Studio Scale TIE Fighter

Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

Spoke to Steve yesterday.............this is the first week he's been on a normal day schedule, and he will be be working on kits etc......Thursday-Sat from now on. He will be doing all shipping on Thursdays starting next week. He just wanted me to pass that along to the group.

Peace,

Dave :)
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

That material is undercut all over the place by its very nature, so you'll have to fill in the slats partially using clay. It could be tricky to mold. . .

The vertical "stripes" are really more like twisted ropes made of two pieces of thin wire. The slats are bronze metal strips woven into that wire.

I got my Koolshade in, and it may be enough to do one TIE - but one TIE only. I totally zarked up my TIE Bomber, so I am going to go with something I was playing around with last night. TIE Fans might like it, but it goes in the general forum... I will post there when I can find the darned USB cord to my new camera...
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

A couple of questions from a newbie:

Flintlock: How much Koolshade did you get to cover one TIE?

Also, I have seen the PVC foam board for sale in websites. What is the thickness necessary, and would getting a black finish save the trouble of painting the underlayment or is the Koolshade and foam board painted as one complete surface? Thanks!

-David
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

A couple of questions from a newbie:

Flintlock: How much Koolshade did you get to cover one TIE?

Also, I have seen the PVC foam board for sale in websites. What is the thickness necessary, and would getting a black finish save the trouble of painting the underlayment or is the Koolshade and foam board painted as one complete surface? Thanks!

-David

I have 8 square feet, but I don't know if that is enough. If they have black PVC, then you can get that if you like, but you're going to paint the whole model anyway. It shouldn't be too much trouble to paint the foam. Jamie says that 1/8" (0.125") is the right size to get, and I trust that he is correct. I haven't yet checked myself. There has to be enough width inside the 1/4" H column to accommodate the thickness of the foam and 2 layers (1 each side) of koolshade.

Oh, and I am fairly certain that the underside (the foam) gets painted black and the koolshade gets left as-is (since it is already black). It has a sheen to it, but it's not super-high gloss. I would bet that if you painted it with a gloss black, it might look too shiny.

If you can afford it, get some extra and play around until it looks right.
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

As far as Koolshade goes you will need 2' X 6' roll includes some extra for scew ups $235.00 shipped from coopers in the UK. the center material needs to be 1mm thick.

Steve
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

Foamcore? I would strongly recommend that you don't use that. First, on the ANH TIE, the only material in between the inner and outer layers of KoolShade was black paper. (That's right -- just thin black paper!) It was used only to prevent you from seeing right through the material. There was no underlying panel in there -- at least not on the damaged TIE recently sold at auction.

Second, foamcore warps very readily and so it is not dimensionally stable. The paper surface absorbs moisture which causes it to curl and thereby warp. In addition, the foam inside is not very dense and so it is pretty weak. This, combined with the paper layer on the outside, makes the material relatively fragile.

If you really need to use something like a foam composite sheet, a much better choice is Gatorboard (not Gatorfoam). Gatorboard isn't available in a 1/8-inch thickness (it starts at 3/16 inch), but it's tough as nails and is pretty much as dimensionally stable as quality plywood. It's hard has heck to cut and can dull your knife blade quickly, but it can be laser-cut beautifully. The outer paper surface of this material is impregnated with a tough resin.

Gatorboard is still susceptible to moisture, so it should be sealed. If you coat the surface with water-thin epoxy, you'll have a strong, lightweight, and dimensionally stable composite part that should be good for many years of service.

Why worry about this sort of thing? I don't hear it discussed very often, but models made out of a variety of materials can have problems like cracking, warping, and separating over time because different materials expand and contract at different rates. The safest situation is when the entire model is made of one material, like resin or fiberglass. When you have different materials combined together, it's wise to be careful.

I've heard this from quite a few experienced experts, and it's the sort of thing museums take into account when acquiring models that are meant to be preserved for a lifetime. Just think of all the effort (and expense) that you are investing in your project. Do you want the finished result to stand the test of time?

If so, the key is keeping the model in a climate-controlled environment at all times. Avoid big temperature swings, direct sunlight, and, most of all, humidity. This is always a good idea when you build something out of non-homogeneous materials that can expand/contract at different rates -- especially wood or paper. Anything that is susceptible to moisture can actually swell if exposed to enough humidity.

