The Mandalorian (TV series)

[Usagi Pilgrim]

I've tried to figure out how to word this correctly, so please forgive any failure in that, but with The Mandalorian, I've seen where I think a lot of disconnect between fans comes from.

The buzz word I hear constantly now, be it from YouTubers, streaming services, media outlets, or even huge movie studios, is 'CONTENT'.

CONTENT is king in today's society, pretty much to the point that it overrules all else. The problem with CONTENT, is there's no standard as to what CONTENT must be. By that I mean, opinions aside, we ALL know what a bad movie looks like. We've seen them. We've read bad books. We've watched bad TV. Listened to bad albums. Most of the time, those things are judged as such & word or mouth or published reviews gave us the heads up to maybe not waste our time, but sometimes,a stinker will worm it's way through. Those things are self contained stories that fail in either story or execution to achieve their desired effect.

CONTENT, on the other hand, seems to be judged by the amount of it that can get put out. CONTENT has given us 'fake' news, click-bait, & unfortunately, an entertainment economy driven by CONTENT with a name branded on it, instead of the art of storytelling with effective execution.

Therein lies the problem with perception. What are we looking for?

Art or CONTENT?

Some great artists have created lasting art, only to have it sullied by the quality of later CONTENT. I personally believe that where we are, at this moment in time in Star Wars, is a battle of art vs CONTENT, & that will differ our opinions on shows like The Mandalorian.

I'm pretty much middle of the road here, cause I don't think GL walked on water, but I don't think The Mouse in inherently evil either. They've both hurt SW as a property in my eyes... George by revising his art, & Disney by wanting that almighty CONTENT. That leaves us where we are today, where all we can hope for is for some artists to be allowed to create CONTENT, because CONTENT is a'coming.

With The Mandalorian,I believe the artists have been allowed to tell the story that they want to, seemingly with low levels of interference from executives. I can't say that as a fact, because IDK how their hierarchy is set up, but with some of the creative forces associated with the upcoming shows, I think most have enough clout to be able to function with some sense of autonomy.

 

[CopperRevan]

MY MANDO STORY a Star Wars tale

after reading these threads, this what came to my mine about from start to finish of my own personal Star Wars story. Don't know why i'm always thinking of food but here goes:

Once upon a time, a brand new Italian restaurant opened up in town and the word was, the owner was also the head chef, but he had built this little restaurant from scratch and had poured his whole life into it. So, i decided to go check it out and it was by far, the best Italian food i had ever tasted. I kept coming back for more and as time went on, so did many others to the point of him having to expand the property to be able to seat more people. The food seemed to get better and better. After a while, the owner reasoned that he couldn't do this forever and that in order to keep expanding, he would eventually have to sell and did. It was a very sad for him and for me as well. So, after the sale i figured, well i don't want to stop eating at that restaurant, i just really love the food but the owners brought new chefs in. My first experience at the new restaurant was not that pleasant...didn't quite taste the same even though i saw a clear attempt at replication. Not only that, instead of it being an Italian restaurant, they tried to make it like a buffet. Well, i went home disappointed and thought well, everyone restaurant has a bad night every once and a while. Then it happened again and again. I was pretty upset and decided that the restaurant just was never going to be the same again like it was with the original owner and chefs so i stopped going there. I wanted home cooked Italian food, not a smorgasbord. Until one day, word began to spread about that restaurant. The word on the street was that the owners hired new chefs and that they were affiliates of the original owner/Chef. So, out of my love for that owner and original love of that restaurant, i decided to give it one last try. Wow!! the first bite was unbelievable. The second bite, even better!! I learned something about myself that day. Be patient. Don't give up on your first love and don't leave it...but love them enough to try to correct what needs correction. Just make sure you do it in an edifying way. Great!! now i'm really hungry..lol

 

[HMSwolfe]

I've tried to figure out how to word this correctly, so please forgive any failure in that, but with The Mandalorian, I've seen where I think a lot of disconnect between fans comes from.

