The Mandalorian (TV series)

Which is the very reason why Ahsoka's appearance felt distracting to me. Sure it made sense in context to the episode but was it necessary for it to be her because it just felt like I was watching a live action Clone Wars or Rebels episode? I know some fans are loving that but I for one don't. Filoni had two entire shows to tell her story. Let's move on to something else and stop with the callbacks. I've seen Star Wars before, I don't need the constant reminder that I'm watching it.
But don’t you know that you aren’t a valued audience member? New Star Wars is only for real fans who like everything about Star Wars and just want to be shown the same things over and over again. Your opinion, critiques, and voice don’t matter when someone else can come in and say, “Well, you didn’t play this obscure Dreamcast Star Wars game where you would have learned that this character that they just spent an episode showing us is actually from, and I for one, was just SO BLOWN AWAY that I saw a thing I knew that I CLAPPED!”
 
For some basic comparative math here....Grogu at 50 is a toddler. Yoda died ostensibly of old age at 900. 50/900 is 1/18....in human years that's 18 years old....I guess you can spin it as difference species evolve through their lifespan differently, but, if it took a human that long to age past being a toddler, you'd be nearly 20 by the time you could speak or walk on your own.
I think it does work as a comparison between species, as in real life a human brain takes around 20-25 years to fully grow and mature, by which time the huge majority of other species would be dead, or in old age.

Plus as Grogu's species is force sensitive, it could be that they begin life communicating with each other through the force, before learning how to speak a language like galactic basic.
 
Which is the very reason why Ahsoka's appearance felt distracting to me. Sure it made sense in context to the episode but was it necessary for it to be her because it just felt like I was watching a live action Clone Wars or Rebels episode? I know some fans are loving that but I for one don't. Filoni had two entire shows to tell her story. Let's move on to something else and stop with the callbacks. I've seen Star Wars before, I don't need the constant reminder that I'm watching it.

I agree that the constant call backs can get tiresome, but here is why I think Ahsoka appearing in the Mandalorian works:

Mando is obviously looking for anyone who can direct him to the Child’s people which, at this point seem to be the Jedi. He searches out other Mandalorians to help him in this task and comes across Bo Katan, who has a close history with the Dark Saber, therefore, it’s not a stretch that she would show up. Because she has had a history with the Jedi, specifically Ahsoka, it makes sense that she would direct him to seek her out. I honestly feel that, while it is fan service, it also makes sense for the story.

All that being said, I really don’t think we have to worry about Ahsoka becoming a recurring character on this show. I think she was a one and done to lay groundwork for a future show featuring her quest for Thrawn and Ezra. I do, however think we will see Bo Katan show up again when there is a showdown with Gideon over the Dark Saber.

Also, as I’ve stated earlier, I seriously doubt we will be seeing any more Jedi in this show. It is my firm belief that the Child will not reach out with the Force when the time comes, choosing to stay with Din.

Oh, and one final thing, nothing that has been shown in The Mandalorian relies on having to know what happened in Rebels or Clone Wars. The background is there if you want to search it out, but it is not necessary to understand what is happening in this show.
 
I have a question for non TCW/Rebels watchers.

Let’s say there MUST be a Jedi in the show, would it have been better in your opinion for it to be a new character who is another survivor? Maybe canonizing someone like Rahm Kota? Or is the believe-ability and inclusion of a Jedi at all the issue?

I like Ahsoka but I can also see the merit in the argument that Filoni is lacking restraint at times and just bringing his favorite toys back to the new sandbox. Narratively I think she and Bo do make sense with the nature of what’s going on but it’s beginning to strain the benefit of the doubt when people start talking about Ezra coming for Grogu etc.
 
It's kind of both in a way. I mean the episode worked fine, I just found her appearance distracting. A huge part of the show's success thus far has been staying clear of the Force and Force users to give us a sense of life for the regular Joes so to speak. Which is why I hope Grogu chooses to remain out of the order. Plus Ashoka already had two shows where she was a central character. Is it really necessary for her to have a third, because it's clear that while she may not be the lead in Mando, she clearly stole the spotlight.

Think about it. Even the people that adore Rogue One have to admit that Vader was far and away the most memorable thing about that movie. The same principle applies here too.
 
I totally understand that, even as big of a fan as I am of Filoni’s stuff I was a little disappointed in the first episode of the series when the Child showed up and kind of realized this show wasn’t going to be as separate as I had imagined. Really I just want the Rebels follow up to happen so Mando can keep living his own story while Bo/Ahsoka/Ezra can be explored in another show.
 
I have a question for non TCW/Rebels watchers.

Let’s say there MUST be a Jedi in the show, would it have been better in your opinion for it to be a new character who is another survivor? Maybe canonizing someone like Rahm Kota? Or is the believe-ability and inclusion of a Jedi at all the issue?

