The OT stunt lightsaber blades research thread

[StevenBills]

Here's a shot of Solo DP Bradford Young in the LFL Archives, from Rob Bredow's Making of Solo book:

Not sure if it's helpful or not.

SB

 

[thd9791]

That looks like the infamous pipe-stunt, the best one for rehearsals, in at least rotj

I do actually see a ridge right before the core

 

[thd9791]

I discovered something at work today.

There is an exhibit where you pretend to be a meteorologist, green screen and all, and you email yourself the video. Cool, but gets old within a year, and it's been many. I rarely see folks learn the meteorology, just wave their arms and walk away

ANYWAYS

The screen has always looked white/light gray. Never occurred to me that the green-screen wasn't.. well green. I always thought it was a painted white wall and there was some way they keyed that color in or something.

Yesterday I brushed up against the background while picking up a piece of trash next to the exhibit. It wasn't solid. It is two large sheets of fabric sewn together across the center. I moved, and it flashed sunlight at me. Upon closer inspection the gray/silver was actually tiny bits of glass. It's reflective sheet. It actually looks like robust 3M fabric, but the exhibits guy I talked to didn't know (he wasn't here when it was installed)

Those in the film industry, humor me please, I just found out a new way of keying in media as a background. Green or blue LEDs, in a ring around the camera lens, are projected outward and thrown back by the reflective sheet. What's thrown back is registered as green or blue screen. Mind blown.

Last option on this page
Best Green Screen Materials

is this the way it was used in movie screens? That was before LEDs too, so I wonder what the light thrown back at the audience was good for?

Anyways, I'm hoping this leads to other products to wrap around poles, or to paint poles. I don't see fabric hanging off broken blades in ESB behind the scenes footage or the Archives thing with Roger.

 

[thd9791]

Here's the documentary where we get to see the stunt being swapped for Obi Wan's hero.

some good shots of the hero handle, fx death saber and Han's ANH Blaster

 

[JunkSabers1138]

Here's the documentary where we get to see the stunt being swapped for Obi Wan's hero.

some good shots of the hero handle, fx death saber and Han's ANH Blaster

Wow... I imagined it being more of a "stay still for 5 minutes while we get you all wired up and fit this battery pack onto you and slip this motorized stunt blade up your robe sleeve before fitting you back into the robe".

Here it seems like the battery and wire were already there and the end of the wire just sort of had a pigtail that plugged into the hole in the hilt, which makes sense, but I dont recall the hole on the V2 having any sort of indication that an electrical end socket was present where the mystery chunk now resides. I was always under the impression that wires ran out of that hole from inside and that the plug to the battery was some ways down the length of the cable

 

[Mouse Vader]

Here's the documentary where we get to see the stunt being swapped for Obi Wan's hero.

You've been reading my mind - how very dare you ! I was just trying to remember which video this was in - thanks for the reminder (from 36.04 if anyone is have trouble finding the mark).

Junksabers - PC3 & PC20 here The ANH LightSaber Blade Reference Thread show the wiring on the graflex stunt & v2 respectively

here's a close up from PC3.



The connectors are 4mm white male banana (I know) from the graflex saber to red female panel mount socket on the battery pack.

look for the wires also in the hanger duel where ever Alec G is facing Dave P. you can see them up his sleeve.

 

[Mouse Vader]

but I dont recall the hole on the V2 having any sort of indication that an electrical end socket was present where the mystery chunk now resides

That position is where the red toggle (?) switch can be seen in PC20.

Edit: woops got that all wrong - the cone knob is where the switch was - but I expect you knew that. The hole filled by the greeblie is where the wires (with connectors on the end) exitted - no socket as such.

 

[thd9791]

I contacted 3M tonight to see if someone was familiar with retroreflective paint or tech at this time, you never know!

I bought some metal stock to make the pipe stunt for myself, I have the black bolts, aluminum tube and 3 1/2 inches of solid aluminum. BAlinger15 said there were visible set screws above the "core" so I may either make a short collar for the outside, or sink the whole outer collar into the core? Looks like a rather thick blade too, like Ski-pole thickness. I may add a grub screw to the core to pinch the steel rod in place, and slide that into the pipe..

