Captain America: Civil War

[Fawbish]

Quick question - having seen a few clips etc from Civil War now.

Bucky - when was it established in this universe that he could match Cap for running speed etc?

I was totally under the impression that the bionic arm allowed him to make a significant deficit of outright strength up to Cap and gave him a slight advantage in certain situations, and his use of weapons and mercenaries helped out too. I accepted that he was experimented upon to become "more" than a man in some sense, hence fighting against a Cap that is holding back, he almost comes across as an equal (but not quite)

When was it shown that he was as fast, or could do pretty much everything Cap can do? Just feels a little odd to me and I wondered if I'd forgotten a scene where it has a precedent?

 

[karmajay]

It is known that he was experimented on with an equivalent "super serum" which makes him pretty close to Cap in all that stuff.

 

[dascoyne]

The wait is killing me.

I'm sure the battle is going to be particularly brutal - especially since Tony and Steve's moms have different names. :lol

 

[Fawbish]

It is known that he was experimented on with an equivalent "super serum" which makes him pretty close to Cap in all that stuff.

Don't remember them stating or showing that in the film though. I knew he'd be experimented on "New fist of Hydra" or whatever.

If they had solved the Super Soldier serum, why don't more Winter Soldier's exist? Where is the serum army etc?

 

[TheNickFox]

Don't remember them stating or showing that in the film though. I knew he'd be experimented on "New fist of Hydra" or whatever.

If they had solved the Super Soldier serum, why don't more Winter Soldier's exist? Where is the serum army etc?

MAJOR SPOILER:

Spoiler

There are other Winter Soldiers in this movie, all of whom have been treated with the serum. It seems serum + brain washing is what is required to be a Winter Soldier. So Bucky's had the serum. Hence his "Is it permanent" line from Cap 1. He was asking for himself.

-Nick

 

[Snikt]

Don't remember them stating or showing that in the film though. I knew he'd be experimented on "New fist of Hydra" or whatever.

If they had solved the Super Soldier serum, why don't more Winter Soldier's exist? Where is the serum army etc?

Without clicking on the spoiler link from NickFox, I have been wondering if the images of Bucky we see doing bad stuff are clones. I was analyzing the trailers(nerd alert) and the first time they show "Bucky" when the cryotube looking thing is opened, he doesnt have the star on his arm, and there are a few tube looking things that look yellow in the trailer. So who knows, maybe those are clones of Bucky and he is getting framed for all the bad stuff they are doing, cause, ya know...clones. Thats just my theory though. Im sure as hell not clicking on that damn spoiler tag again!

 

[Fawbish]

MAJOR SPOILER:

Spoiler

There are other Winter Soldiers in this movie, all of whom have been treated with the serum. It seems serum + brain washing is what is required to be a Winter Soldier. So Bucky's had the serum. Hence his "Is it permanent" line from Cap 1. He was asking for himself.

-Nick

EDIT: Ignore.

 

[TheNickFox]

Fawbish those are CA: CW spoilers. You may want to remove your second line or spoiler tag it.

...I was trying to prevent people from seeing plot points accidentally, and what I wrote there is something that is shown in Civil War.

-Nick

 

[Fawbish]

Without clicking on the spoiler link from NickFox, I have been wondering if the images of Bucky we see doing bad stuff are clones. I was analyzing the trailers(nerd alert) and the first time they show "Bucky" when the cryotube looking thing is opened, he doesnt have the star on his arm, and there are a few tube looking things that look yellow in the trailer. So who knows, maybe those are clones of Bucky and he is getting framed for all the bad stuff they are doing, cause, ya know...clones. Thats just my theory though. Im sure as hell not clicking on that damn spoiler tag again!

Spoiler

Oh, well that actually would change things a bit.

Clones is something I hadn't considered at all. That changes the idea that Bucky himself carried out all of the assassinations over the years. Also calls into question if the original Bucky exists at all, or his memories are transplanted each time.

I don't quite buy it yet, but I aren't ready to sell it either.

Only 9 days to find out for me.

:devil

 

[TheNickFox]

Thats just my theory though. Im sure as hell not clicking on that damn spoiler tag again!

Sorry I accidentally turned this into an exercise in self-control. :lol

-Nick

PS: You guys are going to LOVE this movie.

 

[Fawbish]

@Fawbish those are CA: CW spoilers. You may want to remove your second line or spoiler tag it.

...I was trying to prevent people from seeing plot points accidentally, and what I wrote there is something that is shown in Civil War.

-Nick

Yep, realised within a minute or so and deleted! I was being a tad slow, my apologies anyone.

 

[Snikt]

Yep, realised within a minute or so and deleted! I was being a tad slow, my apologies anyone.

I missed it so Im cool haha! Its cool TheNickFox, I would be doing the same thing if I saw this before everyone else. I CANT WAIT. I wish it was tomorrow night that I was seeing it. But alas, it is still weeks away. :cry

 

[Goldhawk]

CROSSBONES! Please tell me how long he's in and if he's as good as last time! I've been waiting for him and Cap to rematch since winter soldier.

