Re-inventing Lukes ANH Lightsaber- And Vaders too??!?!

[Mr. Nagata]

Look again at Chip's snazzy 3D model (thanks again for this). The red 7 model shows a really skinny space, followed by a medium space, followed by a small space. The blue 6 model shows no space, a big fat space, and a medium space. First of all, I think the blue one needs to be rotated clockwise a bit more and it will match up better than you think (rotate it until you get a little skinny space on top and you shrink that bottom space a bit).

Look at the widest center space on the Chronicles pic. It's wider than your red 7 center space and closer to the width of the widest space on the blue 6. However, the bottom blue 6 space looks too wide, right? Again, this is because you need to rotate the blue model more. Then it will match up better.

I actually think the blue 6 model more closely matches.

 

[E.D.C. Studios]

Ok here we go, Ill lay out as much as I can here about the grip placement, try it using .500" tape if you dont have grips handy.

The first two grips are placed on either side of the "control box" as seen below. Make sure the edges of each grip sit on either side of the gap that runs down the center of the clamp. the gap between the two grips should be about 5/32"

The next grip gets placed with the same spacing. The edge of the grip furthest from the clamp should line up with the inside edge of the holes on the clamp as seen below.

Now keep in mind these holes mark the halfway mark around the clamp, so by this stage of applying the grips, you already have FOUR attached and still have half the distance around the flash to go to place the other three.

You next grip should be place directly opposite the "control box on the back of the flash

The last two grips are applied between the grip on the back of the saber and the ones that line up with the clamp holes

BINGO SEVEN GRIPS!

If there were only six grips, the centers of the grips near the clamp holes would line up directly centered on those same holes. It is clear as day that they do NOT line up as such

 

[E.D.C. Studios]

playskool2000, look at the overlayed pics i did with 6 and seven grips, the rotation was matched to the pic and seven just fits better.

 

[E.D.C. Studios]

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I DO know that on a 7 grip lightsaber like the DV ROTJ, 5 grips are often visible from the side. NONE of the actual photos show 5 grips at one time, from any angle, all 4. I think we should pay more attention to DARTH SABER'S photo sequence.
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True none of the photos show five grips at one time, but then again thats just the luck of the draw....I render those images to match the rotationof the saber in the picsm and they only show 4 grips too.

Now chew on this one, I have taken TWO graflexs here put 6 grips on one, and seven on the other, the 6 grips do not even remotely space out properly if you what you can see in the pics as a guide for applying them, there is just TOO much leftover space this way. The 7 gripped one matches up no mtter how I view it when comparing it to the available pics.

Also if you look at a 6 gripped saber from an angle that matches the POSW pic, it also doesn't match at all

 

[DARTH SABER]

Good show Chip, 7 grips it is....I hope..

 

[Mr. Nagata]

I still think you're relying to much on the idea that these grips are even.

BUT, a six grip saber with 2 grips centered around the control box will ALSO put the grip immediately above quite close, and I emphasize CLOSE, to lining up its top edge with the top set of holes. Also, your red line highlights the fact that the grips are crooked.

Back to DS's sequence, if you try and match a seven gripped saber to the top picture, you'll find that when you rotate the saber to the configuration it is in pic 3, 5 grips should be visible. They are not.

 

[Mr. Nagata]

Damn you Chip for making me get fingerprints all over my lightsabers!

Anyway, if I'm the only one holding out for the old 6 grip theory, don't waste your breath trying to convince me. I'm not that important.

 

[DARTH SABER]

Hold on a sec!!!! but theres more!!..

please excuse the crude drawing..

 

[itbedave]

I have to agree with Playskool in one respect - these aren't put on evenly to begin with, so it is possible all of the gaps aren't mathmatically even as we'd like them to be. However, from a couple of those pics, I just can't imaging 2 grips being on the back side and that uneven with the rest of them.

 

[DARTH SABER]

I also think the grips might be wider than the ones Blastech sells.

 

[Mr. Nagata]

DAMN YOU DS FOR MAKING ME TAKE MY SABERS DOWN AGAIN AFTER I JUST CLEANED THEN UP AND PUT THEM AWAY!!!!!!!

As I rotate the 6 and 7 grip sabers, I can vaguely match both up to the pictures using the control box as a reference point. At the same time, both seem off a bit. I agree that in some pictures, the spaces seem too small for a 6 grip. In others, they appear too wide for 7. Their orientations are equally ambiguous.

We're looking at fuzzy photos of grips that arent placed evenly (at least some of them we know are crooked). I think error can encapsulate both both grip numbers.

