Molds, ownership, and casting.

[dachande]

From the STUDIO PRODUCED MOLDS. Not someone's second generation mold off of an original casting. Hope that makes it clear enough for you.

If you do not have permission to make these from the original mold, it's still an unauthorized item.

Also if your original item is a replica of a famous prop, whether you created or sculpted the item yourself from scratch, if you do not own the rights to the underlying material, you could still be considered infringing on the studio's/IP owner's rights. If the prop is someone's likeness (busts, statue, etc) you could be in violation of Right of Publicity laws.

 

[Zombie Killer]

I know Wiki is to be taken with a grain of salt but i think this is a good read. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use

I think we are all fine on anything we make for ourselves, that is if we are willing to go to court and prove that by making whatever we've made we are not taking money from the license holder. In other words prove that if we didn't make it we also wouldn't buy it from the license holder. If you post pics of a prop you've made and have inspired someone else, who was going to buy a licensed prop, to make his own rather then buy one then you are violating the law. Burden of proof is on the defendant so they can accuse you of anything and you will have to prove things that can't be proven. What a mess.

 

[rollerboi]

I think we are all fine on anything we make for ourselves, that is if we are willing to go to court and prove that by making whatever we've made we are not taking money from the license holder. In other words prove that if we didn't make it we also wouldn't buy it from the license holder. If you post pics of a prop you've made and have inspired someone else, who was going to buy a licensed prop, to make his own rather then buy one then you are violating the law. Burden of proof is on the defendant so they can accuse you of anything and you will have to prove things that can't be proven. What a mess.

Good luck with that. :lol

 

[defstartrooper]

There is no honor among thieves.

There most certainly is with some of us, and yes i'm a thief as are you and 99.9% of all the members here in one way or another.
That doesn't mean i lack honour, i wouldn't copy another members or another replica propmakers work without permission.

 

[micdavis]

Neither would I. Nor would most other people here. But some would and some do.

All I think should happen is people shouldn't ***** about it WHEN it happens, it just seems so ridiculous to target others WHEN it happens. It raises too many red flags in general.

I've recently had a trust broken, but I didn't start a thread crying like a five year old. Because in the end WE have NO rights.

 

[defstartrooper]

Neither would I. Nor would most other people here. But some would and some do.

All I think should happen is people shouldn't ***** about it WHEN it happens, it just seems so ridiculous to target others WHEN it happens. It raises too many red flags in general.

I've recently had a trust broken, but I didn't start a thread crying like a five year old. Because in the end WE have NO rights.

Now come on Mic you're guilty of shouting about it and you know you are, even though the party you were shouting about hadn't produced anything and was telling you they were redoing the items from scratch not your work.

Andromeda strain keys ?

I know the matter was resolved and satisfactory to all parties in the end but you did openly complain about it on the forum beforehand.

 

[micdavis]

Incorrect. I commented in the thread in question. Didn't start one. Voiced my complaint (2 comments) and moved on. No witch hunt. Didn't call for the guy's head and then came to a resolution.

 

[madrobot]

If you do not have permission to make these from the original mold, it's still an unauthorized item.

Also if your original item is a replica of a famous prop, whether you created or sculpted the item yourself from scratch, if you do not own the rights to the underlying material, you could still be considered infringing on the studio's/IP owner's rights. If the prop is someone's likeness (busts, statue, etc) you could be in violation of Right of Publicity laws.

I agree with you completely, and had thought my post was clear in those regards, as I stated about the original sculpture caveat.

If you're making a prop of someone else's intellectual property, you're breaking the law.

I ran into this recently with a piece of work that I sculpted on spec. Someone got a casting and then went on to claim that they sculpted it. The piece in question was picked up by a company who produces collectibles.

What I found to be interesting is that I had no leg to stand on, and no legal recourse. Oh sure I have the quiet satisfaction that some hack stole my work, but nothing else.

 

[defstartrooper]

Incorrect. I commented in the thread in question. Didn't start one. Voiced my complaint (2 comments) and moved on. No witch hunt. Didn't call for the guy's head and then came to a resolution.

Of course you didn't start the thread they did by asking for screencaps that's all they asked for and you came along and started accusing them of using drawings you had made of a prop you don't hold the rights to.
1 post or 500 really isn't the point you complained and made accusations so i guess you're just as hypocritical as everyone else.

Or do you want to amend the MicDavis rules on calling out recasting to allow for 1 or 2 posts of an accusary nature ?

 

[defstartrooper]

I agree with you completely, and had thought my post was clear in those regards, as I stated about the original sculpture caveat.

If you're making a prop of someone else's intellectual property, you're breaking the law.

I ran into this recently with a piece of work that I sculpted on spec. Someone got a casting and then went on to claim that they sculpted it. The piece in question was picked up by a company who produces collectibles.