Hope that helps! :)
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

Charles, he was referring to PVC Foam board. It is a very dense and sturdy foam - the same thing Jamie is using in his wings. I didn't know it was just paper in between on the studio model.
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

Aha, thanks for the clarification! I have seen that, but I haven't worked with it before. It looks like interesting stuff. :)

I don't claim to be any sort of expert on the TIE so I don't know for sure what was used on the wings for all the different models they made. I do know, however, that only paper was present on the vintage model that recently sold at Profiles. A friend of mine actually had his hands on that model so he got a real good look at it.

To tell the truth, I can't imagine those wings staying flat with only the resin "arms" of the stars for structural support. That KoolShade is pretty heavy stuff. Back then they often secured it in place with hotmelt glue. So, you'd think something else would be needed for structural integrity.

When I finally get around to completing my own TIE, I'm thinking about using thin aluminum sheet in there as a "core."
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

Yeah, Charles, I think he was referring to what I call Sintra - http://store.foamboardsource.com/sintra-pvc-foam.html

I have some of the stuff and it is useful. At 1/8" thicknesses, it's easier to cut that plex, lighter, and takes superglue really well (almost too well). You can get thicker sheets as well. It still warps when subjected to heat or water, but still good stuff. It has a slightly pebbled surface on the top and bottom. The sides, or any edges you cut, will have a cell texture as it is a dense foam.

As for the TIE, yep, I was amazed when I looked between the wing panels and saw paper sticking out. It wasn't tracing paper mind you, but I was expecting the thicker piece of plastic. Obviously, I didn't take it apart, but the wing seemed damned thin all the way to the hub. And there was no trace of glue residue oozing out from between the koolshade slats.

Gene
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

The product I was looking at was Sintra. Thanks for sharing all the useful info!

Now if I can just track down a kit to use the info with! :lol

-David
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

I buy a lot of structure plastic from a local sign maker. It's pvc plastic used outdoors etc. Very tough stuff and once bonded it's impossible to separate. I like it.

I understand the "damaged" portion of the wing has paper between it. Ripples and the shedding effect would be impossible to do with a heavy backing.

I can't see any gap of any kind between the sandwich of the coolshade and the H beam struts. IF there were a thinner material used for all the wings not only would they be flimsy structurally but there would be a gap between the edges right?

Two pieces of coolshade + .125 material offers a nice snug fit between the H beam. Does this make sense to you guys? Or am I doing this incorrectly?
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

The product I was looking at was Sintra. Thanks for sharing all the useful info!

Now if I can just track down a kit to use the info with! :lol

-David

Naw... build your own! More fun...

Is that Sintra stuff the same as this:

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXTLE0 ?

That's the stuff I had. It only comes in white and it's surface is harder than its interior. It's really nice stuff. I know that the Midwest sheets are not big enough for a TIE Wing, but I got some 0.040" 4' X 8' sheets from a local plastics supplier. The 0.040" is actually 1mm, and it comes in 2 and 3mm as well.

If the Sintra is the same stuff, I might look into that as well.

P.S. In the description for the Midwest foam it says "flexible." It is flexible, but thicker pieces take a lot to bend. It is rigid. If you held it out straight, it would not bend under its own weight. The 0.040" would, but not the thicker pieces. It does not scribe and snap well, but it's not hard to cut all the way through.
 
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Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

All the imput sounds good. All paper wing, I know was used on the Pyros.. you can see it clearly in one of the behind the scenes videos.Paper/cardboard covered by the koolshade. If you were to choose a full paper construction not to sure how stong the wing would be. They used aluminum foil in the Damaged part of the wing on the TIE for the collision scene in Empire. (crunches better than paper)

I agree with Gene the wings are super thin... you can see on some reference the entire wing collapes towards the middle. Then again some do not.

Damn Gene! You should have taken that wing apart! Thanks for the inside scoop. If you are careful when you glue there should be no glue visible... the koolshade is only glued where the wing struts cover. Ive built 2 Heros... and I used 1mm styrene sheet for the core of my wings. Black of course and no visible glue when complete. Damn strong too.

