JediG60racer
Sr Member
Hand in the picture is not a bad thing for rough scale. Of course, a quarter will work too 
Firefox MIG-31 movie aircraft
- Thread starter Firefox3D
- Start date
Gadget2012
New Member
That looks amazing. I've always been a huge fan of Firefox.
Good skills!!!
Good skills!!!
Loving this, best looking plane ever, thought a couple of times about makimg a flying model.
You may have renewed my vigor for such a project.
You may have renewed my vigor for such a project.
Firefox3D
Well-Known Member
Thanks guys, working on tidying up and applying panel lines by hand. Not going to go mad, just a test really to see it works out when the surface is filled and smoothed.
On that subject found some finishing putty from a local Halfords which I think is probably very similar to the 3M white, needs a decent time to dry properly hard, but then sands glass smooth.
Found out Colorfabb who make the filament I have been using have released a new type, which I think they have done in response to the type of issues I have been having. Just bought some on a Black Friday deal, hopefully will give better results for the final moulding masters.
On that subject found some finishing putty from a local Halfords which I think is probably very similar to the 3M white, needs a decent time to dry properly hard, but then sands glass smooth.
Found out Colorfabb who make the filament I have been using have released a new type, which I think they have done in response to the type of issues I have been having. Just bought some on a Black Friday deal, hopefully will give better results for the final moulding masters.
Firefox3D
Well-Known Member
Hi guys, sorry not much to report really, have done some upgrades to my printer, and been using it for what I actually bought it for namely prototyping for my business. With that xmas and a really crappy virus which I have had for over 2 weeks the project went on the back-burner.
I had cleaned up and smoothed most of the one I had printed but after discovering a couple of things that were causing the relatively bad surface finish, was maybe just going to do it again. Also the new filament type is considerably easier and more forgiving to print with and might even make all panel lines possible, have yet to fully test this but managed to print a wing part with some near vertical lines and even an almost perfect defence pod with holes less than 1mm. Small downside is it only glues together with superglue or epoxy, the plastic weld stuff which worked brilliantly with the previous similar material hardly makes a dent in it.
I have stuff to finish to pay the bills this week but will be back on it after that.
I had cleaned up and smoothed most of the one I had printed but after discovering a couple of things that were causing the relatively bad surface finish, was maybe just going to do it again. Also the new filament type is considerably easier and more forgiving to print with and might even make all panel lines possible, have yet to fully test this but managed to print a wing part with some near vertical lines and even an almost perfect defence pod with holes less than 1mm. Small downside is it only glues together with superglue or epoxy, the plastic weld stuff which worked brilliantly with the previous similar material hardly makes a dent in it.
I have stuff to finish to pay the bills this week but will be back on it after that.
JediG60racer
Sr Member
"MOLD". You mean "mold" the damn plane... so we non 3D printer people can all make one!!!
Firefox3D
Well-Known Member
Sometimes things come to he who waits.
I hadn't had much time to progress and then I get a pm from a member who has picked up an unused resin tailplane for the 1/12 hero. I asked for a couple more pics and reference dimensions so I could recreate it exactly.
Turns out dimensionally they stuck to whole or down to 1/8" dimensions since it would make it easier to scale. Also the angle on the lower front section lines up with the top corner, again,makes it easy to replicate.
Using the correct size tailplane to what I had showed me I was slightly over scale. Basing the top of the engines as a hopefully correct size reference relative to the tailplane I had to adjust down by 5%. Now the overall length comes out within a fraction of 15.75" the correct size for 1/48th, 63" at 1/12th for the hero.
With the tailplane itself I wasn't far off overall, slightly too much angle back, and the rear kink was a bit too small.
Didn't notice it until I took this screen-grab but the angle of the lower rear of the tailplane now matches the angle on the rear of the body engine section
Thinking they may have well used whole or fractional measurements for other parts I scaled to 1/12th and got a confirmation that I must be pretty damn close to correct.
Other main dimensions work out such as 13" for the width of the front of the engine section and 13" for the main engine section depth, 31" main wing to wing end width, 3.5" depth of intakes from bottom wing etc. Kind of wish this had occurred to me before as it would have helped me size parts.
So next to rebuilt the tailplanes with the correct profiles.
I hadn't had much time to progress and then I get a pm from a member who has picked up an unused resin tailplane for the 1/12 hero. I asked for a couple more pics and reference dimensions so I could recreate it exactly.
Turns out dimensionally they stuck to whole or down to 1/8" dimensions since it would make it easier to scale. Also the angle on the lower front section lines up with the top corner, again,makes it easy to replicate.
Using the correct size tailplane to what I had showed me I was slightly over scale. Basing the top of the engines as a hopefully correct size reference relative to the tailplane I had to adjust down by 5%. Now the overall length comes out within a fraction of 15.75" the correct size for 1/48th, 63" at 1/12th for the hero.
With the tailplane itself I wasn't far off overall, slightly too much angle back, and the rear kink was a bit too small.
Didn't notice it until I took this screen-grab but the angle of the lower rear of the tailplane now matches the angle on the rear of the body engine section
Thinking they may have well used whole or fractional measurements for other parts I scaled to 1/12th and got a confirmation that I must be pretty damn close to correct.
