New Elstree Studio documentary with discarded Graflex.

[DARTH SABER]

All the characteristics found on this saber indicate some sort of stunt/sparring saber.

Bunny ears removed, reinforcement washer added to base of the emitter (probably to gold the blade) and the emitter itself seems to dented or bent which suggest rigorous use which is consistent with stunt sabers.
For all we know the emitter was bent on purpose to help hold the blade.

Aside from the D ring which is somewhat close to the position of the toe Pic saber the characteristics on this saber don’t seem match any other Luke sabers so I think we should just accept that this is simply a new Luke saber that has been discovered.

 

[Gregatron]

Exactly.

 

[AnubisGuard]

Hamill was just holding the prop so it didn’t constantly smack his leg.

As someone who has tried to run with a saber hanging from my belt, this is correct. Feels like the b∆$t∆rd is going to fly right off the hook if it isn't held down.

 

[indignate]

"Hamill was just holding the prop so it didn’t constantly smack his leg. "

You say that because you see it in the movie, but think that is just one take that made it to the final editing. There could had been dozens of takes of that scene where the saber falls. In that scene or others. So someone told Hamill, "hey boy, just grab the saber when you are running!"

 

[indignate]

I posted the discarded stunt saber theory since page 2 or 3 of this thread. Its the one that makes more sense to me.

But I think this saber was built exactly as the heroes. (I mean the bubble strip, the grips and the dring) There are no differences between them. Why wouldnt they made it different, most likely the did the 3 the same day? But this one was given to the sfx guys to try to make a stunt out of him.

What bugs me is the damage it has. Not talking just about the top head. The publicity photos, taken after filming shows a saber almost Brand new. This one has lots of signs of use, all over it, but mostly in the bottom. Dont think that could have made in the junk pile as they are in a zone very specific. Dont think is for the hammering of the rivets, as the Rivets dont have almost any hit.

So my guess is if that if this saber got any kind of use ,(preproduciton rehershals, being a back up in filming rehershals then changed for the hero when the camera filmed) during filming before attempting to do the stunt on it, or even after. The evident signs of use makes me think it was not discarded in the preproduction with no use other that welding the plate on it..

About the two Rivets between grips in the toe pic saber. I dont find any use of them, they cant grab anything in that position. Could they be just decorative? or what I think better, could they be just a code for the stand prop guy to know which one is the hero saber?

 

[R5D4]

So what do we do now? Should we add the two side rivets to our ANH replicas or only if we want to replicate the toe pic saber?

 

[Davy Jones]

I would always caution people to put any holes they aren't perfectly sure of into a real Graflex.
There's been far too many vintage Mauser pistols ruined by people milling the "mystery disc" into the side.
I think it's very clear this particular saber seen in the b&w shots had those two rivets in the side, but that's just one picture. Was this the main prop? Are you trying to replicate this perfectly down to the clamp being on the wrong side?
I personally think if someone wanted to do the rivet heads they could cut off two heads and just glue them on.
Better reference comes out and you need to alter them; or you decide you dont like them, pop them off and wipe with solvent and you havent hurt your Graflex investment.

 

[Gregatron]

"Hamill was just holding the prop so it didn’t constantly smack his leg. "

You say that because you see it in the movie, but think that is just one take that made it to the final editing. There could had been dozens of takes of that scene where the saber falls. In that scene or others. So someone told Hamill, "hey boy, just grab the saber when you are running!"

No, I say that because he holds it steady in several scenes, when he’s both running and just walking.

 

[indignate]

No, I say that because he holds it steady in several scenes, when he’s both running and just walking.

yes, could had happen many times in some scenes. when he makes any kind of effort like running,or jumping in or out the landspeeder. But again, each scene has many takes, in some the saber could had fallen off and he grabbed it for the next take, or just someone told him to. And of course no take with the saber falling made the cut.

 

[R5D4]

I would always caution people to put any holes they aren't perfectly sure of into a real Graflex.
There's been far too many vintage Mauser pistols ruined by people milling the "mystery disc" into the side.
I think it's very clear this particular saber seen in the b&w shots had those two rivets in the side, but that's just one picture. Was this the main prop? Are you trying to replicate this perfectly down to the clamp being on the wrong side?
I personally think if someone wanted to do the rivet heads they could cut off two heads and just glue them on.
Better reference comes out and you need to alter them; or you decide you dont like them, pop them off and wipe with solvent and you havent hurt your Graflex investment.

Yes I totally agree. I want to replicate the screen used but now we don’t know if those two side rivets were there can you tell from any of the production photos is that same angle visible?

