Prometheus (Post-release)
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nickytea
Master Member
"Prometheus: The new communication from Ridley Scott."
Nope.
It's provocation. Thoughts inspired.
Reflection. Inner depths.
Harmonization.
Sometimes answering questions is not so important as harmonizing with them and the experience of being alive.
Sorry that wasn't clearly "communicated."
Leave room for those of us it works for.
Too Much Garlic
Master Member
You need to shoot one of them monkeys... there was only 12.
AggieChick42
Active Member
Hey guys, sorry for being such a late comer but I just registered with this site
I thought this movie was awesome, even though the ending left me with more questions than answers really. My husband and I discussed this for a few days after getting home because we are HUGE Alien fans. We agreed that the Xenomorph born from the humanoid alien was probably what those nasty creatures started out as then they eventually evolved into what we know them as in the movie Alien. After explaining to some of my friends what some of the stuff in the "vault" was they started catching on... like what the black goo was for and what it did... and yes during the movie I got the Xenomorph memorial on the wall... but that kind of confused me at the ending because apparently they just became bred when the giant alien starfish-squid made a baby with the humanoid alien. So that really confused me... however I would really like to know if Dr. Shaw and David ever made it to where they are going... also, my husband brought up a good point. In Alien, they are answering the beacon that Dr. Shaw left, the one where she said NOT to come and they went anyway... i'm curious who told them to go check it out.. Also why is it that the androids in Prometheus and Alien keep trying to kill the humans that figure out what the heck is going on? David tried to kill Dr. Shaw and then was trying to let the alien starfish-squid gestate inside her... and in Alien, the android (can't remember his name right now) tried to kill Ripley whenever she contacted "Mother" and got information and the egg laying face alien let go of that dude and the baby xenomorph came along... what's the deal with that?!??!?!
*Caught 1 typo so far... lol
I thought this movie was awesome, even though the ending left me with more questions than answers really. My husband and I discussed this for a few days after getting home because we are HUGE Alien fans. We agreed that the Xenomorph born from the humanoid alien was probably what those nasty creatures started out as then they eventually evolved into what we know them as in the movie Alien. After explaining to some of my friends what some of the stuff in the "vault" was they started catching on... like what the black goo was for and what it did... and yes during the movie I got the Xenomorph memorial on the wall... but that kind of confused me at the ending because apparently they just became bred when the giant alien starfish-squid made a baby with the humanoid alien. So that really confused me... however I would really like to know if Dr. Shaw and David ever made it to where they are going... also, my husband brought up a good point. In Alien, they are answering the beacon that Dr. Shaw left, the one where she said NOT to come and they went anyway... i'm curious who told them to go check it out.. Also why is it that the androids in Prometheus and Alien keep trying to kill the humans that figure out what the heck is going on? David tried to kill Dr. Shaw and then was trying to let the alien starfish-squid gestate inside her... and in Alien, the android (can't remember his name right now) tried to kill Ripley whenever she contacted "Mother" and got information and the egg laying face alien let go of that dude and the baby xenomorph came along... what's the deal with that?!??!?!
*Caught 1 typo so far... lol
ringa
Well-Known Member
My coworker and I were trying to figure the film out. Then he sent me this link: Prometheus - Everything explained and analysed *SPOILERS* : movies
Anyone read this? It is FULL of explanations of the layers of symbolism that is repeated throughout the film, which I found very thought provoking, and helped clear up some of the confusion I had about many scenes, but, I especially liked the last part of this article where it shows that the plot of Prometheus was stolen from episodes of Dr. Who in the 197o's:
"...let me draw your attention to a very different strand of symbolism that runs through Prometheus: the British science fiction show Doctor Who. In the 1970s episode 'The Daemons', an ancient mound is opened up, leading to an encounter with a gigantic being who proves to be an alien responsible for having guided mankind's development, and who now views mankind as a failed experiment that must be destroyed. The Engineers are seen tootling on flutes, in exactly the same way that the second Doctor does. The Third Doctor had an companion whose name was Liz Shaw, the same name as the protagonist of Prometheus. As with anything else in the film, it could all be coincidental; but knowing Ridley Scott, it doesn't seem very likely."