 

[thegnome]

I believe this thread is going to parallel the Han Solo Blaster thread. Amazing

 

[thd9791]

I was sent this .pdf from 3M. I had asked for something that was available at the time, or at least a close match with what's available today, and described our usage. Series 680-10

 

[thd9791]

3M Reflective Graphic Film Scotchlite ™ ™

Product Description

• For Screen printing

• 7-mil, flexible, enclosed lens, retroreflective, engineer grade films that offer flexibility and versatility

Product Features

• Available in 11 colors, including black (white reflects white)

• Similar daytime and nighttime appearance that retains most of its reflectivity when wet

• Excellent angularity

• Pressure-activated adhesive for easy sliding and tacking

• For vertical, flat, curved, or corrugated surfaces with and without rivets

• Permanent

• Expected Performance Life of 9 years for vehicles (unwarranted period for unprinted film with no graphic protection, applied to a flat, vertical,

outdoor surface)

• Expected Performance Life of 7 years for rail (unwarranted period for unprinted film with no graphic protection, applied to a flat, vertical,

outdoor surface)

Recommended Types of Graphics and End Uses

• Vertical commercial vehicle, railcar, and bus graphics

• Vertical non-regulated signs and striping

• Vertical indoor and outdoor signage

When constructed and used as described in this Bulletin, these types of graphics and end uses may be warranted by the 3M™ MCS™ Warranty.

Please read the entire Bulletin for details.

i IMPORTANT NOTE

Some substrates such as under-cured polyurethane paint, fiberglass, and some paint systems may continue to outgas for some time.

Two-part polyurethane paints and screen print clears may stop curing when the air and surface temperature are lower than 75 F (24

C). This film is not recommended for use on stainless steel.


Characteristic Value

Finished Graphic Application

Recommendation

Surface type: flat, with and without rivets, moderate curves, and corrugations

Substrate type: aluminum, Fiberglass Reinforced Plywood (FRP), paint

Application method: Dry

Application temperature: air and substrate

• Flat without rivets: 50–100 F (10–38 C)

• Flat, curved or corrugated surfaces with rivets: 55–100 F (13–38 C)

Adhesion, Typical

24 hours after

application

Aluminum 6.0 pounds/inch (1.1 kg/cm)

FRP (Fiberglass Reinforced Plywood) 3.0 pounds/inch (0.5 kg/cm)

Painted aluminum panels 4.5 pounds/inch (0.8 kg/cm)

Temperature Range After

Application -30 to +200 F (-34 to +93 C) (not for extended periods of time at the extremes)

Application and Installation

i IMPORTANT NOTE

This film is not recommended for use on low surface energy substrates such as some plastics, powder-coated paint, etc. The user must

assume responsibility for testing and approving these substrates.

This film can be applied over other recommended 3M graphic systems. Graphics printed with clear 1920DR must be weathered for at

least one year before applying this film over it. See 3M Instruction Bulletin 5.1 for details.

In addition to other 3M Bulletins specified in this document, the following Bulletins provide details that you may need to successfully apply a

graphic.

• 3M Instruction Bulletin 5.36. Application Techniques for Automobiles, Vans and Buses. Complete the 3M Pre-Installation Inspection Record

found in this Instruction Bulletin prior to manufacturing or applying a graphic to an automobile, van, or bus.

• 3M Instruction Bulletin 5.4. Application, Fleet Trucks.

• 3M Instruction Bulletin 5.5 Application, General Procedures for Interior and Exterior Dry Application

i IMPORTANT NOTE

UV inkjet inks may crack if too much heat is used during graphic application to complex curves and deep contours as well as around

rivets. When using heat during application, make sure the film surface temperature does not exceed 212 F (100 C). For best results,

always do a test application of a printed graphic to determine how much heat can be used without damaging the image.

i IMPORTANT NOTE

3M recommends using additional heat in the post-application process for vehicle graphics. During this process, 3M only recommends

using a heat gun to make sure the film surface temperature reaches a minimum of 200 F (93 C) and does not exceed 225 F (107 C).

Pressure-activated Adhesive

The pressure activated adhesive on this film offers:

• smooth sliding into position on a substrate;

• fast finger tacking to check position; and

The slideability feature is lost:

• when firm pressure with a squeegee or other application tool is applied.

• at application temperatures above 100 F (38 C) even if only light finger pressure was used for tacking.

• if any part of the film is removed from the original liner and reapplied to the same or another liner.

• solvent from inkjet ink has not completely dried or cured.

Maintenance and Cleaning

Use a cleaner designed for high-quality painted surfaces. The cleaner must be wet, non-abrasive, without solvents, and have a pH value between

3 and 11 (neither strongly acidic nor strongly alkaline). See 3M Instruction Bulletin 6.5 for details.

Removal

This film uses a permanent adhesive. This film is not easily or cleanly removable. See 3M Instruction Bulletin 6.5 for details.

 

[Halliwax]

Had a dream you moved to the city next door, we hung out and made stunt blades in your new house (tons of custom dark line work in your living room)

Honest to god dude not making this up lol

This is what I get for surfing the forum right before falling asleep

 

[thd9791]

that would be awesome!

