So the rumors of Helena ending the movie by saying: “I’m Helena….Helena Jones…” aren’t true???
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Indiana Jones 5 officially announced
- Thread starter ghostryder
- Start date
So the rumors of Helena ending the movie by saying: “I’m Helena….Helena Jones…” aren’t true???
Just got back from watching this. I wasn't hugely excited to see this as Kingdom left me a bit cold. Thankfully the cinema is only £5 a ticket for us now and I think that was a fair price as this just felt like a needless cash in for that "one last adventure". I felt the two hour twenty minute runtime, I think they could have edited things down more, cut a few scenes and made a tighter film. Phoebe Waller Bridge was one look to camera away from being Fleabag.
Kingdom of the Crystal Skull was okay and forgettable, this film felt the same. For me the original trilogy is core Indiana Jones and very re-watchable.
Kingdom of the Crystal Skull was okay and forgettable, this film felt the same. For me the original trilogy is core Indiana Jones and very re-watchable.
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Cephus
Master Member
I'm not either, I've just been lucky enough to have been in the right place at the right point in history where a lot of them crossed my path. The first celebrity I ever met was Rodney Allen Rippy, back when he was a fast food spokesman. My sister and I got to ride on a float in a parade because of my father's company and he was riding on the same float. I didn't care that I saw him on TV all the time, he was a good guy and we got to be friends as kids. I think the reason I've been friends with so many is because I don't fawn over them. I treat them like regular people. Granted, some people, especially modern celebrities, want to be worshipped and treated like they're special. I don't do that. They're just people.
I got to know Harlan Ellison, as I said, at a mid-80s Westercon, when a bunch of friends of mine saw him throughout the con and he was always surrounded by crowds of people. I was a fan, but I don't do fanaticism. Early on Sunday morning though, before the con opened, we saw him walking through the halls alone. I don't remember whose idea it was, but we all rushed over and surrounded him, waving our arms around and trying to simulate "a crowd". He said "what the hell are you doing?" We're trying to make you comfortable! He just muttered that we were a bunch of idiots and walked away. That move became known as the Harlan Hover. I caught him later in the day and sort of apologized and he said it was okay and we just started talking and that was that. We saw each other at lots of conventions and he always remembered me and every once in a while, I'd wave my arms around, just to see him scowl. I think he thought it was funny.
I agree, I would never want the kind of corporatized experience that you can get today. You're not meeting people, you're fawning over them while on an expensive theme-park ride. All of this stuff has to happen naturally. My wife and I used to run these big MST3K room parties in the early-mid 90s at conventions and you'd be surprised who comes through the door. Not "comes in with security", just people wandering the halls and checking out parties.
I've got tons of stories like that and those stories mean a whole lot more to me than any autograph or quick photo could. These are real people whose job happens to be making movies or TV shows. I feel really lucky to have had the experiences that I have, knowing full well that those experiences will never happen again. That's the sad part.
Cephus
Master Member
Massive flop. Indy brings in about $130 million worldwide, which is half of what Crystal Skull did 15 years ago. When you consider that ticket prices have more than doubled, that means that only 1/4 as many people went to see this crap pile.
Yet another complete failure for Disney.
Yet another complete failure for Disney.
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CopperRevan
Master Member
This says it all for me...
No one puts a piece from a new garment on an old one; otherwise the new makes a tear, and also the piece that was taken out of the new does not match the old. And no one puts new wine into old wineskins; or else the new wine will burst the wineskins and be spilled, and the wineskins will be ruined. But new wine must be put into new wineskins, and both are preserved. And no one, having drunk old wine, immediately desires new; for he says, ‘The old is better.’
No one puts a piece from a new garment on an old one; otherwise the new makes a tear, and also the piece that was taken out of the new does not match the old. And no one puts new wine into old wineskins; or else the new wine will burst the wineskins and be spilled, and the wineskins will be ruined. But new wine must be put into new wineskins, and both are preserved. And no one, having drunk old wine, immediately desires new; for he says, ‘The old is better.’
Wife and I loved it.
I fail to understand all the hate, but I also fail to understand all the hate for everything Disney/Star Wars as well. Is it because it‘s Disney? Lucas crapped all over Star Wars with the prequels and his Crystal Skull Macguffin was idiotic. I’d rather have something new than to live with just the originals, new IJ, new Star Wars movies and tv shows, I am not going to cry because it’s not how I would have written it.
You can like or not like something because the enjoyment of something is entirely subjective, there are things I do like and don’t like about all the Indiana Jones movies, but I thought it was a fine send off for Ford.