Anyone read this? It is FULL of explanations of the layers of symbolism that is repeated throughout the film, which I found very thought provoking, and helped clear up some of the confusion I had about many scenes, but, I especially liked the last part of this article where it shows that the plot of Prometheus was stolen from episodes of Dr. Who in the 197o's:
"...let me draw your attention to a very different strand of symbolism that runs through Prometheus: the British science fiction show Doctor Who. In the 1970s episode 'The Daemons', an ancient mound is opened up, leading to an encounter with a gigantic being who proves to be an alien responsible for having guided mankind's development, and who now views mankind as a failed experiment that must be destroyed. The Engineers are seen tootling on flutes, in exactly the same way that the second Doctor does. The Third Doctor had an companion whose name was Liz Shaw, the same name as the protagonist of Prometheus. As with anything else in the film, it could all be coincidental; but knowing Ridley Scott, it doesn't seem very likely."
AggieChick42
Active Member
Wow, that is crazy... maybe that is where he got a lot of his ideas from then? Or maybe he asked permission to use these ideas and it was all top secret? There have been a lot of movies that use "engineers" as their "God" explanation but that fact that the Doctor Who from the 1970's has that plot... is a bit strange lol
ringa
Well-Known Member
I have to say, with as much problems as I have with Prometheus, I did enjoy it more than Avengers. Everyone who saw it kept telling me how great it was, so I was expecting great. I was disappointed. I mean, the whole plot of Avengers could be summed up like the way we used to play when we were kids, and is about as deep... "OK, we're the good guys, you're the bad guys, now let's fight!" At least Prometheus has some depth to debate over.
Riceball
Master Member
Wrong planet, you're (like a lot of other people) are confusing LV-223 for LV-426. The planet from Prometheus is LV-223, the planet that Alien and Aliens take place on is LV-426 and the derelict on LV-426 is not the same ship as the on that crashed in Prometheus. The events from Prometheus have no direct bearing on what happened in Alien except that the Engineers were responsible for the xenomorphs.
Whether it's a joke or a movie, if you have to explain it, it wasn't very good.
Canon is what happens in the movie. So all these long 'read my brilliant explanations' don't amount to anything. Put it in the movie or STFU. They said the same thing about Terminator Salvation, or Predators, or AvPs. 'You don't understand our brilliance.' 'and then buy the extended version kiddies.'
The latest pics of Ridley Scott remind me of a befuddled tired old man. "Are you alright? Do you know where you live?"
Oh well. In July Batman and Spider-man will be out and this will be forgotten.
Canon is what happens in the movie. So all these long 'read my brilliant explanations' don't amount to anything. Put it in the movie or STFU. They said the same thing about Terminator Salvation, or Predators, or AvPs. 'You don't understand our brilliance.' 'and then buy the extended version kiddies.'
The latest pics of Ridley Scott remind me of a befuddled tired old man. "Are you alright? Do you know where you live?"
Oh well. In July Batman and Spider-man will be out and this will be forgotten.
neosporing
Sr Member
Kit Rae
Sr Member
The 13th was implied in the subtext
I really think the BR/DVD of Prometheus should contain a dry, emotionless narration by Harrison Ford telling all the people who did not pay attention or simply don't want to use their brains, exactly what is happenning scene by scene in Prometheus.
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Let me start by saying, I didn't hate the movie. It's obvious that some of the story didn't make the theatrical release, so I suspect we'll see a longer, better version in the DVD release.
That said, nothing will fix the middle. Nothing. Case in point, the biologist and the geologist...or (as we should think of them forever) the redshirt and the other redshirt. They were not hapless victims who will be mourned as real people caught in the wrong place at the wrong time, but a storytelling setup so weak that it threatened the integrity of the whole. Did I know they would die from the moment they first appeared? Yes. Sadly. I didn't want to know that those two guys would be dead by the end. I didn't want to believe that their character introductions simply screamed 'target painted on their chests', but unfortunately the writing was on the wall. It was obvious that they were doomed. A geologist that can't just simply say 'hello' back but has to be confrontational at the drop of a hat. A biologist that is openly friendly and goofy. DEAD.
