like that he doesn't feel the need to brag about it. Sounds like a humble guy. Exactly the type that probably wouldn't mind you asking about it.

Meeting someone who worked on Star Wars is like meeting someone who worked on the Apollo programs. It's become almost mythical in a weird way.

 

[Joek3rr]

Hahahahaha it's a promotional picture from TLJ not TROS!

Redirect Notice

 

[Inquisitor Peregrinus]

This is internal to ILM c.1982 for relative speed in the motion-control work. It predates all the more refined, printed versions that came along in the late '80s and into the '90s:

 

[Axlotl]

Meeting someone who worked on Star Wars is like meeting someone who worked on the Apollo programs. It's become almost mythical in a weird way.

My uncle worked for Grumman and helped build the Lunar Lander.
A couple years ago he gave me a manilla envelope full of photos of his team and stuff.
I meant to scan them all and post them here, but he asked for it back before I got a chance to.
After Apollo he went to work on the Tomcat.