Accident on the set of Rust.

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batguy

Sr Member
It is simple. If the guy throwing the punch intentionally doesn't hold back, intentionally doesn't miss, and knocks the other guy out, injures him, etc. then he would have issues if the "victim" wanted to pursue it.

That analogy is only comparable if AB knew there were real bullets in the gun (and the victims didn't).

This situation is not like a normal gun owner at home. AB didn't pull out his favorite gun at a barbecue and accidentally kill his neighbor.


How do you apply normal gun safety rules to filming 'The Deer Hunter'?

ww.imfdb.org%2Fw%2Fimages%2Fc%2Fcb%2FTDH-Revolver6.jpg



The answer is, you can't!

The film industry doesn't rely on normal gun safety rules! They never have, not for 100+ years.

They have evolved their own set of safety rules. They rely less on the gun operator, and more on other people in charge of the guns to prevent live rounds & accidents.


Again, I'm not claiming AB was 100% innocent. But I'm guessing there is a list of guilty people and I doubt he is at the top of it.
 
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juvatwad

Member
That’s the question I had earlier. It doesn’t really matter what the industry standard is, it only matters if there is legal precedent that absolves the person pulling the trigger of responsibility if they are doing it on a movie set.
 

BTTUK

Sr Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
It's informative to know how many RPF users were on set and saw exactly the event(s) on that day, otherwise we'd all be relying on bit part information....Wait a minute...

That’s the question I had earlier. It doesn’t really matter what the industry standard is, it only matters if there is legal precedent that absolves the person pulling the trigger of responsibility if they are doing it on a movie set.
It matters a great deal what the industry standard is, as it will be almost entirely likely to be the focal point in both the prosecution and defence's cases if such a legal preceding took place.

But if we point that out, suddenly we’re part of a pseudo investigative team that is peddling conspiracy’s. Lol
You've taken my post far too literally.
 

juvatwad

Member
I’m not sure individual industries can decide for themselves whether a death on set is murder, manslaughter, or “hey, sometimes bad sh!t happens”.
 

batguy

Sr Member
I’m not sure individual industries can decide for themselves whether a death on set is murder, manslaughter, or “hey, sometimes bad sh!t happens”.

Is anyone taking a "Hey, sometimes bad sh!t happens" attitude about this incident? I haven't heard that anywhere. Not from the people involved or the press.

It's undoubtedly headed to court. Probably multiple courtrooms.
 

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joberg

Master Member
It's informative to know how many RPF users were on set and saw exactly the event(s) on that day, otherwise we'd all be relying on bit part information....Wait a minute...


It matters a great deal what the industry standard is, as it will be almost entirely likely to be the focal point in both the prosecution and defence's cases if such a legal preceding took place.


You've taken my post far too literally.
Seems that "Industry Standards" have loopholes! Some RPF members (pros working/having worked on set/movie industry) have stated that whatever standards they have in Cali/L.A. ain't the same in N.M. And maybe (conjecture from me) that's why the production was shot is Sante Fe.
No need to have tight standards regarding health and safety for crew and cast, let's roll as fast as possible:rolleyes:
Yes, standard means time! Time to check and re-check weapons and other things you have to do on a set to insure that, at the end of the day, everybody goes home safe and sound.
 

JoeG

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
I’m not sure individual industries can decide for themselves whether a death on set is murder, manslaughter, or “hey, sometimes bad sh!t happens”.

Police are investigating. Based on that investigation's findings, whatever prosecutor/district attorney has jurisdiction will decide if something criminal has happened and if charges will be filed. Regardless of any criminal findings there will be multiple civil suits. Thats how this will go.
 

joberg

Master Member
It was a location that had been used as set for several other Western movies before.
...and was known to have different standards than the ones used in L.A. (conjecture once again). Someone should chime in about this particular location and what the State of New Mexico's standard on health and safety on a movie production are all about.
 

JPH

Sr Member
So let me get this straight....

Actors will spend months learning to play an instrument --with a trained instructor-- for a movie, weeks rehearsing dance moves, fight scenes, learning their way around a dangerous construction site...

but when it comes to handlng a firearm

No rules apply.

