Re-inventing Lukes ANH Lightsaber- And Vaders too??!?!

DARTH SABER

Master Member
I was wondering where the placement of the D-ring on Lukes ANH "post production pic" saber is compared to Lukes ANH screen used HERO. I thought they were the same but now after looking at some photos I think they might be different. Actually Im not talking about clock positions here, Im talking about what area ON the bottom of the hilt the straight part of the D-ring rests on. I know the screen used HERO had the straight part resting on the edge of the flash. But I looked at some pics of the "Post production" saber and the D-ring looks like it is positioned in the very center of the flash.

Here are the clues that made me wonder about this...

1.) On page 8 of the SW Visual Dictionary you can see that the D-ring on Lukes belt hook is being pulled back at an angle towards the hook, what this tells me is that Lukes tunic or waist area is pushing the body of the saber forward while the D-ring is being pulled back because of the canter placement tension . This leads me to believe that the D-rings placement is in the center of the flashgun.
If it were on the edge the D-ring would be going straight up and there would be no tension pull because there wouldnt be any resistance from Luke waiste or tunic.

2) on the same picture, if you look very closely you can see the flat metal which wraps around the D-ring and is rivoted to the saber runs back towards Lukes belt hook . If the D-ring were the same as Lukes "Screen used" hero wouldnt the flat metal run in the direction towards the control box?

3) Most of us know that the D-ring on Lukes saber attaches to the hook on the OPPOSITE side of the control box, no matter if its the "Screen used" hero or the "Post production pic" Luke saber.....well heres a profile pic of Lukes "post production pic" saber from the Chronicles book...What do you see?

And here is a top view of the same saber ...

[attachmentid=1947]

The D-ring base is in the CENTER of the flashgun...

If this IS the placement of the D-rings it would mean that the flat metal which wraps around the D-ring and is riveted to the flashgun must've been cut down to size or else it would have ended up hanging off the edge of the saber...
Any comments??
 

Treadwell

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
It took me a while to even fathom how you came to that conclusion on the B&W pic, but finally could see what you were seeing. Or what you think you're seeing.


Here's what I see:


Disregarding grip placement, because despite forshortening playing tricks with the spacing I think they are not evenly placed, I don't think the clamp is at the angle you depict. It looks straight up to me.

The angle of the dring itself (putting aside the flat piece of metal wrapped around it) in no way looks like it's hanging straight down in that B&W pic. It looks like it's at the angle I depicted above.

I also don't think the pic indicates the inverted mounting arrangement you propose. Granted, the pic doesn't prove it's they way I drew it either, but I did that to demonstrate that it could be either way.

Therefore, I'll go so far as to say your inverted mount is a possibility neither proven nor disproven and is worth further investigation.

But oriented along the same axis as the clamp? Nope!
 

DARTH SABER

Master Member
Well the direction in which the flat metal doesnt concern me at this point , what Im trying to figutre out is if the D-ring is placed in the center or the edge of the flashgun bottom.......Also, the pics above dont show the flat metal running toward the direction of lukes belt hook....But the pic in the VD (with him standing and wearing his saber) you can just barely make out the flat metal running toward his belt hook...
 

lonepigeon

Sr Member
I don't think there's enough to prove the two different sabers...yet.
How do we "know" the production saber has the D-ring closer to the edge? Truth is we know next to nothing about what the D-ring assembly looked like in ANH. I think we've put too much faith in Icons (who probably just machined a chrome copy of a picture frame D-ring assembly they happened to find).

We do know that the Luke ANH could quite easily come apart. There was no little locking screw on the clamp like the Graflex comes with. So the clamp could have been flopped.

Here's some support for your theory of two sabers (I wouldn't call them Pre and Post production though- labels don't fit). The Luke pic in the VD is PRE-production (post-production were shot after his car accident). The saber matches the one seen in Chronicles which is POST-production. Film stills show the clamp on the opposite side. I suspect if you look hard enough both versions could be found on screen.
 

gavidoc

Well-Known Member
When I look at the 2 pictures you have posted, I see the following.

If the clamp is at the 3 o'clock position with the button being at 12, then the d-ring is positioned at the 7 o'clock position and is folded back over whatever is holding it to the base of the flashgun with the top of the "D" portion being in the middle.



If the d-ring was attached in the middle, IMO, the belt loop that hte sabre attaches to would be at a more drastic angle away from Mark's body since the clip would have to clear the outer radius of the grips, and the graflex.

Plus, during the movie, if the d-ring is atached in the middle and attached to Hamil's belt, it wouldn't flop around as much as it does due to the added tension between the clip and the sabre due to the stress the clip is experiencing from holding the sabre on with the attachement point being in the center of the flashgun and not on the end.

If the d-ring is attached along the edge, IMO, it fits with the amount of bouncing around the graflex experiences during the movie.
 