What I found to be interesting is that I had no leg to stand on, and no legal recourse. Oh sure I have the quiet satisfaction that some hack stole my work, but nothing else.

It's a replica prop forum though isn't it not an original prop forum it's pretty difficult to produce replicas without stealing someones work.

 

[micdavis]

you're just as hypocritical as everyone else.

Yep, JUST like everyone else.

 

[sskunky]

OK,

So as always this topic has got slightly sour with some. I didn't resurrect this subject to be like this.

All I wanted to do is find out what is acceptable within our modeling community and I think we have established that legally it is wrong to recast, wether it be from an original studio prop or a cast of that. They are in effect the same. Taking a cast of a studio piece is just that, Pouring resin into someone elses work and "selling screen accurate replicas" Is no different to someone pouring resin in to the replica and selling that. I know this upsets people but that is just making money off of someone elses work whichever way you look at it.
And please don't take offense to this. it is fact.
BUT and a big BUT, it seems that if we are to have "screen accurate replica props" or more precisely "screen used replica props" this is unavoidable.
But I still don't understand why it is wrong for me lets say for arguments sake recast a replica screen used prop when all I am doing is copying a studios work not the persons work that happened to gain access to the studio prop.
I know it's not easy gaining access, so is this where the moral rights are?
I say moral rights that are accepted within the replica community because there are no legal rights. It seems what is accepted here and what is accepted legally are two different things.:wacko
A lot of people will argue till blue in the face but is this what we are to accept that it is ok to cast a screen used prop if you gain access but not to recast that prop as you have not gained access?
I understand where both sides of the argument are coming from but it seems we have to put our legal views aside and accept that unless you have an original studio prop to copy or sculpt an original piece it isn't accepted within this community to recast 2nd or 3rd generation props, if you are counting the 1st is from the original prop or own sculpt.

Well it certainly is confusing. :confused

 

[scarf man]

The golden rule of recasting is "If you want to make something for sale to the community, SCULPT IT YOURSELF!" The silver rule is " Don't sell something you don't have."

 

[tubachris85x]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

While I agree almost 100% with this, I feel that in some cases, there can be an acception. I hate to keep using my example over and over again, but with the case that the original MoY mold was no longer usuable, after the owner offering castings to the public, there wouldn't have been anymore castings whatsoever.

I doubt the owner "wanted" the mold to be rendered unusable, its just that he couldn't produce more, and didn't have the interest of making a 2nd gen mold, like I did AFTER getting his permission to do so.

I feel in that type of situation, it is fine and not morally wrong to offer something that could not otherwise be available without "consented recasting." I feel that this should only apply to original props that have been privatly owned, and not fan-made pieces that are just flat out recasted for the sake of making a quick buck

 

[scarf man]

I can only think of one reason why one would have a problem with "consented" recast items, devalue of an otherwise limited run. I would have no moral problem with said scenario.

 

[tubachris85x]

I can only think of one reason why one would have a problem with "consented" recast items, devalue of an otherwise limited run. I would have no moral problem with said scenario.

Thats true about the de-value of a limted run..but I find that to be the case with professional prop replicas, such as the MR items..Now, if say one famous prop from a movie, was said to have only had like 5 ever made, and was valued highly just for that fact alone, and then recasts it, it will obviously de-value it, wether consented or not

 

[scarf man]

Huh?
Oh, and wtf!
http://www.therpf.com/showthread.php?t=56263

 

[tubachris85x]

Huh?
Oh, and wtf!
http://www.therpf.com/showthread.php?t=56263

sorry, i'm kinda out of it at the moment..:wacko

 

[Newbie Doobie]

LOTS of good points made here! I wasn't trying to ramble on,and bore people. The point is that recasting,or making replicas other peoples' work is essentially stealing intellectual property. There is NO HONOUR AMONG THIEVES,as the old saying goes! This is also true on this forum. Does studioscale ring a bell? Misrepresenting an item as yours,even though you recast it,is also not alowed on the RPF,but it happens a lot more than you'd think! Recasting is still recasting! Legal,or not! I've never recast another persons' work,and I have no desire to do so! I have the means,and talent to cast my own,but I prefer to scratch build,and not a have another persons cast,or recast replica just because "it's more accurate"! I have resources that allow me to make my own,and still be 100% accurate to the original without recasting! I'll not divulge my sources,nor will I elaborate,but I have plans on making my own studio scale replicas,and not having to break the rules of this forum! Even though I'll be breaking copyright,or trademark laws somewhere,but don't all the others who make replicas do the same? This is hypocritcal,and the rules of this forum!

 

[Newbie Doobie]

Huh?
Oh, and wtf!
http://www.therpf.com/showthread.php?t=56263

I don't understand the question.