New Elstree Studio documentary with discarded Graflex.

[IronDestinyProps]

ie the base against one jaw the other end against the opposite jaw.

To be able to make that work, they would have needed about a 6" bench vise, but that would mean the opposite side of the flashgun rim where the batteries go in would also be dinged up/crushed as well. I'm inclined to think a hammer was employed on the bottom because if a vise was used it would not only crush the bottom side but also the opposite twist/lock side and deform it to where it might not fit into the clamp correctly. As you can see in the photos of the Elstree hilt, the bottom tube fits perfectly into the clamp.

Also, you will notice the end of the Elstree hilt is dented on mainly one side of the bottom, and you can see how the tube towards the end is bowed outward at just the spot where the dings are located which in my mind seems to elude to the use of a blunt object. A framing, waffle faced hammer could not only leave the dings/jagged surface behind but would be able to deliver a blow causing the bowed out metal deformation in just that spot on the hilt. What do you all think?

 

[R5D4]

This failed stunt Graflex has to be the hardest thing to replicate

 

[scottjua]

Why is there theory about the dent? Dear lord talk about over thinking it... it was dropped, fell, whatever and hit something hard and rugged like concrete.

 

[Halliwax]

Why is there theory about the dent? Dear lord talk about over thinking it... it was dropped, fell, whatever and hit something hard and rugged like concrete.

Thank you

 

[SethS]

Why is there theory about the dent? Dear lord talk about over thinking it... it was dropped, fell, whatever and hit something hard and rugged like concrete.

OR DID IT!?!?

 

[Mouse Vader]

Why is there theory about the dent?

Wouldn't be the RPF if there wasn't....

 

[roygilsing]

I agree with Scott on this. 0.5mm differences in rivet diameter: YES, but the cause of a dent: NO [emoji1]

 

[Dann]

*Breathes a sigh of relief*

Thank you, Roy and Scott. I agree. Some of this theorizing of late has been not only exhausting, but I wonder about the relevance of a lot of it.

 

[Trooper_trent]

Exactly Roy.

I guess you guys don't know about the "tuna sandwich theory" yet on how the D-ring got dented like that. Too bad I can't talk about it.

I'm all for relevant things like debating the size of rivets and analyzing whether the glare causes blow out or not, because it helps us get closer to an accurate REPLICA. but just speculating on why or how or when isn't beneficial. Yeah it's got a scratch. cool, lets replicate the scratch. But, guessing this scratch was caused by Roger's cat when he accidentally put his tail in a vice is just speculation for its own sake. That in and of itself isn't necessarily a problem except when it's followed by "Prove that it wasn't." which isn't how it works.

 

[Trooper_trent]

*Breathes a sigh of relief*

Thank you, Roy and Scott. I agree. Some of this theorizing of late has been not only exhausting, but I wonder about the relevance of a lot of it.

There's a new thing that's happened this year. I've been here for almost 20 years and have never seen it this bad. It's maddening.

 

[SethS]

Exactly Roy.

I guess you guys don't know about the "tuna sandwich theory" yet on how the D-ring got dented like that. Too bad I can't talk about it.

I'm all for relevant things like debating the size of rivets and analyzing whether the glare causes blow out or not, because it helps us get closer to an accurate REPLICA. but just speculating on why or how or when isn't beneficial. Yeah it's got a scratch. cool, lets replicate the scratch. But, guessing this scratch was caused by Roger's cat when he accidentally put his tail in a vice is just speculation for its own sake. That in and of itself isn't necessarily a problem except when it's followed by "Prove that it wasn't." which isn't how it works.

THAT'S JUST WHAT THEY WANT YOU TO THINK

 

[Edraven99]

Exactly Roy.

I guess you guys don't know about the "tuna sandwich theory" yet on how the D-ring got dented like that. Too bad I can't talk about it.

Um... I was told that it was a grilled cheese sandwich... get your facts straight.

 

[Trooper_trent]

Um... I was told that it was a grilled cheese sandwich... get your facts straight.

Well hold on a minute. Let’s exhaustively break down your term grilled cheese because what you actually mean when you say grilled is tuna and what you really mean by cheese is salad. So you’re really agreeing with me based on my extensive knowledge of tuna salad and its immense history, including its origins in the UK and how it was sometimes called grilled cheese mistakenly until the Yankees set them straight. They also confused feathers for macaroni so I’m told.

All kidding aside you can only break things down and analyze every single point so much before communication itself starts breaking down and everyone spirals down into hard solipsism. Although, I am half expecting someone to correct me on the real reason yankee doodle’s feathered cap was called macaroni.


See? You guys are already arguing and you haven’t even heard the tuna sandwich theory yet. I know! I’ll start a new thread about it!


Anyway, sorry, back on topic. I love all the overlays on the rivets. I'm also not quite convinced they're different sizes, but that's based purely on a gut feeling that the one pic does in fact have blow out and that they were most likely pulled from the same bin of rivets. But I could easily be wrong. Roy, I bought some stuff from you this morning in fact, because i wanted to look at it up close and in person.