Im about share your expierences building, unless we can get Lorne P. to under go hypnosis to recover information long forgotton, or break into the archives and pull one apart we will never know... I think sound structure on the final build sould be considered. Pictures guys! Pictures!

Guys waiting on Koolshade: I got a email from coopers (Koolshade order) and Andreea said they will go out on monday as she is out of the office this weekend. 2 to 3 day shipping option was selected.
The remainder of the Hero kits ship today. I have a few wing sets to send out next week but as far as complete kits the Hero TIE back order is complete.

Standard TIE Fighter is on deck!

I will be having some serious update news on some new master patterns being made right now in the TIE relm... :love John is working like crazy to get these finished, I'll post pictures as soon as were closer to the final build... sorry bout the cloak and dagger stuff, this update is gonna be huge!

Steve
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

I will be having some serious update news on some new master patterns being made right now in the TIE relm... :love John is working like crazy to get these finished, I'll post pictures as soon as were closer to the final build... sorry bout the cloak and dagger stuff, this update is gonna be huge!

Steve

Sounds great Steve! I'm sure there will be plenty of interest in the upcoming Vader TIE but I sure hope you finish up with all you owe before you go on taking on other projects.

Just trying to keep things real. :love
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

I can't see any gap of any kind between the sandwich of the coolshade and the H beam struts. IF there were a thinner material used for all the wings not only would they be flimsy structurally but there would be a gap between the edges right?

Two pieces of coolshade + .125 material offers a nice snug fit between the H beam. Does this make sense to you guys? Or am I doing this incorrectly?

Jamie, are you using the Plastruct ABS H-Beam or the Evergreen or Plastruct fineline styrene H-Beam? The walls of the ABS H is thicker, and would leave less room in between.
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

Good point. I think most or all of the Plastruct/EMA stuff back then was the thicker ABS material. I don't recall seeing the "Fineline Styrene" stuff until recently.

Jamie, what is the total thickness of your wings? Which H-beam are you using? I'm guessing the correct H-beam has a thickness of .06 for each ridge, that's 1/8 inch just for the material. I don't recall exactly how thick the KoolShade is (I have some but I'd need to mic it), but I'm guessing it's a good .06 or more just by itself, right?
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

Sounds great Steve! I'm sure there will be plenty of interest in the upcoming Vader TIE but I sure hope you finish up with all you owe before you go on taking on other projects.

Just trying to keep things real. :love

Rolando, Please read the post again.. it says "John" is working on the new patterns...not me... Im filling back orders and other commitments. Nice guess on the Vader TIE but thats only the 1/2 of it. :) We have timed it to be done about the same time I'm finished with all prior commitments.

Besides, If I wanted to take new orders I sure dont have to wait on a new project to come out... Im turning down requests for new orders every day... that is till I get caught up. Its tuff but the right thing to do.

Dont mind you keeping it real... for the most part, Ive always valued your guidance. Lets just keep the TIE thread on track, I cant wait to see what they are building.

I'm doing what I said I would, getting things caught up before any new kits are done. Like I said before I'm working on Standard TIE's now, then Interceptors and then AT-ST's.

As far as new orders... when it comes time.. let me STRESS the when...I will never take $$ again before a model is ready to ship. Never no way. Having no backlog will be refreshing.. Ive talked with other model makers and they agree being behind the power curve sucks! Ive had a lot of folks wanting to help on the buisness side of things so i can focus on model making and new project development. I'll worry about that stuff when we get there. Were not there yet.

Steve
 
Re: STUDIO SCALE TIE FIGHTER **UPDATED PICS**

Good point. I think most or all of the Plastruct/EMA stuff back then was the thicker ABS material. I don't recall seeing the "Fineline Styrene" stuff until recently.

Jamie, what is the total thickness of your wings? Which H-beam are you using? I'm guessing the correct H-beam has a thickness of .06 for each ridge, that's 1/8 inch just for the material. I don't recall exactly how thick the KoolShade is (I have some but I'd need to mic it), but I'm guessing it's a good .06 or more just by itself, right?


The koolshade is right at .060 just put a mic on it.

Yep there is a difference between the styrene and ABS "H" beam. I didn't know this... SO the abs has a .200" gap and the syrene has a .220" gap. .80" material or .140" me thinks .80" woops!
 
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