Is this Auction Legit? Resin ILM Cast

[thd9791]

I inquired and aske the seller to tell me a bit more about it, this is what he sent me -

"
Yeah.... The model shop was discontinued long ago here simple because of cg these days so most of the model shop guys were laid off. This was given to me from one of the model shop guys. Its the real deal and one of very few that were not completed. Ive had it for 11 years just sitting in my office. "


Wait - I think I'm missing something. These casts that you guys have and this auction - a cast of this never saw screen time right? That's the re-done control box with side rails...

 

[BrundelFly]

WHo said that?

I believe it was cast in resin to get shot out of R2.
A member here actually WATCHED that being filmed, and he said they fired about 18 of em, and they landed all over the place.

 

[thd9791]

That quote was from the seller.

The rest was me - I talked to that member, the saber shot out of R2 was resin, however it was a cast off the ANH stunt, with the groove in the neck and no nub on the emitter (not ground off, but cast like that) So, the control box wasn't this detailed, although it was there.

This is a cast of the hero or something of that nature. However, for filming, the hero had a control box that was a smooth box. I was asking because this control box has the side rails and extra detailed card that you can see in exhibits. It was re-done post production - so I was wondering if this is a cast from a post production metal hero - or if the resin version already looked like this...

(Here's the metal hero, re-done post production

)

 

[lonepigeon]

Technically, I would say the hero saber was reworked during production.
It's most likely that the control box was changed to film the scene where Luke builds his lightsaber.

I agree though that if the saber casts have the stepped side rails it seems less likely that the mold was made during production.

Edit - The resin Hero that has been on museum tours is like Frank's with the stepped side rails. I don't think this version has ever been positively identified on screen, but the tour saber confirms that there were finished sabers like this. The eBay one definitely looks reworked.

 

[artoo77]

Fake.

We never had a mold at ILM for that lightsaber..

 

[Apollo]

Welp there you go from someone who would know!

 

[BrundelFly]

Fake.
We never had a mold at ILM for that lightsaber..

Perhaps not officially?

Molds can be elusive! Especially in that big ol building. I'm told only a few even knew about the VADER helmet mold they discovered that EFX used for the recent Vader. You know the one made by Rick Baker. I believe you were one of the few who did though Don. Nice find!


Not my intent to dispute you, However, I know who we got the casting we received.

To imply anything to the contrary would be a misplaced challenge to my integrity, and I do not think that was the intention. So, I won't take it that way. Enough said there.

But you are right, I have no proof it came from anything from production. For all I know he bought it on EBAY and sent it.

All I have ever stated was that our casting came from someone who worked at ILM. Yeah and it's not "my sister's cousin, best friends father in law's ex-wife uncle" either.

My friend brought the actual shipping box with the saber, and other items we have not mentioned, and will not (nothing sinister mostly "shwag" from the gift shop) , and I saw the name and shipping label with "my own eyes" (sorry, had to)

Back to the saber, It's obvious it was molded from SOMEthing that looks suspiciously like the Hero Saber. Down to one of the screws being in the same position.

However, who knows. If I could have proved anything, I would have sold the castings for alot more money! ;-)

But come on, Im sure SOMETHING was molded at some point. On Location in Yuma, my hometown, I don't think it was multiple METAL sabers they shot out of the AIR CANNON on the Barge set. So either a saber was molded, or they shot out silver painted cucumbers.
I defer to Mr Bies for any info there.

Who knows. Was it this one? No idea. It had always been a guess if it was. Yes the one coming out of R2's head does not have the nub, it's also been cut, or it is broken on the top circle which is flat on one side. Maybe so it clears the edge of the dome?

Look for yourself. What do YOU think it was made out of? Anyone seen that saber since?

I know it might be a shock to think something might have gotten molded without someone knowing, or somehow left the archives unofficially, however, considering how many production items are in private hands it's not much of a stretch of the imagination to think the ARCHIVES isn't FORT KNOX.

Frank

 

[artoo77]

If it was molded, it would have been before 1987. That saber never left the archives and I knew all the molds that existed from the original trilogy (I found the Baker Vader mold). So if it was molded, the person took the mold with them before 1987.

It was not molded, officially or unofficially, during my watch in the archives.

PM me the name of the person (don't worry, I'm not affiliated with LFL, so I won't turn them in) and I'll be able to tell the validity of the discussion.

--Don

 

[BrundelFly]

PM sent.

 

[thd9791]

If it was molded, it would have been before 1987. That saber never left the archives and I knew all the molds that existed from the original trilogy (I found the Baker Vader mold). So if it was molded, the person took the mold with them before 1987.

It was not molded, officially or unofficially, during my watch in the archives.

PM me the name of the person (don't worry, I'm not affiliated with LFL, so I won't turn them in) and I'll be able to tell the validity of the discussion.

--Don

Hey I just wanted to thank you for chiming in, I started this thread out of pure curiosity and a little confusion.

Do you know anything about the control box being re-done? aka, if it never left the archives, that would have been done before '87 too?