Other main dimensions work out such as 13" for the width of the front of the engine section and 13" for the main engine section depth, 31" main wing to wing end width, 3.5" depth of intakes from bottom wing etc. Kind of wish this had occurred to me before as it would have helped me size parts.
So next to rebuilt the tailplanes with the correct profiles.
i know that Apogee made several models (as well as the full size prop). There might be some differences in sizes and shapes between the RC birds and the MOCO model. They seemed to all come off of the same blueprints, but they also made some changes along the way that may not have been documented. Regardless, this is looking great.
Gene
Firefox3D
Well-Known Member
Hi Gene, having stared at pictures for a loooong time I think I could just about tell you every difference between the two 63" versions, the 21" and the full size prop, some subtle, some not so subtle.
I think the design evolved from the original blueprint when they were sculpting, it's quite different to the blueprint seen in the film, although I am not sure if that is the original design or drawn up from the model to appear in the film?
Currently working on rebuilding the top of the engine profile, Having the exact profile of the top of the engines from the tailplane I could see it was a bit off. Also I had seen something in one of the reference pics that I thought was lens distortion, but now revisiting that part realise is an effect from how they created the angled slices on the top corners with a chisel.
They are relatively small changes, but when I saw it I couldn't leave it alone! Nearly finished, will post a comparison when I am done.
Jon
I think the design evolved from the original blueprint when they were sculpting, it's quite different to the blueprint seen in the film, although I am not sure if that is the original design or drawn up from the model to appear in the film?
Currently working on rebuilding the top of the engine profile, Having the exact profile of the top of the engines from the tailplane I could see it was a bit off. Also I had seen something in one of the reference pics that I thought was lens distortion, but now revisiting that part realise is an effect from how they created the angled slices on the top corners with a chisel.
They are relatively small changes, but when I saw it I couldn't leave it alone! Nearly finished, will post a comparison when I am done.
Jon
Firefox3D
Well-Known Member
The madness continues, spent what seems like a very long time on some small changes, but realised as well as the engine top/sides profiles being off, the rear "parsons nose" as in the bit at the end of the fuselage between the engines was off. I kind of knew it was, but it was a major pita the first time round, however new tools made it less so this time.
Old on left new on right
Fuselage section slopes down more towards the back and is flatter on top. There is more of a curve to the top of the engines and the inner steps are steeper.
The side slices on the engines are as they would be if you chiselled it by hand, which is how they would have done it. The top of the engines curves down to the intakes, and the angled section of the intake was slightly offset outwards, realised it lines up with the inboard intake fin when viewed nose on.
Now all that is done I can rebuild the tail-planes which is easy by comparison, lol.
Old on left new on right
Fuselage section slopes down more towards the back and is flatter on top. There is more of a curve to the top of the engines and the inner steps are steeper.
The side slices on the engines are as they would be if you chiselled it by hand, which is how they would have done it. The top of the engines curves down to the intakes, and the angled section of the intake was slightly offset outwards, realised it lines up with the inboard intake fin when viewed nose on.
Now all that is done I can rebuild the tail-planes which is easy by comparison, lol.
TBH even I can only just see one of those changes and I'm a huge fan of this plane. The parson's nose certainly does look better. Those curved surfaces are real fun aren't they, but it's great to see someone making this kind of effort. Nobody has ever tackled the subject to this level of perfectionism. :thumbsup
Last edited:
Firefox3D
Well-Known Member
Thanks Martyn, I tried pulling the model into Rhino as I thought the curved surface would be easier/quicker to do, but as it appears as a mesh rather than surfaces I don't think I would have gained much, plus I need a lot more time with Rhino to get proficient at it I think!
You're doing fine with Sketchup, I wouldn't worry about it. That program has come a long way.
FYI though, you can actually do "hybrid" things with models that are already meshes - for example I have a project with a ripped in-game ship mesh from Elite: Dangerous, rejigging it to be printable. There's no need to re-do all the surfaces when the printable file will be a mesh anyway.
FYI though, you can actually do "hybrid" things with models that are already meshes - for example I have a project with a ripped in-game ship mesh from Elite: Dangerous, rejigging it to be printable. There's no need to re-do all the surfaces when the printable file will be a mesh anyway.
Firefox3D
Well-Known Member
I will give it another try as there is something else I want to build (Pink Panther car) that I think will be easier in Rhino. The actual issue was when I imported the main fuselage section Rhino nearly ground to a halt, there are quite a few triangles in there, or maybe it's the way Rhino deals with the file import, can't remember if I tried it with a DXF or STL file.
Have done work on other mesh files in Rhino, namely a Powder Puff girl for my niece which was a messy STL that needed breaking up as Sketchup had trouble importing it whole.
This is totally unrelated but if you want to do character modelling XNALara posing software is fun to play with, plenty of game character models out there that people have extracted from games and made pose-able. Working on a custom Lara Croft model for a bit of fun.
Have done work on other mesh files in Rhino, namely a Powder Puff girl for my niece which was a messy STL that needed breaking up as Sketchup had trouble importing it whole.
This is totally unrelated but if you want to do character modelling XNALara posing software is fun to play with, plenty of game character models out there that people have extracted from games and made pose-able. Working on a custom Lara Croft model for a bit of fun.
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