DARTH SABER

Master Member
Yes I admit that the flopping in the film used saber would justify a D-ring on the edge, and Im sure the screen used version had the D-ring on the edge....But Im referring to the pics of the saber used in the VD dictionary and other production photos....(Basically the version of the saber which has the control box on the opposite side of the screen used one.)
Gav you wrote...
</SPAN><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>Quote:<HR></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>"If the d-ring was attached in the middle, IMO, the belt loop that hte sabre attaches to would be at a more drastic angle away from Mark's body since the clip would have to clear the outer radius of the grips, and the graflex."</TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>

The drastic angle you speak of can be seen in the production pic of Luke in the VD..
I also brought up the "drastic angle" in my first post--
<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>Quote:<HR></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>1.) On page 8 of the SW Visual Dictionary you can see that the D-ring on Lukes belt hook is being pulled back at an angle towards the hook, what this tells me is that Lukes tunic or waist area is pushing the body of the saber forward while the D-ring is being pulled back because of the canter placement tension . This leads me to believe that the D-rings placement is in the center of the flashgun.
If it were on the edge the D-ring would be going straight up and there would be no tension pull because there wouldnt be any resistance from Luke waiste or tunic.
</TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>
Tell you what guys, grab a magnifying glass (humor me here) and take a very close look at the pic of Lukes D-ring attachment in the VD pic....I looked at it closely and saw the flat metal wrapped around the D-ring and continue flat against the bottom of the flashgun towards Luke belt hook.

And yes Im sure the saber was a pain to wear during the photo shoot
 

DARTH SABER

Master Member
THATS IT!!! Damn Gray Pilgrim, thats twice youve come through with the PICS!!!....

Alright guys as you can see in the NEW pic above, if the D-ring was resting on the edge of the Graflex the strip which wraps around the d-ring would have to run in the direction of the clamp, if it ran in the opposite direction it would run off the edge of the Graflex....But in the pic IT IS running in the direction of the belt hook, and this is made possible because the D-ring is positioned in the center rather than the edge giving enough room for the strip to lay on for riveting.

If you look at the empty space in front of the D-ring youll notice that NO flat metal is visible and NO rivot heads...The rivot is on the other side directly under the belt hook.
 

Grey Pilgrim

Well-Known Member
damn, i suppose i should have cropped it so you could see the clamp. oh well, there's always tomorrow. *yawn*
 

nick daring

Sr Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Well damn. That does look like it is in the middle.

I thought for sure you were just high on crack but now I'm not so sure. Now I think you're a speed freak.

Also, doesn't that D-ring look Brassy?

Nick

(edit typo)
 

itbedave

New Member
</SPAN><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>Quote:<HR></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>

Also, doesn't that D-ring look Brassy?

Nick

(edit typo)
</TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>

Yep - those are definitely 2 different colors of metal there. The D-ring isn't silver.
 

jediscout

Sr Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Before you commit to brass, don't forget that the entire image has a greeny/yellow cast to it.

It may be brass, but it could simply be a higher shine metal--which does look different from the flatter grey/silver look of the sabre body.
 

THX1138

Well-Known Member
O.K.... I have just recently aquired an original vintage copy (NOT a photo copy) of the photo shown in the link below:

http://www.geocities.com/ep2fett/7666717LsbkRonjUJ_ph.jpg

(You will have to Copy/Paste the link into your web address bar so you can view it. It won't show up by just clicking on the link because it's on geocities.)

The scan is very hazy, but I'm going to try and get a closup scan of the saber as soon as possible.

The picture shows some VERY nice details of the D-ring and bracket... which I might add IS closer to the center of the tube!

I would also like to mention that instead of the saber having 6 grips...

...it has 7 grips!!!

- Jim
 

jediscout

Sr Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER


That's the best (old) image I have. Your photo scanned in greater detail will be very helpful.
 

Grey Pilgrim

Well-Known Member
F$@*%! Looks like I may have to un-drill some holes in my GRAFLEX!

Just kidding, I Love this thread. Great find, Darth.
 

DARTH SABER

Master Member
Thanks for the kudos Grey Pilgram, I actually coundnt have conviced anyone if it hadnt been for your scan!...
</SPAN><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>Quote:<HR></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>F$@*%! Looks like I may have to un-drill some holes in my GRAFLEX!</TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>

I dont think you need to do that Pilgram, the screen used version has the D-ring on the edge.....I think.
 

lonepigeon

Sr Member
Anyone else notice that little mark inbetween the grips on scout's pic? (just about half and inch from the bottom of the saber) Could this be a hole? 7 grips...
Could this be the earliest pic of the Vader ROTJ?
Just wild speculation.

>>I dont think you need to do that Pilgram, the screen used version has the D-ring on the edge.....I think.<<

Nothing is certain anymore.
I'm glad I haven't converted my ANH yet.
 

DARTH SABER

Master Member
Here we go again....I just paused some scenes from ANH to see if the D-ring on Luke screen used saber might also be in the center....Well, what I found is a definate...maybe.

Theres only one scene which really shows Lukes D-ring .
This scene is about 2 seconds before Luke says to Ben "How did My father die?"...If youll notice Luke is holding the saber in his hand and no D-ring is visible... then all of a sudden the D-ring drops down (mustve been stuck upwards flat against the bottom)...
It kinda looks like the pivot point for the D-ring is also in the CENTER, but its a strange view and cant be sure.
Check it out yourself if you'd like and let me know what you think.
 
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