 

[artoo77]

There was a mold for the Chest Box, created (I believe) for the appearance costumes done during Jedi. We did create new chest box for a series of Vaders for the Fox video release in 1995.

--Don

Hey I just wanted to thank you for chiming in, I started this thread out of pure curiosity and a little confusion.

Do you know anything about the control box being re-done? aka, if it never left the archives, that would have been done before '87 too?

 

[lonepigeon]

Wasn't the Hero saber molded in the old Icons days?
There used to be lots of casts floating around. A bunch were sold through Toy Safari IIRC.

There also had to be an official mold at some point because this Luke saber on tour during Magic of Myth is a cast of the Hero.

 

[BAlinger15]

It's my understanding that a collector or broker obtained an ROJ saber mold (silicone) from the family of Wesley Seeds several years ago. Maybe this was the source of these resin castings? Of course that wouldn't tell us if they were made during or after production.

My understanding is that Paul Huston did some work on the lightsaber(s) during ROJ production - probably converting the control box to open for the lightsaber construction scene.

Best
Brandon

 

[artoo77]

No doubt there was a mold; the one that shoots out of R2 was a resin casting (and was in the archives when I left). However, the question was whether or not it came from ILM through the model shop. I stand by my assertion that there was no mold of the hero saber (currently on display in Edmonton--more on that in a bit) when I started there in 1987, and it was never molded during my time there (and after I left, security was tighter).

Wesley could have very well had a mold and/or a casting; again, if so, it was gone by the time I got there.

As to the "Hero" saber, there was more than one. The aluminum one on display at the Identities exhibition is indeed the one that Paul Huston worked on; rumor has it he built the entire thing, not just the control box. I was also told it was the only one made at ILM (all the others were made in the UK) and used exclusively in the Luke-building-his-saber sequence. If it was cast--which is the claim here--it would not be of the same type of the other sabers used in the film.

There is another metal one, though it is a casting--which may be the one you mention, Chris.

--Don

 

[lonepigeon]

There is another metal one, though it is a casting--which may be the one you mention, Chris.

You might be referring to the leftover Obi-Wan stunt that is an aluminum cast. It was the one they sent into space.
NASA - Items Taken Into Space Reflect Accomplishments on Earth

If that other cast from the Hero (in my post above) is aluminum it's super clean.
I assumed it was resin. I think it was most likely a display piece cast post-production.

The ILM-built saber was used at 3 points in the film.
1. stunt saber in Yuma. Simple solid control box and full metal blade/rod
2. Closeup in Vader's hands (shot at ILM). Detailed control box (arrows, circuit board etc)
3. Luke building his lightsaber deleted scene. Same control box as 2 but side rails raised up so the top slides and details inside.

 

[GINO]

The reveal 'MoM hero' was definitely molded at some point during the production and there have been some castings that have made their way into private hands.
The saber casting that Frank posted is from that mold but has been cleaned up a bit for appearance sake.
An unmodified original casting from that mold is not something I've seen in other people's collections. Only cleaned up copies.
There are a ton of tells and minute details all over these types of castings (if they have not been cleaned up) that match it to the MoM hero/reveal saber.

I agree with Chris that it is most likely that the reveal/MoM hero was converted from one of the metal sabers (since only the control box is different).

Here is a full write up on my site including some pics of my unmodified production casting.
I've not yet had a chance to go back and edit the propstory since the info regarding the reveal saber had been 100% confirmed.

Star Wars Propaganda - lightsabers - luke - return of the jedi production casting



.

 

[BrundelFly]

Well, cleaned? maybe. Notice the screws on my castings, are different positions than this one. Means either one saber was molded at two different times, or there were two different sabers.

 

[thd9791]

I saw this a while ago - and good eye. It seems to me there may have been a couple versions of this saber in the shop - probably one and then one done a "little bit better" during production. As for castings - everything and anything could be cast any number of times (up to a point) in prop depts. I can't tell if these (yours and holywoods) were cast before or after filming..

 

[thd9791]

We've come a long way since this thread, thank you for chiming in

this discussion has come up again recently, and I admit I forgot about the mention of Paul Huston. We were wondering if the saber made in the states for Yuma was solid, that meant the cave scene saber was solid too

No doubt there was a mold; the one that shoots out of R2 was a resin casting (and was in the archives when I left). However, the question was whether or not it came from ILM through the model shop. I stand by my assertion that there was no mold of the hero saber (currently on display in Edmonton--more on that in a bit) when I started there in 1987, and it was never molded during my time there (and after I left, security was tighter).

Wesley could have very well had a mold and/or a casting; again, if so, it was gone by the time I got there.

As to the "Hero" saber, there was more than one. The aluminum one on display at the Identities exhibition is indeed the one that Paul Huston worked on; rumor has it he built the entire thing, not just the control box. I was also told it was the only one made at ILM (all the others were made in the UK) and used exclusively in the Luke-building-his-saber sequence. If it was cast--which is the claim here--it would not be of the same type of the other sabers used in the film.

There is another metal one, though it is a casting--which may be the one you mention, Chris.

--Don