Blade Runner 2049 was fantastic (again, to me, it’s subjective) and it was a huge box office flop, but boy am I glad it’s there for my enjoyment, same with this IJ movie. Whether or not Dial makes its money back doesn’t stop any sequels, because there weren’t any banking on this movie anyway. The shareholders won’t be happy, but I am glad it exists.
I fail to understand all the hate, but I also fail to understand all the hate for everything Disney/Star Wars as well. Is it because it‘s Disney? Lucas crapped all over Star Wars with the prequels and his Crystal Skull Macguffin was idiotic. I’d rather have something new than to live with just the originals, new IJ, new Star Wars movies and tv shows, I am not going to cry because it’s not how I would have written it.
You can like or not like something because the enjoyment of something is entirely subjective, there are things I do like and don’t like about all the Indiana Jones movies, but I thought it was a fine send off for Ford.
Blade Runner 2049 was fantastic (again, to me, it’s subjective) and it was a huge box office flop, but boy am I glad it’s there for my enjoyment, same with this IJ movie. Whether or not Dial makes its money back doesn’t stop any sequels, because there weren’t any banking on this movie anyway. The shareholders won’t be happy, but I am glad it exists.
Jaitea
Master Member
Its not hate, just disappointment, I'm a big Harrison fan, everything he's been in & love his attitude, I really wanted this film to be good, but after hearing reviews after the film was shown at Cannes, I decided not to go to the cinema to see it
Disney really are in freefall at the minute, every franchise they own is failing for them,....Lucasfilm, Pixar, Marvel & their own products...Its very sad
Really its because there are no creatives making the big decisions
BR 2049 was made by a creative, but was probably too long & too cerebral for the general cinema goer, it will stand the test of time along with the original film
J
It's Disney but it's not only Disney. Box office results are all over the place this year. The Super Mario movie made a killing. 'Fast & Furious' is under expectations. Pixar's latest flick and 'The Flash' both crapped the bed.
The big glaring lesson I see is that budget matters. If Indy#5 sells $900m then it won't break even. 'Cocaine Bear' is a success with less than 10% of that. None of these 'bombs' are really bombing, they are just doing mid-grade sales after costing huge prices to make.
It gets back to the issue that the movie industry should have tackled decades ago. They need multi-tiered ticket pricing. The single ticket price is reducing the public's total movie trips and indirectly giving us more huge-budget shows. In the last few decades the medium-budget movie has practically gone extinct. Now movies are either $20m or $200m and nothing in between.
Look at Indy#5. This should never have been a top-budget movie in the first place. All the common-sense writing on the wall said this was not gonna be a big earner like the 1980s Indy shows. It was obvious at the brainstorming stage 5+ years ago.
If they could have made this movie for $100m, spent another $100m on limited (but well-targeted) marketing, and sold the theater ticket prices for $6/seat, it would have been a fine return on the effort. But no, 40 years after its prime they were still trying to force one last Indy movie into the tentpole class. They piled on the spectacle & Fleabag & heavy marketing. (They also had the $100m Kathleen Kennedy bad management tax.) The movie was creatively worse off for it too.
'Terminator' is another glaring example. They killed that franchise because they wouldn't settle for less than T2-size blockbusters. When it was briefly converted to a TV show in the late-2000s it responded really well to that.
The big glaring lesson I see is that budget matters. If Indy#5 sells $900m then it won't break even. 'Cocaine Bear' is a success with less than 10% of that. None of these 'bombs' are really bombing, they are just doing mid-grade sales after costing huge prices to make.
It gets back to the issue that the movie industry should have tackled decades ago. They need multi-tiered ticket pricing. The single ticket price is reducing the public's total movie trips and indirectly giving us more huge-budget shows. In the last few decades the medium-budget movie has practically gone extinct. Now movies are either $20m or $200m and nothing in between.
Look at Indy#5. This should never have been a top-budget movie in the first place. All the common-sense writing on the wall said this was not gonna be a big earner like the 1980s Indy shows. It was obvious at the brainstorming stage 5+ years ago.
If they could have made this movie for $100m, spent another $100m on limited (but well-targeted) marketing, and sold the theater ticket prices for $6/seat, it would have been a fine return on the effort. But no, 40 years after its prime they were still trying to force one last Indy movie into the tentpole class. They piled on the spectacle & Fleabag & heavy marketing. (They also had the $100m Kathleen Kennedy bad management tax.) The movie was creatively worse off for it too.
'Terminator' is another glaring example. They killed that franchise because they wouldn't settle for less than T2-size blockbusters. When it was briefly converted to a TV show in the late-2000s it responded really well to that.