I like Ahsoka but I can also see the merit in the argument that Filoni is lacking restraint at times and just bringing his favorite toys back to the new sandbox. Narratively I think she and Bo do make sense with the nature of what’s going on but it’s beginning to strain the benefit of the doubt when people start talking about Ezra coming for Grogu etc.
I think that using an existing character works the best, not only because you draw in fans who know that character, but also works better from a storytelling point of view. Although I'm one of those who feel that a few Jedi would have survived Order 66 and subsequently Vader's Jedi hunt afterward, I also feel that adding another surviving Jedi starts to stretch things a bit and brings up too many questions about what they were doing all of this time. As it is already, we have Kanan, Ezra, and Ahsoka and I think that's enough Jedis, or almost Jedis as the case may be, to sell the idea that more than just Obi-Wan and Yoda survived but not so many as to make it seem like Order 66 and Vader weren't nearly as successful as they first appeared to be.
 
I have a question for non TCW/Rebels watchers.

Let’s say there MUST be a Jedi in the show, would it have been better in your opinion for it to be a new character who is another survivor? Maybe canonizing someone like Rahm Kota? Or is the believe-ability and inclusion of a Jedi at all the issue?

I like Ahsoka but I can also see the merit in the argument that Filoni is lacking restraint at times and just bringing his favorite toys back to the new sandbox. Narratively I think she and Bo do make sense with the nature of what’s going on but it’s beginning to strain the benefit of the doubt when people start talking about Ezra coming for Grogu etc.

Hopefully something new, the show needs to look forward & continue to introduce NEW characters like in the first series

I hope the show isn't turning into the Filoni-verse

J
 
Where as I hope it does turn into the Filoni’verse as you put it. He has created some great new characters in the shows he has run with some great stories. The Mandalorian has already introduced even more new ones, why wouldn’t there be more to come ? What’s so bad about weaving all the threads into a good story, even if some of them have been used before ?
Personally I’ve enjoyed most of the stories he has been behind (Resistance being the one I didn’t) so I can’t see a good reason why he (and Faverau) won’t carry on delivering.
 
Where as I hope it does turn into the Filoni’verse as you put it. He has created some great new characters in the shows he has run with some great stories. The Mandalorian has already introduced even more new ones, why wouldn’t there be more to come ? What’s so bad about weaving all the threads into a good story, even if some of them have been used before ?
Personally I’ve enjoyed most of the stories he has been behind (Resistance being the one I didn’t) so I can’t see a good reason why he (and Faverau) won’t carry on delivering.
Looks like UK's Radio Times Shares my concerns


Article by David Craig:
"But while these additions have made the most ardent followers very happy, one has to wonder whether one of the world’s biggest entertainment properties is becoming too niche for mainstream audiences.

Ever since word leaked in March that Rosario Dawson had been chosen to bring fan favourite animated character Ahsoka Tano into live-action, the arduous wait for her arrival has defined this entire season. Discussion around the teaser trailer and the first four episodes was largely overshadowed by speculation on her whereabouts, barring a brief intermission to discuss that fleeting Boba Fett cameo. And while Dawson’s debut was well worth the wait for the most passionate corners of the fandom, the question is: what about everyone else?

With an increasing number of avid fan communities cropping up online, it’s easy to forget that the majority of the Star Wars audience is comprised of more casual consumers. Some people might not want to believe that, but the fact is that you don’t get to The Force Awakens’ $2 billion box office gross without tapping into the mass market. With this in mind, a substantial number of The Mandalorian viewers have likely never watched a single episode of The Clone Wars or picked up an expanded universe novel – and for this group, the show must feel inaccessible at best.

These people don’t get to share in the thrill of Ahsoka and Bo-Katan jumping to live-action, the re-emergence of the Darksaber or a namedrop for Grand Admiral Thrawn. Nor do they want hours of research to be a prerequisite for a completely satisfying Star Wars experience, which becomes a problem when knowledge of both The Clone Wars and Rebels is required for these reveals to have any major impact. Deprived of these pivotal moments, one has to wonder what is left to keep this quiet majority interested.

After all, it’s questionable just how much story The Mandalorian has to get truly invested in. Several of the standalone episodes have felt disposable, with little to offer besides some inconsequential world-building, while the overarching plot surrounding Giancarlo Esposito’s sinister Moff Gideon is taking so long to go anywhere that it hardly even registers. Assuming that the series is holding onto its audience (we cannot know for sure as Disney Plus does not release viewing figures), that grip could loosen in the coming weeks from a lack of casual appeal.

No doubt some Star Wars fans would happily bid the masses farewell, keen to dive into the most niche and obscure corners of the universe without any holding back. But with the franchise arguably on a less-firm footing following the underwhelming box office performances of both Solo and The Rise of Skywalker (the latter making a profit of $300 million, of course, but still ranking as the least profitable film of the new trilogy), is shutting out the masses and doubling down on lesser known continuity really the correct way to rehabilitate it? Such a move might seem exciting in the short-term, but risks whittling down the audience of Star Wars in such a way that could prove harmful in the future."