Actors gets to be stupid? Negligent. Allowed to KILL!?!?!

Sorry folks, Baldwin is guilty as HELL.

Ignoring gun safety is on HIM. Totally on HIM. COMPLETELY ON HIM.

How many movies has Baldwin been on with guns?

Ignores BASIC gun safety. Put your fanboy googly brains aside. To use a gun on a set requires a HIGHER STANDARD FROM EVERYONE.

Not a lesser standard.

So, you think he forgot everything or was *NEVER* properly trained....EVER?!??!

Ever...

Clearly he didnt kill anyone you care about.

"Oh, but they had a new weaponsmaster."

So what?!?! The previous one didnt teach them anything?

Nada.... ZILCH!!!

Next excuse, "accidentally discharged"

Why was ANYTHING in the gun if he was practicing?!?!

Next excuse...

B...but the Unions!!!

Prior events had *ALREADY* occurred.

Hmmm, who was the cost-cutting produce...oh, oops! Nm.

And once again, you want to convince the world Baldwin never had prior training?

Dang! Its like listening to a juror try to rationalize that a murderer didnt know the gun was dangerous.

Sheesh!
 
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gobler

Sr Member
I've now read from five different attorneys that Baldwin needs to keep quiet and lawyer up and consider himself in a defensive situation. Three stated that his years acting and his history with firearms on set and political does not look good.
 

Moviefreak

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
So let me get this straight....

Actors will spend months learning to play an instrument --with a trained instructor-- for a movie, weeks rehearsing dance moves, fight scenes, learning their way around a dangerous construction site...

but when it comes to handlng a firearm

No rules apply.

Actors gets to be stupid? Negligent. Allowed to KILL!?!?!

Sorry folks, Baldwin is guilty as HELL.

Ignoring gun safety is on HIM. Totally on HIM. COMPLETELY ON HIM.

How many movies has Baldwin been on with guns?

Ignores BASIC gun safety. Put your fanboy googly brains aside. To use a gun on a set requires a HIGHER STANDARD FROM EVERYONE.

Not a lesser standard.

So, you think he forgot everything or was *NEVER* properly trained....EVER?!??!

Ever...

Clearly he didnt kill anyone you care about.

"Oh, but they had a new weaponsmaster."

So what?!?! The previous one didnt teach them anything?

Nada.... ZILCH!!!

Next excuse, "accidentally discharged"

Why was ANYTHING in the gun if he was practicing?!?!

Next excuse...

B...but the Unions!!!

Prior events had *ALREADY* occurred.

Hmmm, who was the cost-cutting produce...oh, oops! Nm.

And once again, you want to convince the world Baldwin never had prior training?

Dang! Its like listening to a juror try to rationalize that a murderer didnt know the gun was dangerous.

Sheesh!
All your statements are complete BS. It is not “all on him”. There are people in line before him that load the gun, then are supposed to check it before handing it to an actor. You asked “why was anything in the gun if he was practicing?”, and that’s a good question. The AD handed to him and called “cold gun”. Again, someone else in the line that failed to do their job. So this isn’t squarely on the actor. The whole line of gun handling and safety failed, so quit trying to pin this on one person. Is AB partially responsible for not doing any safety checks, sure, but so is a line ahead of him.

And as to your last statement, I fixed it for you: “Dang! Listening to your rant is like listening to a juror try to convict a murderer without having all the evidence or facts”
 
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gregory

New Member
This is a very sad event. It is more sad because it was avoidable. Regardless of the camera shot they were going for, there are work arounds that allow you to follow basic firearm safety. Cinematographers can use forced perspective to make it seem like a shot is aimed at a person while in fact they are not in line with the shot.

Even without a projectile in the casing, and with lighter powder loads the pressure of gasses escaping the barrel or around the cylinder of a single action revolver can do considerable harm at close range. I have a feeling however that a projectile was accidentally introduced to the firearm.
 