The buzz word I hear constantly now, be it from YouTubers, streaming services, media outlets, or even huge movie studios, is 'CONTENT'.

CONTENT is king in today's society, pretty much to the point that it overrules all else. The problem with CONTENT, is there's no standard as to what CONTENT must be. By that I mean, opinions aside, we ALL know what a bad movie looks like. We've seen them. We've read bad books. We've watched bad TV. Listened to bad albums. Most of the time, those things are judged as such & word or mouth or published reviews gave us the heads up to maybe not waste our time, but sometimes,a stinker will worm it's way through. Those things are self contained stories that fail in either story or execution to achieve their desired effect.

CONTENT, on the other hand, seems to be judged by the amount of it that can get put out. CONTENT has given us 'fake' news, click-bait, & unfortunately, an entertainment economy driven by CONTENT with a name branded on it, instead of the art of storytelling with effective execution.

Therein lies the problem with perception. What are we looking for?

Art or CONTENT?

Some great artists have created lasting art, only to have it sullied by the quality of later CONTENT. I personally believe that where we are, at this moment in time in Star Wars, is a battle of art vs CONTENT, & that will differ our opinions on shows like The Mandalorian.

I'm pretty much middle of the road here, cause I don't think GL walked on water, but I don't think The Mouse in inherently evil either. They've both hurt SW as a property in my eyes... George by revising his art, & Disney by wanting that almighty CONTENT. That leaves us where we are today, where all we can hope for is for some artists to be allowed to create CONTENT, because CONTENT is a'coming.

With The Mandalorian,I believe the artists have been allowed to tell the story that they want to, seemingly with low levels of interference from executives. I can't say that as a fact, because IDK how their hierarchy is set up, but with some of the creative forces associated with the upcoming shows, I think most have enough clout to be able to function with some sense of autonomy.

I totally agree, but I fear the real danger is when we as an audience cease to be an audience and become consumers. When the CONTENT is what we judge art by, or what we expect when we see more CONTENT. Disney has the resources to do unlimited amounts of art, but they want more CONTENT, because it’s easier and has less pushback when it’s not as good. If they get us hooked on or connected to the CONTENT, we’ll just want more of that. That’s why I don’t get the anger in some threads here over genuine criticism of the show. It’s not a terrible show. It’s also not great. It has some good moments, and some real potential, and it also has areas it could improve. The attitude “it’s more Star Wars just be glad we have anything you should just be happy” is in line with buffet thinking, not food made with care. Things don’t change/get better unless criticism is given. Even if you liked Mandalorian without caveat, the show being better would still be in your favor.

 

[CopperRevan]

I totally agree, but I fear the real danger is when we as an audience cease to be an audience and become consumers. When the CONTENT is what we judge art by, or what we expect when we see more CONTENT. Disney has the resources to do unlimited amounts of art, but they want more CONTENT, because it’s easier and has less pushback when it’s not as good. If they get us hooked on or connected to the CONTENT, we’ll just want more of that. That’s why I don’t get the anger in some threads here over genuine criticism of the show. It’s not a terrible show. It’s also not great. It has some good moments, and some real potential, and it also has areas it could improve. The attitude “it’s more Star Wars just be glad we have anything you should just be happy” is in line with buffet thinking, not food made with care. Things don’t change/get better unless criticism is given. Even if you liked Mandalorian without caveat, the show being better would still be in your favor.

i literally just mentioned buffet in my last post...lol did you read it already? thats crazy

 

[HMSwolfe]

i literally just mentioned buffet in my last post...lol did you read it already? thats crazy

It popped up while I was writing, the imagery seemed appropriate.

 

[CopperRevan]

It popped up while I was writing, the imagery seemed appropriate.

Totally agree with your point...