 

[thd9791]

Okay folks, there's some vocabulary here that I stumbled across. We have been searching for reflective material, and the only scotchlite we know of is in tape or fabric form, right? The blades post ANH seem to be dinged up and, to me, appear to be painted.

There is such a thing as movie screen paint. Projection paint. Behr has a silver screen option. ScreenGoo also has reflective coatings and muted top coats - I believe this is to dull down reflection and give you high contrast for video projection.

"

• Screen GOO can be applied to almost any paintable surface. It forms a highly reflective acrylic coating that transforms the surface into a high-performance, high definition (HD) projection screen.
• Screen GOO is sometimes known as an optical paint, or transcreen, or liquid screen, or reflective acrylic paint or DIY screen. It consists of a full line of coatings designed to maximize the performance of any projection-based video playback system.

Video projected onto ordinary paint lacks the depth, vivid color and contrast that you see with a real screen, or with optical paint like Screen GOO. House paint is formulated to reflect only the portion of light that produces the desired color. Screen GOO, on the other hand, is blended to reflect and disperse the complex light patterns produced by video projectors. Unlike house paint, which consists of one or more coats of the same mixture, a proper Screen GOO application consists of a reflective base coat and a diffusive finishing coat, which combine to produce a screen that’s highly reflective, with great color accuracy, wide viewing angles, high contrast and a pronounced sense of depth."

Does anyone in the film or AV industry know if more industrial versions of this paint are out there? Have they been out for 40 years? Quite frankly, this is a white painted surface that reflects light, I think this is it. ScreenGoo has only been around since 2004-ish, so I'm looking for cheap old stuff. Apparently the better it is, the more matte the finish, and the less reflective. So we want stuff that is not reliable enough for good projection screens

 

[thd9791]

A screen with a gain measurement of greater than 1.0 infers that the image projected back off of the surface is brighter than the image being projected at the surface. For example; a projector screen with again of 1.5 will project back the light 1.5x brighter than the light being projected at the screen.

Q: It sounds as though a high gain screen is better. When would I choose a lower gain screen?
A: A high gain screen is not always the best solution; brighter does not always mean better.
Higher gain screens often have reduced viewing angles/cones. While providing a brighter image for those within the cone; those outside often experience significantly diminished brightness. A smaller viewing angle means there is a smaller area that the audience must be seated in in order to experience the screen's maximum brightness.

Higher gain screens can also experience issues with "hotspotting". When viewing the screen from the Zero Degree Viewing Angle the center of the image will appear brighter than the outside edges. This is less noticeable with screen gains of 1.3 and below and becomes more noticeable on many surfaces as the screen gain increases.

 

[Mouse Vader]

A screen with a gain measurement of greater than 1.0 infers that the image projected back off of the surface is brighter than the image being projected at the surface. For example; a projector screen with again of 1.5 will project back the light 1.5x brighter than the light being projected at the screen.

Doesn't that break the laws of physics? - ie. it's over unity (more energy out than is put in).

 

[mrwax]

Doesn't that break the laws of physics? - ie. it's over unity (more energy out than is put in).

I think it was a little misunderstanding, a gain of 1.0 doesn't mean the light reflected back is exactly the same brightness as the light projected, it's the amount reflected back from a reference white screen. From What is screen gain?:

Gain is a measurement of the reflectivity of any screen or projection surface. The gain number represents a ratio of the light that is reflected from the screen as compared to the light reflected from a standard white (magnesium oxide) board. Therefore, a screen with a gain of 1.0 will reflect the same amount of light as that from a white board. A screen rated at 1.5 gain will reflect 50% more light as that from a white board, whereas a gray screen with an 0.8 rating will reflect 80% of the light from a white board.

 

[Mouse Vader]

Ok got ya.

1.0 infers that the image projected back off of the surface is brighter than the image being projected at the surface

last part of this threw me.

I recall (I think it was Kurtyboy) mention that scotchlite used to do a reflective paint (for making walls into projection screens) but this was discontinued a few years ago.

I will be testing how the reflective material / tape stands up to bashing as part of my ANH blade tests once I have everything made. I will be including golf sticks in this.

 

[thd9791]

Doing some thinking here. From Sym-Cha 's photos here, we can see outside collars on 3 blades and the rehearsal stunt.
Original Lightsaber found at LFL with ROUND blade

Maybe they don't go into the core, only the internal rod goes down in.

How long do folks think the internal collars are?

 

[kurtyboy]

The collar on the pipe stunt does look like it goes into the core, but the recess can't be more than a couple of mm.