Also, about Bucky, Zola experimented on him in CA: TFA. And in CA: WS he looks pretty close to Cap in skills. Plus that arm gives him a big strength advantage.

 

[TheNickFox]

CROSSBONES! Please tell me how long he's in and if he's as good as last time! I've been waiting for him and Cap to rematch since winter soldier.

CA: CW Spoilers ahoy!

Crossbones:

Spoiler

Crossbones is in the first 15 minutes only. He is to this film what Baron Von Strucker was to Avengers: Age of Ultron. He's good and serves a VERY key plot point, but isn't in it as much as it sounds like you're hoping for.

-Nick

 

[Goldhawk]

Spoiler

Awwww. I was hoping that he would get put in prison and Tony would bail him out later to help fight Cap. Plus I kinda was hoping for an Agent 13-Crossbones fight.
I guess as long as he doesn't accidentally fall into a sarlaac pit it's all good.

- - - Updated - - -

Thanks!

#teamcap

 

[drcraig13]

*Caution Long post. I have really been thinking a lot about the Sokovia accord. At least from what I gather from the trailer's is that Ross is showing New York, D.C. and Sokovia as reasons to wrangle the team in. But if you look at it Sokovia is the only one of these incidence that you can blame on the Avenger's (i.e.. Tony Stark and Bruce Banner) in the MCU anyway. I mean IM2, corrupt government/hydra trying to copy Tony's suits get's Hammer involved. IM3, Government run think tank tries to take revenge on Tony and start anarchy. CA TFA WW2. Avenger's again government run agency dealing with something that they had no clue how to run. TWS again corrupt government agency/hydra trying to take over the world. If not for Captain America a lot of people would have been killed.

I guess my point that I'm making is this thought process makes it a lot easier for me to be on team Cap. He has seen these things being influenced directly by corrupt governments.

 

[TheNickFox]

*Caution Long post. I have really been thinking a lot about the Sokovia accord. At least from what I gather from the trailer's is that Ross is showing New York, D.C. and Sokovia as reasons to wrangle the team in. But if you look at it Sokovia is the only one of these incidence that you can blame on the Avenger's (i.e.. Tony Stark and Bruce Banner) in the MCU anyway. I mean IM2, corrupt government/hydra trying to copy Tony's suits get's Hammer involved. IM3, Government run think tank tries to take revenge on Tony and start anarchy. CA TFA WW2. Avenger's again government run agency dealing with something that they had no clue how to run. TWS again corrupt government agency/hydra trying to take over the world. If not for Captain America a lot of people would have been killed.

I guess my point that I'm making is this thought process makes it a lot easier for me to be on team Cap. He has seen these things being influenced directly by corrupt governments.

The movie does a GREAT job of giving both sides valid arguments. Even after seeing it, I can support both sides. (And I was fully Team Cap going in)

-Nick

 

[Father]

*Caution Long post. I have really been thinking a lot about the Sokovia accord. At least from what I gather from the trailer's is that Ross is showing New York, D.C. and Sokovia as reasons to wrangle the team in. But if you look at it Sokovia is the only one of these incidence that you can blame on the Avenger's (i.e.. Tony Stark and Bruce Banner) in the MCU anyway. I mean IM2, corrupt government/hydra trying to copy Tony's suits get's Hammer involved. IM3, Government run think tank tries to take revenge on Tony and start anarchy. CA TFA WW2. Avenger's again government run agency dealing with something that they had no clue how to run. TWS again corrupt government agency/hydra trying to take over the world. If not for Captain America a lot of people would have been killed.

I guess my point that I'm making is this thought process makes it a lot easier for me to be on team Cap. He has seen these things being influenced directly by corrupt governments.

Agreed. My theory... Stark is behind the accords because he was pretty much responsible for Ultron and therefore indirectly responsible for Sokovia.
S.H.I.E.L.D. (Hydra?) was responsible for NYC indirectly for going above and beyond to get the Tesseract.

 

[Goldhawk]

Agreed. My theory... Stark is behind the accords because he was pretty much responsible for Ultron and therefore indirectly responsible for Sokovia.
S.H.I.E.L.D. (Hydra?) was responsible for NYC indirectly for going above and beyond to get the Tesseract.

Yep, I'm thinking that Tony is feeling guilty for Ultron, hence the "we need to be put in check" line. He thinks that he's a prime example of why the accords should exist. But Steve is thinking of how well HYDRA infiltrated SHIELD. He doesn't want to ever be put in a situation where there might be compartmentalizations or hidden agendas.

 

[Snikt]

Yep, I'm thinking that Tony is feeling guilty for Ultron, hence the "we need to be put in check" line. He thinks that he's a prime example of why the accords should exist. But Steve is thinking of how well HYDRA infiltrated SHIELD. He doesn't want to ever be put in a situation where there might be compartmentalizations or hidden agendas.

Dont you think its kind of a 180 in character though considering the first 2 iron man movies Tony basically said **** off to the government? Thats the only thing thats really bothering me, is that Tony is going for government registration. IM3 didnt really touch on it if I remember, I only saw it once because I wasnt really a fan.