J
 
Looks like UK's Radio Times Shares my concerns


Article by David Craig:
"But while these additions have made the most ardent followers very happy, one has to wonder whether one of the world’s biggest entertainment properties is becoming too niche for mainstream audiences.

Ever since word leaked in March that Rosario Dawson had been chosen to bring fan favourite animated character Ahsoka Tano into live-action, the arduous wait for her arrival has defined this entire season. Discussion around the teaser trailer and the first four episodes was largely overshadowed by speculation on her whereabouts, barring a brief intermission to discuss that fleeting Boba Fett cameo. And while Dawson’s debut was well worth the wait for the most passionate corners of the fandom, the question is: what about everyone else?

With an increasing number of avid fan communities cropping up online, it’s easy to forget that the majority of the Star Wars audience is comprised of more casual consumers. Some people might not want to believe that, but the fact is that you don’t get to The Force Awakens’ $2 billion box office gross without tapping into the mass market. With this in mind, a substantial number of The Mandalorian viewers have likely never watched a single episode of The Clone Wars or picked up an expanded universe novel – and for this group, the show must feel inaccessible at best.

These people don’t get to share in the thrill of Ahsoka and Bo-Katan jumping to live-action, the re-emergence of the Darksaber or a namedrop for Grand Admiral Thrawn. Nor do they want hours of research to be a prerequisite for a completely satisfying Star Wars experience, which becomes a problem when knowledge of both The Clone Wars and Rebels is required for these reveals to have any major impact. Deprived of these pivotal moments, one has to wonder what is left to keep this quiet majority interested.

After all, it’s questionable just how much story The Mandalorian has to get truly invested in. Several of the standalone episodes have felt disposable, with little to offer besides some inconsequential world-building, while the overarching plot surrounding Giancarlo Esposito’s sinister Moff Gideon is taking so long to go anywhere that it hardly even registers. Assuming that the series is holding onto its audience (we cannot know for sure as Disney Plus does not release viewing figures), that grip could loosen in the coming weeks from a lack of casual appeal.

No doubt some Star Wars fans would happily bid the masses farewell, keen to dive into the most niche and obscure corners of the universe without any holding back. But with the franchise arguably on a less-firm footing following the underwhelming box office performances of both Solo and The Rise of Skywalker (the latter making a profit of $300 million, of course, but still ranking as the least profitable film of the new trilogy), is shutting out the masses and doubling down on lesser known continuity really the correct way to rehabilitate it? Such a move might seem exciting in the short-term, but risks whittling down the audience of Star Wars in such a way that could prove harmful in the future."

J
Could not have said it better.
 
So, Ashoka Tano should NEVER have been brought into the show? She’s from a different story and DOES NOT belong mixing in with The Mandalorian

Would it have been better if had been some previously unknown Jedi survivor who communicated with The Child and told Mando his name was Grogu?

I honestly can’t understand that reasoning. Why does the inclusion of other SW elements cheapen The Mandalorian?
 
Catering to mainstream audiences gave us Rise of Skywalker. I'm completely fine with with catering to the fans instead. Afterall, this is a television show on a subscription streaming service that also includes all of the supplementary material needed.
JJ Abrams brought us Rise of Skywalker,...'nuff said

Jon Favreau brought us The Mandalorian,... he is responsible for the positive step Mando has taken

Even my mother knows about Baby Yoda without my influence, she turned 70 last year

What I fear is, that with Disney's meddling & Dave Filoni getting more listening time, Jon Favreau takes his foot off the pedal, & we see a change in direction

As the Radio Times says, theres not a lot to offer on the Disney+ streaming service, & if Mr & Mrs General Audience finds the Mandalorian getting nerdy, they'll cancel the service which equals the end of the series

Lucas film needs to remember what made the first series successful

J
 
What’s happening to the Mandalorian is essentially a kind of “gentrification”, except instead of wealthy people pushing out poor, it’s the so-called “true fans” pushing everyone else out and redefining what Star Wars means or should be. Because, even though multiple groups and divisions exist within the fans (obviously, as evidenced by this thread alone), some fans aren’t content with a different set getting what they want, which isn’t the Filoni stuff. Nowhere does it say everything Star Wars has to have Filoni and his concepts attached. Nowhere does it say that he can’t go and make another show where all the fan service one could possibly desire is present. It’s just disappointing to those of us who did like the Mandalorian initially when it wasn’t just a “best of Filoni” clip show. If it had started out guns blazing with the level of name-dropping and cameo-ing it’s getting to be, I don’t think the show would have nearly the same following.

I mean, imagine you’re sitting there watching Avengers: Endgame, and one of the characters from Agents of Shield shows up and starts overshadowing all these other characters, and is more powerful than them, and keeps name-dropping some big bad from the show you’ve never heard of. It would be kind of annoying, right?
 
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