Suffice it to say, I am not totally convinced either way and I will refrain from using such strong words as "definetly" or "without a doubt" anymore.

 

[DARTH SABER]

Ill send you a SHAMY in the mail to polish yer sabers!

 

[James Kenobi 1138]

Well, you guys are starting to touch on what I was saying earlier, about uneven grips and how with 7 grips you lose too much space between and the gap looks too small.

I too have one unconverted Graflex, and 7 grips, and I test fitted them while also rotating my 6 grip Graflex.

I could reproduce all the chronicles and POSW pics with BOTH sabers, depending on which way I rotated them.

I know ICONS sucks, but I can't imagine they would have thrown research and homework out the window and only put 6 grips on their Saber if there had been any evidence of 7 grips out there, I mean they did do SOMEKIND of recearch with the ILM Archives, right?

Plus, with the Vader ANH having 6 grips and the Luke ESB having 6 grips, I can't imagine that they would have either put 7 on Lukes ANH when the Vader had 6, and then switching to 6 for ESB, then back to 7 for ROTJ Vader.

Yeah, grip spacing is hard and they were putting them on by hand, 3D modles are neat but the spacing is too exact and does not account for human error. On the red modle Chip made I agree the grips look right, but the gap spacing is wrong. The blue model seemed almost right on the grips, but the spacing seemed perfect.

Until I see a definative photo from ILM, LFL, or the Archives that shows 7 grips, and I mean a photo so clear my 8 year old son can count 7 grips (like a end-cap shot) and not grainy b&w photos with red and blue lines drawn all over them, then I will keep my ANH saber with 6 grips.

I also caution against using 'definative', 'no doubt', 'I know this is right', etc.....we all said that about the King sol remember?

 

[James Kenobi 1138]

Also, photos, both pre-production and post production, are fine. But in a few years, when ANH comes out on DVD, and we can get reallty good screen caps, thats where the proof is. I want a Saber that is screen accurate, not one that matches the Chronicles book, which no one I know has ever read, but they have seen Star Wars.

 

[Hiyata99]

Interesting. I just found this thread and it seems that 7 grips may be correct.

Thing is that if there were 6 grips that were evenly spaced then you would never see more than 4 grips.....but, the top and bottom most grips would be viewable ONLY from pure side view. To me, the top most and bottom most grips are not purely on a side view but are at an angle. Pay attention to grips #2 and #6 in the top and bottom pics.

So, if we number them it should look something like this:

Even if the grips aren't evenly spaced there would be a fairly large gap on one side of the handle and it would be grossly off balance.

I think that there seems to be more than enough room to fit 3 more grips apart from the 4 grips that are visible.

There is still a chance it could be 6 grips but IMHO I think we are looking at a 7 grip saber. I haven't spent much time on this and I probably won't spend much more but that is just my $0.02

If you are wondering about my history then check out this file on how 16 fins was proven for the OWK ANH saber.

http://members.aol.com/spcraft/OWKANH_RGRIP.zip

 

[Hiyata99]

My one reserve about 7 grips is WHY? It is so much easier to eyeball the positioning of 6 grips than it is for 7 and I really can't see someone just starting to attach grips without first figuring out what the pattern would be like.

Strange.

 

[lonepigeon]

For all you holdouts on the 7 grips FACT (not theory anymore).

<img src=http://mywebpages.comcast.net/lonepigeon/sevengrips.jpg>
Photo from Jim Fowler. Big thanks!!!

There's no proof yet of more than one of these ANH sabers. I think this is the film prop, just with the top shell turned around. Charles has already shown that the thing is still loose and turns.

Also, we can use the above pic to get a dead on size for the D-ring.

The Vader ROTJ- While it has 7 grips, it also has holes from previous grips so I don't think it has the original 7 ANH grips on it.

PS- I can't hang out on the board too much this weekend, I have ALOT of work to do by Monday. At the rate this thread is growing I think I'll miss some posts.

 

[teecrooz]

Wow, definitely seven grips, and d-ring in the middle. That last pic does it for sure, it's clear and large enought that the detail can be seen.

 

[THX1138]

Thanks for posting that picture, Chris!

I have an original vintage copy of the photo and broke down and bought a Hi-Res scanner today just so I could scan that picture!

You can see 5 of the grips easily in that photo! It would take 2 more grips on the other side to make the spacing consistant.

7 GRIPS!

I also think this was the only "Hero" prop used.

- Jim

 

[Boba Debt]

AND IT TOOK YOU GUYS 20 YEARS TO FIGURE THIS OUT