How was Vader's helmet modified from ANH to ESB to ROTJ

Yes, that's a great lineage tree! Just a few notes regarding the TM and the different runs:
- initial run ("TM run", 10 castings in total): TM ESB helmet casting (the dome was cast untouched), TM "ANH" faceplate casting (casting of the paint-free and restored faceplate)
- second run (TM ESB JRX, 6 castings in total): TM ESB helmet casting, TM ESB faceplate casting (based on an ESB version of the faceplate created by JRX based on an TM ANH faceplate casting)
- TM ANH dome castings ("TM ANH JRX"): castings of an ANH dome created by JRX based on a TM ESB dome casting
- TM ROTJ JRX: run of X helmets created by JRX based on a TM ESB helmet casting and a TM "ANH" faceplate casting
- TM final run - what's that?

Any chance you could include the Fiberdyne/Jeff White and the GH ANH? If I remember correcty those were the first "commercially" available Vader helmet castings.

Hi vadermania! This is far from a complete list. I just wanted to explain the linkage of the ones directly related. The reason I didnt include the GH ANH and the Fiberdyne is because it is my understanding they derived from castings done at Don Post making them a few generations away from the original molds.

PM coming about the other stuff
 
That's right -- the GS helmet. Thank you for reminding me! Their earlier casting is from a 20th Century helmet (the one that belonged to Darth Stone). That said, the C-scar cheek of the GS helmet was accidentally altered by its owner who attempted to strip it and in doing so damaged the casting.

That's even debatable, as the C-Scar may have never been there in the first place. ;)
 
By the way - the "VP" name was derived from the character played by Matt Lucas in Little Britain (BBC comedy show from the UK). The "VP" stands for "Vicky Pollard" which was the name of the character who went around saying "Yes, but no, but yes". Ha ha. I can't remember how it ended up being used to describe this particular mask though. Hopefully "voice in the crowd" can remind us. Just wanted to clarify that in this particular offering, the VP is not the initials of the owner of the mask that was used for casting. Sorry to disapoint - Victoria Principal is not the owner. LOL.


Well that was supposed to be a private in-joke but as you've now let the cat out the bag- this is absolutely correct. It came as a result of a number of questions that was put to the maker via myself and every time he answered the reply was "yes, but no, that doesn't sound right". I was forwarding these messages on and one day they said "oh god, every time I answer it's like yeah..but no..but yeah.." a few weeks later we were being asked to attribute initials to the cast and my friend didn't want his initials attached namely because he felt that would be like claiming credit for somebody elses' work, during a phone call I said "I've got the perfect name for it " and we both said "Vicky Pollard!" at the same time, and it stuck and that's why it's called the VP.

For what it's worth, it's derived from an ANH cast that was at Elstree studios, the dome was a ROTJ dome but it's incorrect that they were offered as a pair. In all honesty both myself and the owner were completely unaware of how desirable it was at the time, my friend had indeed begun clean up work on the face plate and had sanded the tabs off. At one point we did even consider if it was worthwhile adding tabs on as you can see the scratch marks where he sanded them but decided against it as it was original detailing that had been removed. All these conversations were relayed back and forth with a couple of collectors who guided us on what they felt would be the best option for the market. One bone of contention was that there were a number of minor air bubbles in the gel coat along the eye ridges, but this just went to prove the problems you have when trying to make a warts and all copy as one buyer believed this was a defect in the casting. A couple of other buyers made the point that this was present in theirs and indeed it came from the original cast which we had been told to stop working on.

The run was a fairly open run in so far as we never discussed numbers and a cut off point, we always said it would be available for a limited period of time and once that time had expired that would be it as to give people a fair chance. Sadly the silicone tore after the 7th pull, we did consider continuing to offer them but at that point we figured that it wasn't fair because there was damage present in the casts that was not an original detail and as such the run became limited by accident rather than design.

The original cast is still with the owner and to this date the lazy sod still hasn't gotten around to doing anything with them, in that time I have tried pushing him on the possibility of another run but in all honesty he simply doesn't seem that bothered, I have had a couple of ideas I've considered pitching to him but again, he just doesn't seem to have the interest I'm afraid. If the opportunity should ever arise again I will let people know about it but all I can really say on that front it don't hold your breath!

The really funny thing is I did post about the mask originally on here and nobody gave it much thought expect for Chris aka "voice In The Crowd", and as such he really is the guy who should get all the credit for making this available albeit very briefly.
 
Great info. Thanks Dano.
Apologies for letting the cat out of the bag. I wasn't aware that it was a private in-joke, otherwise I wouldn't have said anything.

Well that was supposed to be a private in-joke but as you've now let the cat out the bag- this is absolutely correct. It came as a result of a number of questions that was put to the maker via myself and every time he answered the reply was "yes, but no, that doesn't sound right". I was forwarding these messages on and one day they said "oh god, every time I answer it's like yeah..but no..but yeah.." a few weeks later we were being asked to attribute initials to the cast and my friend didn't want his initials attached namely because he felt that would be like claiming credit for somebody elses' work, during a phone call I said "I've got the perfect name for it " and we both said "Vicky Pollard!" at the same time, and it stuck and that's why it's called the VP.