 

[Psab keel]

I totally agree, but I fear the real danger is when we as an audience cease to be an audience and become consumers. When the CONTENT is what we judge art by, or what we expect when we see more CONTENT. Disney has the resources to do unlimited amounts of art, but they want more CONTENT, because it’s easier and has less pushback when it’s not as good. If they get us hooked on or connected to the CONTENT, we’ll just want more of that. That’s why I don’t get the anger in some threads here over genuine criticism of the show. It’s not a terrible show. It’s also not great. It has some good moments, and some real potential, and it also has areas it could improve. The attitude “it’s more Star Wars just be glad we have anything you should just be happy” is in line with buffet thinking, not food made with care. Things don’t change/get better unless criticism is given. Even if you liked Mandalorian without caveat, the show being better would still be in your favor.

This is spot on. If they want to treat the material as a consumer good then I think it's reasonable to have honest feedback, even if it means the company eating crow at times and doing better the next time around. If we talk about it in business terms then it's ideal to have a win/ win. There's no reason it has to be win/ lose. What company wants bad press about their product? No one. Just like a consumer doesn't want to feel ripped off. I applauded the Mandalorian for taking a risk that mostly worked and gave fans something new. What I find troublesome is the need to retreat (at least in this latest season) back to more stable ground.

 

[Usagi Pilgrim]

I totally agree, but I fear the real danger is when we as an audience cease to be an audience and become consumers. When the CONTENT is what we judge art by, or what we expect when we see more CONTENT. Disney has the resources to do unlimited amounts of art, but they want more CONTENT, because it’s easier and has less pushback when it’s not as good. If they get us hooked on or connected to the CONTENT, we’ll just want more of that. That’s why I don’t get the anger in some threads here over genuine criticism of the show. It’s not a terrible show. It’s also not great. It has some good moments, and some real potential, and it also has areas it could improve. The attitude “it’s more Star Wars just be glad we have anything you should just be happy” is in line with buffet thinking, not food made with care. Things don’t change/get better unless criticism is given. Even if you liked Mandalorian without caveat, the show being better would still be in your favor.

Yes, absolutely!

I guess the issue comes with what's being criticized, simply because there are things some enjoy, but they can still merit criticism.

 

[CelticRuins]

This article does a pretty good job outlining my worry about where The Mandalorian may be headed next season. (Warning: contains reference to TLJ in a positive context and unflattering characterizations of Star Wars fans.)

Has The Mandalorian Succumbed to the Dark Side?

The final moments of the season-two finale represent the galaxy-collapsing shortsightedness that has come to define Disney-era Star Wars stories.

www.vulture.com

The second-season finale of The Mandalorian was the best of Star Wars and the worst of Star Wars, a momentarily thrilling and moving episode that, once you stepped back and took a hard look at it, felt more like a victory for the dark side.
___________________

It’s hard to capture in words the galaxy-collapsing shortsightedness of requiring that every new Star Wars tale ultimately connect, however tangentially, with the same handful of genetically linked characters. Star Wars’ bizarre obsession with Force-amplifying, midi-chlorian-rich blood, and the proximity of “regular” characters to those with special blood, makes Lucas’s galaxy far, far away — a place so vast that you need hyperspace to cross it — feel as rinky-dink as a backwater American town, the kind of place where everybody is required to kiss the same local family’s butt for survival’s sake. Every time a Star Wars story genuflects to the Skywalker saga yet again, Lucas’s mythos shrinks further in the collective imagination. Sometimes it’s so small-minded that you’d think Disney’s mandate was to reimagine Mayberry with starships and laser swords.