Getting back to my point. Let's start by examining the way team communications should work. The team starts out in constant communication with the ship, which is the kind of protocol I would demand if I was monitoring the team from the safety of the ship. Everyone online all the time. Any loss of communication and I'd yank that team out. No questions asked. You stay in communication or you don't get to come on a mission years out into space again. Ever.
That's the very way that the expedition team started out as they explored the underground and unknown complex, and then...they split up. It was suddenly Shaggy and Scooby on their own.
What captain, team leader or just plain everyday person worth their salt splits up on a planet containing only 17 crew members facing the unknown?
Worse than this, and for reasons never explained, the biologist and the geologist got lost. The place is mapped for them in 3D...and they got lost. They geologist himself mapped the place...and they got lost. They're in uninterrupted communication with the team underground and the ship...and they got lost. The ship was monitoring all of them on camera and radio...and they got lost. They wandered down a few corridors traveling in very set directions...and they got lost. They could have called anyone at anytime and asked for directions...and they got lost. They heard the warning that they had to get back to the ship ahead of the storm...and they got lost. Did they forget how to call the ship (what with only one ship they could call)? Did the ship forget them (because 17 people are too hard to monitor)? Did the team forget them? Doesn't matter. They got lost.
Then, despite the unexplainable reasons for them getting lost, the crew on the ship decided to abandon them. They didn't leave a guy on the bridge to monitor their safety, no matter how tenuous the communication might have been. They simply wished them luck and abandoned them with no more concern than two guys who missed a connecting bus. This plotless decision, which is soundly outside the realm of good judgment, is a turning point for me in the film.
Years from Earth. One ship. Only seventeen people. An endless amount of things that can go wrong on and off the ship. Abandon two people to the dark unknown with no communication whatsoever like they're camping in the backyard.
Then, my ultimate pet peeve rears its ugly head. Extreme character contradictions for the sake of artificial tension.
The biologist and geologist were soundly against going anywhere near an unknown life form. They purposely went East to avoid the 'life form' detected to the West. And who wouldn't? Alone on an alien planet in alien ruins surrounded by alien dead ANNNND cut off from the ship both in terms of distance and by communication. I'd go East. Can I see a show of hands of anyone who'd go West without sufficient safeguards while lost underground in the dark and subsisting on canned air?
Then...
...they got caught in the room of oozing pots and the giant head and a freakish, faceless, albino snake slithered right up to them to say 'hello'.
Suddenly, the biologist wanted nothing more than to give a large glistening, slithering, tentacle worm a hug. The hell...? Did his healthy respect for the unknown, and therefore potentially dangerous, go right out the window in a place with no windows? There are insects no larger than a freckle that can pass diseases to you and me on Earth, but this guy reached out to a tentacle in a posturing stance that just screamed dangerous. Had this 'biologist' never seen a cobra, timber snake, rattler, or any other creature I could name demonstrate predatory posturing? Never mind that it had no eyes and nothing that would have communicated 'safe to touch'. Never mind that it came right up to him, which is generally a sign of fearless disdain or hostility in an animal sense. Never mind that he had NO IDEA WHAT IT WAS! It could have been as harmless as an earthworm, but it was the size of a vacuum hose! How thin was the air in his helmet that he would suddenly switch from his 'East not West' policy? The geologist was stuck in a helmet choked with hash, but the biologist was...what? Bipolar in his respect for the unknown? Selectively careless in the case of alien cave snakes?
As a side note, if you should ever find yourself alone in the wilderness, whether underground or in the full, bright, happy light of day and a snake comes up to you, move away. If a snake moves away from you, you're golden. If it comes up to you, MOVE AWAY. You may also hit it with a stick if you have to, but do not attempt to hand feed it or it will feed on your hand.
That scene was so B movie that it can't be fixed. There is no director's cut that will fix the tragic 'Laurel and Hardy meet the Mutant Zombie Worm' scene. It can't be fixed. It can't be explained away.
The scene would have made more sense if first, they're entrapment in the complex was explained by an accident or a brush with technology that kept them from leaving, and second, if they had fled from the snake only to be pursued and killed. It would have been more terrifying. It would have made sense. It would have been realistic.