 

[SethS]

WAKE UP SHEEPLE

 

[AnubisGuard]

You guys are already arguing and you haven’t even heard the tuna sandwich theory yet.

TELL US

We must argue.

 

[Trooper_trent]

TELL US

We must argue.

I can't go into details because of the super secret society I belong to which has privileged information about things like how props got their dents. but it basically involves the circumstances surrounding how this particular dent (red arrow) came to be.

I'm not talking about ANY of the other dents. Every one of those other dents will each get their own thread.

Anyway,
My theory is that this one was caused when the shop tech was taking a lunch break and had mayonnaise on his mouth from his tuna sandwich. When he went to grab a napkin, he accidentally bumped a tray of screws which fell on the floor. A shop hand happened to walk by at the same time and skidded on them like marbles, flailing his arms in a cartoonish fashion and hit the edge of a ruler that was sitting on the bench. The ruler went flying end over end (and in slow motion) and flipped off the light switch to the shop, which put everyone in the dark. The first guy, still trying to reach for a napkin, grabbed a drill by mistake and tried to wipe his mouth with it but when he realized it wasn't a napkin, he tossed it in a very surprised and dramatic way, making an "EEEK!" sound as if to say "EEEK! That's a DRILL, not a NAPKIN!". The drill spun in the air and miraculously landed bit side down right on the edge of the D-ring in this particular spot, and in an amazing one-in-a-million chance (I did the math), stood there perfectly balanced on the bit for about 10 seconds while the whole shop stood in amazement, half the dark, staring at it, with mayonnaise covered faces, before it finally fell over. That's how that one dent got there.
Now, some will say it was 10.3 seconds and some will say it was only 6.25 seconds. But I know what I was told so... you can't prove it wasn't.

The other dents were caused just because it fell in some gravel, but we'll deconstruct exactly WHICH piece of gravel cause each dent in numerous upcoming threads that I'm about to post.

 

[James Kenobi 1138]

In almost 17 years on the RPF I've never rolled my eyes so much or so hard as I have in this thread.

"I think the prop team added those extra rivets"
" I think the photographer added those rivets"

Who cares. Let's talk about the size, position, and how to best exactly replicate the prop. Who gives a flip who put them there. Just like the Robertson screw, just like the calculator case screws, just like pulling 'vintage' d-ring clips off of camera cases- everyone is so desperate to be 'right' and hold on to something that makes a prop unique.

Turns out we had the d-ring wrong all along. Funny, I remember people willing to die on the hill that the prop makers MUST have pulled the d-rings off an old camera cases because of course they would have had one along with the flash handle.

Sorry to sound harsh but all the speculation in this threat has been just ridiculous.

 

[scottjua]

I can't go into details because of the super secret society I belong to which has privileged information about things like how props got their dents. but it basically involves the circumstances surrounding how this particular dent (red arrow) came to be.
View attachment 1062515

I'm not talking about ANY of the other dents. Every one of those other dents will each get their own thread.

Anyway,
My theory is that this one was caused when the shop tech was taking a lunch break and had mayonnaise on his mouth from his tuna sandwich. When he went to grab a napkin, he accidentally bumped a tray of screws which fell on the floor. A shop hand happened to walk by at the same time and skidded on them like marbles, flailing his arms in a cartoonish fashion and hit the edge of a ruler that was sitting on the bench. The ruler went flying end over end (and in slow motion) and flipped off the light switch to the shop, which put everyone in the dark. The first guy, still trying to reach for a napkin, grabbed a drill by mistake and tried to wipe his mouth with it but when he realized it wasn't a napkin, he tossed it in a very surprised and dramatic way, making an "EEEK!" sound as if to say "EEEK! That's a DRILL, not a NAPKIN!". The drill spun in the air and miraculously landed bit side down right on the edge of the D-ring in this particular spot, and in an amazing one-in-a-million chance (I did the math), stood there perfectly balanced on the bit for about 10 seconds while the whole shop stood in amazement, half the dark, staring at it, with mayonnaise covered faces, before it finally fell over. That's how that one dent got there.
Now, some will say it was 10.3 seconds and some will say it was only 6.25 seconds. But I know what I was told so... you can't prove it wasn't.

The other dents were caused just because it fell in some gravel, but we'll deconstruct exactly WHICH piece of gravel cause each dent in numerous upcoming threads that I'm about to post.

Can I rebut your story? Or do I have to wait 42.67 minutes and make sure my answer is at least 2 paragraphs long???

 

[Trooper_trent]

Can I rebut your story? Or do I have to wait 42.67 minutes and make sure my answer is at least 2 paragraphs long???

lol man, I want to keep going with this, but i'm already stepping over the facetious line and encroaching on A-hole turf so I need to stop.
I would really like to see this back on the actual topic of discussing the Elstree prop and these new amazing discoveries.

 

[Gregatron]

You are all weak.

Seriously, though, some of the theories have indeed been off-the-wall. That being said, speculation--LOGICAL speculation which fits the available facts--can be healthy and informative. The why of something can sometimes be the key to unlocking the what and how of something. Deductive reasoning, rather than wild spitballing.