Thus does the galactic rim in the post–Civil War era — thrillingly envisioned by Favreau and his Mandalorian writers as a science-fiction fusion of two related genres, the spaghetti Western and the samurai adventure — pivot without warning toward insularity. Thus does a great character like Pedro Pascal’s Din Djarin — an orphan who adopted a fundamentalist interpretation of Mandalorian self-identity and a genocide survivor who feels kinship with members of the Alderaan diaspora — become a mere extra upon the cosmic stage, fascinating not because of how he practices or compromises his beliefs but because he briefly met the dude who faced down Vader and the Emperor. And thus Grogu, a member of the same species as Yoda, becomes worthy of our attention not because he’s a case study in nature and nurture — possessing dark and light impulses and open to manipulation and corruption by vile tricksters like Moff Gideon (Giancarlo Esposito) — but because Luke deemed him important enough to rescue. He has a special purpose, you see. Not like all those other gifted kids throughout the galaxy who need a parent to guide them toward the light.

Just came to say that I read this article earlier and was in love with it. It's everything this last episode made me think and more.

PS: Boba is cool, but I don't think he's cool enough to warrant his own show. And I kinda liked the rag-tag team that was starting to form. I didn't want them to stay as the team through each episode, as that's a bit much, but they were nice to have on retainer.

Boba's show has now put the Mandalorian on the back burner until the mini series is done with production, possibly pushing it further from it's initial release date.

I can also say with out a doubt, that the only show they've announced that I have even the smallest inkling of interest in is the Ahsoka series. Just because of Thrawn and the Rebels crew possibly appearing.

"This impulse is forever implying, sometimes flat out saying, that things were better the way they used to be; that nothing needs to change; that there’s no better way of doing things, or even looking at things; and, therefore, everybody needs to just shut up and watch those lightsabers-go-brrrr."

That. All of it.

I hope this show can pull back from this and go back to the simplicity that it was prior to this finale.

 

[Sluis Van Shipyards]

So I just found out today that Ming-Na Wen (Fennec) is 57! No way does she look anywhere close to that.

I told my 17yo nephew that when we watched the finale last week. He appears to have been doing some thinking because he said "She could be my grandma! I thought she was in her 20s!"

 

[ctorange]

Has anyone taken a good look at luke's new hilt? It appears to be based on the hero. I'm not sure I like luke showing up in the show, but at least I can geek out over his hilt and costume details.

 

[AnubisGuard]

So what the heck is going on with Artoo's shoulders?
View attachment 1381478

That's the only shot I could see where it's like that. The wide shots they're normal.

 

[harrisonp]

Has anyone taken a good look at luke's new hilt? It appears to be based on the hero. I'm not sure I like luke showing up in the show, but at least I can geek out over his hilt and costume details.

There’s a whole thread about it, “Mandalorian spoiler prop” or something to that effect

 

[Psab keel]

Right off the bat I noticed a visible hook and eye clasp, and a large one at that used to hold the cloak closed. Breaking George's number one costuming ethos in having no visible closures on costumes in order to help keep them timeless.

 

[harrisonp]

Right off the bat I noticed a visible hook and eye clasp, and a large one at that used to hold the cloak closed. Breaking George's number one costuming ethos in having no visible closures on costumes in order to help keep them timeless.

ANH has visible buttons on some of the Rebel uniforms at the award ceremony

 

[Psab keel]

With the amount of costumes Star Wars contains it's pretty amazing how consistent they've mostly been. My observation was more a personal gripe as a costumer than an actual criticism. Not a deal breaker for me, just not how I would have done it had I designed it.

 

[harrisonp]

With the amount of costumes Star Wars contains it's pretty amazing how consistent they've mostly been. My observation was more a personal gripe as a costumer than an actual criticism. Not a deal breaker for me, just not how I would have done it had I designed it.

I just wanted to be pedantic, I totally agree with the design ethos for Star Wars. It’s something I really struggle with whenever I try to design an in universe original character look.

 

[obiwan kowalski]

Did anyone else notice the tribute statue to IG-11 in the town square on Navaro? About 8:30 into chapter 4 of season 2, The Siege.

 

[Captain Dunsel]

I have to admit that The Drinker is, objectively, 100% on-point with much of his assessment of Season 2. Moreover, he is dead-on regarding the current state of fandom, in general, and its impact on the reactions to the finale:

 

[Strikerkc]