Searun

Active Member
This is a very sad event. It is more sad because it was avoidable. Regardless of the camera shot they were going for, there are work arounds that allow you to follow basic firearm safety. Cinematographers can use forced perspective to make it seem like a shot is aimed at a person while in fact they are not in line with the shot.

Even without a projectile in the casing, and with lighter powder loads the pressure of gasses escaping the barrel or around the cylinder of a single action revolver can do considerable harm at close range. I have a feeling however that a projectile was accidentally introduced to the firearm.
 

JPH

Sr Member
All your statements are complete BS. It is not “all on him”. There are people in line before him that load the gun, then are supposed to check it before handing it to an actor. You asked “why was anything in the gun if he was practicing?”, and that’s a good question. The AD handed to him and called “cold gun”. Again, someone else in the line that failed to do their job. So this isn’t squarely on the actor. The whole line of gun handling and safety failed, so quit trying to pin this on one person. Is AB partially responsible for not doing any safety checks, sure, but so is a line ahead of him.

Actually all of YOUR statements are COMPLETE BS. And irresponsible.

Are you so naive that you think actors magically show up on a set and know how to dance? Work power tools? Fire a gun? Any of it? Work a wire harness?

You ignorance defense is tired and weak and worthless.

Moreover you PROVE my argument by agreeing an expert needs to be hired to work on the set. And having an expert still doesnt excuse and ACTOR MURDERING SOMEONE by Ignoring basic safety.

Baldwin has been on HOW MANY MOVIES WITH GUNS??!!

feel embarrassed yet?

A HIGHER STANDARD.

Quit defending the indefensible.

Just because folks who dont understand gun safety keep making the same irresponsible excuses over and over doesnt make it credible.

He MURDERED SOMEONE. All he needed to do was check the chambers of a revolver


...a REVOLVER!!

And someone would still be alive.
 

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Moviefreak

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Actually all of YOUR statements are COMPLETE BS. And irresponsible.

Are you so naive that you think actors magically show up on a set and know how to dance? Work power tools? Fire a gun? Any of it? Work a wire harness?

You ignorance defense is tired and weak and worthless.

Moreover you PROVE my argument by agreeing an expert needs to be hired to work on the set. And having an expert still doesnt excuse and ACTOR MURDERING SOMEONE by Ignoring basic safety.

Baldwin has been on HOW MANY MOVIES WITH GUNS??!!

feel embarrassed yet?

A HIGHER STANDARD.

Quit defending the indefensible.

Just because folks who dont understand gun safety keep making the same irresponsible excuses over and over doesnt make it credible.

He MURDERED SOMEONE. All he needed to do was check the chambers of a revolver


...a REVOLVER!!

And someone would still be alive.
Feeling embarrassed yet? Hardly. Statements by someone like you will hardly make me feel embarrassed. Nice try! Cheers!
 

harrisonp

Sr Member
If a stunt coordinator told an actor “you’re going to push the stunt man off this cliff, I’ve checked his harness and he’s good to go”, and then that harness fails leading to the stuntman’s death, is the actor a murderer?
 

gregory

New Member
Actually all of YOUR statements are COMPLETE BS. And irresponsible.

Are you so naive that you think actors magically show up on a set and know how to dance? Work power tools? Fire a gun? Any of it? Work a wire harness?

You ignorance defense is tired and weak and worthless.

Moreover you PROVE my argument by agreeing an expert needs to be hired to work on the set. And having an expert still doesnt excuse and ACTOR MURDERING SOMEONE by Ignoring basic safety.

Baldwin has been on HOW MANY MOVIES WITH GUNS??!!

feel embarrassed yet?

A HIGHER STANDARD.

Quit defending the indefensible.

Just because folks who dont understand gun safety keep making the same irresponsible excuses over and over doesnt make it credible.

He MURDERED SOMEONE. All he needed to do was check the chambers of a revolver


...a REVOLVER!!

And someone would still be alive.
As well, they should check the barrel for obstructions, the integrity of the casings. I’d think they should weigh the casing to ensure it wasn’t overcharged with powder.

If they don’t have a daily safety briefing they should it doesn’t take long and it’s a good reminder.
 

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