Instead, they reduced two space faring scientists in a Ridley Scott sci-fi film to two teenage stoners in a slasher flick. Done. Dead. Can't be fixed.
That said, nothing will fix the middle. Nothing. Case in point, the biologist and the geologist...or (as we should think of them forever) the redshirt and the other redshirt. They were not hapless victims who will be mourned as real people caught in the wrong place at the wrong time, but a storytelling setup so weak that it threatened the integrity of the whole. Did I know they would die from the moment they first appeared? Yes. Sadly. I didn't want to know that those two guys would be dead by the end. I didn't want to believe that their character introductions simply screamed 'target painted on their chests', but unfortunately the writing was on the wall. It was obvious that they were doomed. A geologist that can't just simply say 'hello' back but has to be confrontational at the drop of a hat. A biologist that is openly friendly and goofy. DEAD.
Getting back to my point. Let's start by examining the way team communications should work. The team starts out in constant communication with the ship, which is the kind of protocol I would demand if I was monitoring the team from the safety of the ship. Everyone online all the time. Any loss of communication and I'd yank that team out. No questions asked. You stay in communication or you don't get to come on a mission years out into space again. Ever.
That's the very way that the expedition team started out as they explored the underground and unknown complex, and then...they split up. It was suddenly Shaggy and Scooby on their own.
What captain, team leader or just plain everyday person worth their salt splits up on a planet containing only 17 crew members facing the unknown?
Worse than this, and for reasons never explained, the biologist and the geologist got lost. The place is mapped for them in 3D...and they got lost. They geologist himself mapped the place...and they got lost. They're in uninterrupted communication with the team underground and the ship...and they got lost. The ship was monitoring all of them on camera and radio...and they got lost. They wandered down a few corridors traveling in very set directions...and they got lost. They could have called anyone at anytime and asked for directions...and they got lost. They heard the warning that they had to get back to the ship ahead of the storm...and they got lost. Did they forget how to call the ship (what with only one ship they could call)? Did the ship forget them (because 17 people are too hard to monitor)? Did the team forget them? Doesn't matter. They got lost.
Then, despite the unexplainable reasons for them getting lost, the crew on the ship decided to abandon them. They didn't leave a guy on the bridge to monitor their safety, no matter how tenuous the communication might have been. They simply wished them luck and abandoned them with no more concern than two guys who missed a connecting bus. This plotless decision, which is soundly outside the realm of good judgment, is a turning point for me in the film.
Years from Earth. One ship. Only seventeen people. An endless amount of things that can go wrong on and off the ship. Abandon two people to the dark unknown with no communication whatsoever like they're camping in the backyard.
Then, my ultimate pet peeve rears its ugly head. Extreme character contradictions for the sake of artificial tension.
The biologist and geologist were soundly against going anywhere near an unknown life form. They purposely went East to avoid the 'life form' detected to the West. And who wouldn't? Alone on an alien planet in alien ruins surrounded by alien dead ANNNND cut off from the ship both in terms of distance and by communication. I'd go East. Can I see a show of hands of anyone who'd go West without sufficient safeguards while lost underground in the dark and subsisting on canned air?
Then...
...they got caught in the room of oozing pots and the giant head and a freakish, faceless, albino snake slithered right up to them to say 'hello'.
Suddenly, the biologist wanted nothing more than to give a large glistening, slithering, tentacle worm a hug. The hell...? Did his healthy respect for the unknown, and therefore potentially dangerous, go right out the window in a place with no windows? There are insects no larger than a freckle that can pass diseases to you and me on Earth, but this guy reached out to a tentacle in a posturing stance that just screamed dangerous. Had this 'biologist' never seen a cobra, timber snake, rattler, or any other creature I could name demonstrate predatory posturing? Never mind that it had no eyes and nothing that would have communicated 'safe to touch'. Never mind that it came right up to him, which is generally a sign of fearless disdain or hostility in an animal sense. Never mind that he had NO IDEA WHAT IT WAS! It could have been as harmless as an earthworm, but it was the size of a vacuum hose! How thin was the air in his helmet that he would suddenly switch from his 'East not West' policy? The geologist was stuck in a helmet choked with hash, but the biologist was...what? Bipolar in his respect for the unknown? Selectively careless in the case of alien cave snakes?