For what it's worth, it's derived from an ANH cast that was at Elstree studios, the dome was a ROTJ dome but it's incorrect that they were offered as a pair. In all honesty both myself and the owner were completely unaware of how desirable it was at the time, my friend had indeed begun clean up work on the face plate and had sanded the tabs off. At one point we did even consider if it was worthwhile adding tabs on as you can see the scratch marks where he sanded them but decided against it as it was original detailing that had been removed. All these conversations were relayed back and forth with a couple of collectors who guided us on what they felt would be the best option for the market. One bone of contention was that there were a number of minor air bubbles in the gel coat along the eye ridges, but this just went to prove the problems you have when trying to make a warts and all copy as one buyer believed this was a defect in the casting. A couple of other buyers made the point that this was present in theirs and indeed it came from the original cast which we had been told to stop working on.

The run was a fairly open run in so far as we never discussed numbers and a cut off point, we always said it would be available for a limited period of time and once that time had expired that would be it as to give people a fair chance. Sadly the silicone tore after the 7th pull, we did consider continuing to offer them but at that point we figured that it wasn't fair because there was damage present in the casts that was not an original detail and as such the run became limited by accident rather than design.

The original cast is still with the owner and to this date the lazy sod still hasn't gotten around to doing anything with them, in that time I have tried pushing him on the possibility of another run but in all honesty he simply doesn't seem that bothered, I have had a couple of ideas I've considered pitching to him but again, he just doesn't seem to have the interest I'm afraid. If the opportunity should ever arise again I will let people know about it but all I can really say on that front it don't hold your breath!

The really funny thing is I did post about the mask originally on here and nobody gave it much thought expect for Chris aka "voice In The Crowd", and as such he really is the guy who should get all the credit for making this available albeit very briefly.
 
Great info. Thanks Dano.
Apologies for letting the cat out of the bag. I wasn't aware that it was a private in-joke, otherwise I wouldn't have said anything.

No worries, it's out there now so I figured I may as well let people know! Enough people seemed to know about it off board so it was always going to be a matter of time before the truth would out!
 
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I've just skimmed through an old external hard drive. These have been shared on other forums I'm sure, but these were the original pictures we sent out to people at the time showing the face plate and the dome, it's probably because of the pictures together that some may have thought they were being offered as a pair. As you can see, my friend was actually gearing up to cut the bigger vent in, he'd had access to a production made ESB helmeta couple of years earlier and had taken the measurements from that.


vader 5.jpg
vader 6.jpg
vader 7.jpg
vader 8.jpg
 
Well that was supposed to be a private in-joke but as you've now let the cat out the bag- this is absolutely correct. It came as a result of a number of questions that was put to the maker via myself and every time he answered the reply was "yes, but no, that doesn't sound right". I was forwarding these messages on and one day they said "oh god, every time I answer it's like yeah..but no..but yeah.." a few weeks later we were being asked to attribute initials to the cast and my friend didn't want his initials attached namely because he felt that would be like claiming credit for somebody elses' work, during a phone call I said "I've got the perfect name for it " and we both said "Vicky Pollard!" at the same time, and it stuck and that's why it's called the VP.

For what it's worth, it's derived from an ANH cast that was at Elstree studios, the dome was a ROTJ dome but it's incorrect that they were offered as a pair. In all honesty both myself and the owner were completely unaware of how desirable it was at the time, my friend had indeed begun clean up work on the face plate and had sanded the tabs off. At one point we did even consider if it was worthwhile adding tabs on as you can see the scratch marks where he sanded them but decided against it as it was original detailing that had been removed. All these conversations were relayed back and forth with a couple of collectors who guided us on what they felt would be the best option for the market. One bone of contention was that there were a number of minor air bubbles in the gel coat along the eye ridges, but this just went to prove the problems you have when trying to make a warts and all copy as one buyer believed this was a defect in the casting. A couple of other buyers made the point that this was present in theirs and indeed it came from the original cast which we had been told to stop working on.

The run was a fairly open run in so far as we never discussed numbers and a cut off point, we always said it would be available for a limited period of time and once that time had expired that would be it as to give people a fair chance. Sadly the silicone tore after the 7th pull, we did consider continuing to offer them but at that point we figured that it wasn't fair because there was damage present in the casts that was not an original detail and as such the run became limited by accident rather than design.

The original cast is still with the owner and to this date the lazy sod still hasn't gotten around to doing anything with them, in that time I have tried pushing him on the possibility of another run but in all honesty he simply doesn't seem that bothered, I have had a couple of ideas I've considered pitching to him but again, he just doesn't seem to have the interest I'm afraid. If the opportunity should ever arise again I will let people know about it but all I can really say on that front it don't hold your breath!

The really funny thing is I did post about the mask originally on here and nobody gave it much thought expect for Chris aka "voice In The Crowd", and as such he really is the guy who should get all the credit for making this available albeit very briefly.


Oh how I’d love a VP, to create a ROTJ, and pair it with Mark’s CFO dome.
 
Oh how I’d love a VP, to create a ROTJ, and pair it with Mark’s CFO dome.

One issue with the GS though. The lip was filled in for some odd reason. I can tell by the resin texture that it was filled in after the GS was cast on my copy. I never brought it up with Mark though.
 
Thought this was the pefect thread to post this since its original intent was to discuss how the Vader helmet changed between ANH to ROTJ.

I recently got hold of a couple of excellent French prop books showcasing the collection of Arnaud Grunberg and Patrice Girod. Arnaud has got the original ANH Vader mask in his collection. The ANH mask is featured inside the book but an ESB dome and mask is shown on the front cover.

I'm curious to know what people think about this? The eye lenses were presumably replaced because they look grey (not amber) in the photos shown in the book. I had read comments from people saying that the mask he's got was untouched since filming, but to me, it looks like this is the repainted version as it appeared in the Chronicles book photos.
 

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