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Box Office: ‘Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny’ Cursed With $60M Domestic Opening
The July Fourth tentpole appealed heavily to older adults, who have become more and more discerning about what they watch on the big screen versus on streaming.
www.hollywoodreporter.com
This doesn’t jive with Box Office Mojo’s numbers:
Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny
www.boxofficemojo.com
Cephus
Master Member
It's not just budget, it's content. Yes, budget is a big problem, but if you don't make movies that the audience wants to pay for and see, you're going to fail. If they had made the best Indy movie in the franchise and it had gone off like Avatar, then they'd have made money. They didn't do that. Even competing with Crystal Skull, which used to be the worst movie in the franchise, they're doing really badly. People told them that well before release, but they didn't listen. Disney no longer has a grasp on how to make good movies. Their box office receipts prove that conclusively. Their stock prices prove that conclusively. Every single franchise they own, they've driven into the ground. Star Wars is dead. Indiana Jones is dead. Willow, as much as it was ever a franchise, is dead. Lucasfilm certainly isn't worth what they paid for it, because they've squandered every bit of good will they ever had.
Changing ticket prices will only make it worse. If they raised prices on these crap movies, nobody would see them at all. Even on a really hot weekend, where lots of people want to go to the theater to get out of the heat, they're not paying to see Indiana Jones. You have to remember that ticket prices have already gone up dramatically between the last movie and this one. It's why, adjusted for inflation, Dial of Dysentery is going to underperform Crystal Skull by a massive margin.
It's kind of hard to fail that badly.
Yeah this is tanking at the box office
Cephus
Master Member
Just like everyone with a brain knew it would.Yeah this is tanking at the box office
Was there any way for another Indiana Jones movie to make money at this point?
The fan base is aging out, See a de-aged actor kids! The rest is this old guy you are supposed to have bonded with while watcing old movies with your Dad.
All I can think is put Chris Pratt as Indy and have Ford pass the torch in his portion of the film. I'm not saying I would want Pratt, I'm saying that was probably the only way this thing might have made money right now.
The fan base is aging out, See a de-aged actor kids! The rest is this old guy you are supposed to have bonded with while watcing old movies with your Dad.
All I can think is put Chris Pratt as Indy and have Ford pass the torch in his portion of the film. I'm not saying I would want Pratt, I'm saying that was probably the only way this thing might have made money right now.
You guys are still thinking too big.
Q. How did the Fleabag character get there? Setting aside KK's thing for white brunette British self-inserts, why does Indy#5 need to appeal to 13yo kids at all?
A. Because it needs to sell enough tickets to pay off the tentpole expense. And to pass the torch, because the franchise is supposedly so valuable, because they still think it's a tentpole earner.
Nicolas Cage makes cheap crappy movies that don't appeal to 13yo kids all the time.
Other people make cheap decent movies that don't appeal to 13yo kids all the time.
Indy#5 could have been a cheap or mid-grade movie that did not appeal to 13yo kids and did not need to launch a spinoff character at all. And if they had done that job well, it would have probably made more profit than the tentpole Indy#5 we got. Everybody would have been happier.
Q. How did the Fleabag character get there? Setting aside KK's thing for white brunette British self-inserts, why does Indy#5 need to appeal to 13yo kids at all?
A. Because it needs to sell enough tickets to pay off the tentpole expense. And to pass the torch, because the franchise is supposedly so valuable, because they still think it's a tentpole earner.
Nicolas Cage makes cheap crappy movies that don't appeal to 13yo kids all the time.
Other people make cheap decent movies that don't appeal to 13yo kids all the time.
Indy#5 could have been a cheap or mid-grade movie that did not appeal to 13yo kids and did not need to launch a spinoff character at all. And if they had done that job well, it would have probably made more profit than the tentpole Indy#5 we got. Everybody would have been happier.
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What's odd, is Mojo has numbers all the way through July 4th. Funny thing is, my calendar says it is only the 2nd.Box Office: ‘Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny’ Cursed With $60M Domestic Opening
The July Fourth tentpole appealed heavily to older adults, who have become more and more discerning about what they watch on the big screen versus on streaming.
This doesn’t jive with Box Office Mojo’s numbers:
Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny
Cephus
Master Member
The only thing that counts is Friday, Saturday and Sunday. Indy is dropping about 20% per day at the box office. I expect a huge dropoff by second weekend.
Cephus
Master Member
It should never have been made. You can make the case that Crystal Skull shouldn't have been made, but it at least performed in line with expectations and it made its money back. This is never going to.
Yep. If you look at Mojo's number under 'opening', what do you know, it says $60 million.
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