 

[thd9791]

Double checking here, we've been unable to screen match or photo natch any part of this new saber correct?

That's disappointing but also cool.

How many bubble strips to we know of?
Obi Hero 1-2
Obi Stunt 1
Vader Hero (not V2 Hero) - 1
Luke Hero - 1
Elstree Saber - 1

Think any of these were re-used or shared between props?

 

[R5D4]

They must have used the toe pic saber for production I can’t imagine it only being used for photo sessions. Is there any evidence of at least of the toe pic saber being the same one that’s in the Obi-wan cave scene?

 

[Dann]

Looking again at the damage to the bottom, it almost looks like that entire edge (where the D ring is) is deformed, like even up on the side/bottom corner. There's a brighter spot on that left edge that makes it look like it mushroomed out a little.

My first thought is maybe this thing just took a really nasty fall. I'm guessing it'd have to be from at least several feet up, if not more, and I wanna say it looks like it fell onto some concrete or something similarly hard and rough.

Maybe it happened when they couldn't get it to do what they wanted it to do. The dude working on it was frustrated as all heck, had been working on trying to get it working as a stunt for several hours, and his boss comes by and says, "Oi mate! Don't worry about that one, it's just not gonna work. We've got a much simpler idea, TUBING!"

And the frustrated dude let out a huge sigh of relief, and threw this jerk of a flash into the dumpster as hard as he could...

 

[Mouse Vader]

I take it you guys know there is a whole bunch of high res photos of this thing in the graflex bank? I searched this thread for graflex bank but it seemed you don't.

 

[thd9791]

The photos were posted here first. Graflex Bank is rather new in the grand scheme of things, and things usually migrate there, so it's not on the top of everyone's list. Thanks for notifying us though, much easier access

 

[indignate]

Looking again at the damage to the bottom, it almost looks like that entire edge (where the D ring is) is deformed, like even up on the side/bottom corner. There's a brighter spot on that left edge that makes it look like it mushroomed out a little.

My first thought is maybe this thing just took a really nasty fall. I'm guessing it'd have to be from at least several feet up, if not more, and I wanna say it looks like it fell onto some concrete or something similarly hard and rough.
.

That is right the bottom has a bending as well, like a one big hit inflicted, appart the multitude of scracthes.

 

[Treadwell]

The bottom damage and the emitter damage are not from a fall. Graflexes are way tougher than that. A fall will get you a tiny ding, not flattened/deformed sections.

 

[DarthWilder]

The bottom damage and the emitter damage are not from a fall. Graflexes are way tougher than that. A fall will get you a tiny ding, not flattened/deformed sections.

That's why I still think the damage comes from a vise.

 

[Mouse Vader]

For what it's worth my take (as someone who's been an antique restorer for 25yrs, among other things) is that the base damage is caused from being held lengthwise overly tightly in a vice crushing it, the 'scratches' look very much like the damage I'm always seeing from vice 'teeth'. My guess is that it was done with the emitter washer (or something else) in place that was more resistant to damage at the other end.

That's why I still think the damage comes from a vise.

submitted while I was writing this.

The front damage is deliberate & looks to be done prior to brasing the 'washer' in, as the tool marks have the same colour from heating as the rest of the metal. It was done with pliers &/or a mole wrench. It's too symmetrical & shaped, esp. near the washer, to be accidental. Possibly done while being held in the vice that caused the base damage.

The presence of the 'washer' indicates to me this was meant to take a blade. I speculate from, whats in the hole, that this may once have had a stud welded in place (weld on hidden side) & that this weld failed rendering the thing useless & hence binned.

As for 'missing' glue - this things been kicking around for 40yrs, who knows what's dropped off in that time or, indeed, what actually was glued on there in the first place. By which I mean, 'proper' T track? bits of painted wood to look like T track? something else? We don't know & speculating is just pointless water muddying.

The missing bit of the bubble strip looks to me as snapper off at an angle & not deliberate. Opinion, opinion.

It's not the 'toe' hilt, the D ring hinges off center here & hinges across the hilt diameter on the 'toe' hilt.

Levers not closed properly; strikes me these things may well catch on clothing & be tugged open, rather than permanently 'set' in these positions. Another alternate is they're not screwed up tight enough in the first place.These photos are literal snap shots in time so unless more info is forthcoming speculation is pointless.

The guy has good provenance & isn't trying to make money so balance of probability for me is it's genuine.

 

[Halliwax]

Mouse Vader, I totally ass the vice damage. That would explain the consistent “pitting” we see on the edge of the bottom tube as well

Good thinking guys with the vice!