As a side note, if you should ever find yourself alone in the wilderness, whether underground or in the full, bright, happy light of day and a snake comes up to you, move away. If a snake moves away from you, you're golden. If it comes up to you, MOVE AWAY. You may also hit it with a stick if you have to, but do not attempt to hand feed it or it will feed on your hand.
That scene was so B movie that it can't be fixed. There is no director's cut that will fix the tragic 'Laurel and Hardy meet the Mutant Zombie Worm' scene. It can't be fixed. It can't be explained away.
The scene would have made more sense if first, they're entrapment in the complex was explained by an accident or a brush with technology that kept them from leaving, and second, if they had fled from the snake only to be pursued and killed. It would have been more terrifying. It would have made sense. It would have been realistic.
Instead, they reduced two space faring scientists in a Ridley Scott sci-fi film to two teenage stoners in a slasher flick. Done. Dead. Can't be fixed.
Kerr Avon
Master Member
Yup, endless articles and reviews where he has to explain the significance of everything (Really. Space *****. Really. Can you believe that ****? I'm not even Christian and I think it's stupid.) does not excuse a poorly executed movie.
Kerr Avon
Master Member
Like an ancient pyramid that reconfigures itself every hour or so? Yeah, it's sad, but "Aliens vs Predator" had better logic than "Prometheus"
Scientists who think since air quality is good it's time to take off their environmental and pathogen protection covering. (Lets play with the room full of forbidden artifacts) Wow. A scientist who sees worms crawling in his eyes and decides it's time to screw his girl. (Pheromones released into bedroom, or maybe his alcohol was spiked) The scientist who is first afraid of seeing the life form but then suddenly rushes to touch it. (Mind reversal gas released in chamber) I mean really, these people were professionals?
The more I think about it, "Cabin in the Woods" really skewered this level of writing. I just had to add the 'pushes' from down below that clearly affected these scientists motivations. It's going to take better writing and better horror than this to entertain me in the future.
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Kerr Avon
Master Member
Didn't you read the interviews about the movie? The 13th Monkey was the figurative monkey on the time traveler's back. It was the key to everything, even though it was never mentioned in the movie.
AggieChick42
Active Member
Oh.. ok so my next question is how did the xenomorphs get to LV-426 then? Our understanding from the end of Prometheus is that the two aliens created the xenomorphs. My, "hypothesis" is that they migrated to the other planet.. but like I said... how did thye get there if the species was just created? Alien takes place like 25 years after Prometheus...
AggieChick42
Active Member
Ok so I just caught this posting... didn't see it because all the craziness lol
So Prometheus and Alien DO take place on the same planet?
Noeland
Master Member
It's a discussion. Pros and cons. Good and bad. I thought the film was excellent despite it's flaws, but it's not for every one, and not everybody is going to enjoy it, whatever the reasons. The fact that I loved it, and want to discuss it, and talk about why I enjoyed it is no slam on the people who did not like it.
I don't think anybody has stated "You don't understand our brilliance" in this thread.
And Ridley Scott is no befuddled old man. Seriously now.
Jack T Chance
Sr Member
Oh for the love of....
for the UMPTEENTH time in this thread...
ALIEN and ALIENS both take place on a planetoid called LV-426.
PROMETHEUS takes place on a MOON called LV-233, which is orbiting around a ringed planet in A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT STAR SYSTEM! Capiche?
I swear, I gotta stop reading this thread... it's gotten too long and it's giving me headaches now. :unsure
AggieChick42
Active Member
THIS IS LV-426!!!
someone erased LV-223 from the database
Hey don't get snippy. Someone just said something different and now i've gotten confused. If someone just explained it like you did *w/o the attitude* then it would of been cleared up. Being rude has nothing to do with this conversation however I do appreciate you clearing it up. However, since you apparently seem to know more than most let me ask you this... if they are in different star systems how did the xenomorphs come to be on LV-426? Because at the end of Prometheus was when the thing was "created"... so please oh smart one... explain this to me. :confused
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