The Ultimate Luke ANH Graflex Research & Discussion Thread

[roygilsing]

I agree with this hypothesis. I imagine an L-shaped bent piece of metal inside the saber with the long arm of the L attached to the ID of the tube by the four rivets between the grips and the short arm of the L attached to the backside of the disk by the two rivets that also hold on the makeshift bracket for the D-ring.

But that still begs the question... Why did they (apparently) not reinforce the bottom disk of the Graflex flash on the ESB saber(s)? The Kobold clip is anchored to that same disk, right? As others have pointed out, the ESB sabers saw a lot more action but apparently there was no problem with the bottom disk pulling out of the tube. Were the prop makers for ANH just overly-cautious? Is v312 saying in post #178 above that the ANH hero saber might have been built from a generation of Graflex flash that was inherently weaker on the bottom disk than the generation of Graflex flashes used for ESB Luke sabers?

I completely agree on the L bracket. The reason for different rivet sizes might have to do with the alignment of the holes. I can imagine that drilled holes can be hard to align and after applying the larger (3mm) rivets they didn't manage to put in two more but needed smaller ones to pass through the double holes.

And why they haven't reinforced the ESB sabers? Maybe they have but we don't know about it (epoxy inside?) or perhaps a different prop maker didn't think it was any issue.

 

[Gregatron]

What about a solid piece of rod (metal or wood), instead of an L-bracket?

 

[The 48th Ronin]

What about a solid piece of rod (metal or wood), instead of an L-bracket?

Because that's not how rivets work. If it was something solid you'd use screws to screw into it.

 

[Gregatron]

Sorry, I meant pipe. Tube. Something relatively thick-walled, but with space for pop-rivets to grip into.

 

[v312]

Still it is little strange how close to the edge are the holes of the top rivets. There's something like 1mm recess, then the bottom plate which I'm not sure how thick it is but probably also at least 1mm, then the bracket and then the hole must go under it. Somehow it does not add up

If somebody drilled his replica and installed the rivets - please share your experience

 

[Gregatron]

I think glare on the rivets is making them look bigger than they really are in that photo.

I've drilled and riveted a few bottom tubes, and reasonably close to edge (using Roy's grip guide template). No problems.

 

[v312]

I think glare on the rivets is making them look bigger than they really are in that photo.

I've drilled and riveted a few bottom tubes, and reasonably close to edge (using Roy's grip guide template). No problems.

But is there enough clearance left to fit a reasonable think L-bracket between the rivet and the bottom?

 

[AnubisGuard]

or perhaps a different prop maker didn't think it was any issue

I think this is the most likely. Different group of people, different approach, nobody considered it an issue.

 

[AnubisGuard]

Because that's not how rivets work. If it was something solid you'd use screws to screw into it.

I've driven pop rivets into solid material before, so it's possible. What makes it more likely to be brackets or a bit of pipe is the placement of the rivets; the way they're paired with the location of the two D-ring rivets implies two narrow strips or one wide strip of material. If it were a plug, like say a chunk of wood dowel, the location wouldn't need to be so close to the D-ring; they could be placed at any o'clock position around the circumference of the flash. Hell, they could even have put them under the grips if they'd wanted to.

 

[Obi1Kenobi]

I've driven pop rivets into solid material before, so it's possible. What makes it more likely to be brackets or a bit of pipe is the placement of the rivets; the way they're paired with the location of the two D-ring rivets implies two narrow strips or one wide strip of material. If it were a plug, like say a chunk of wood dowel, the location wouldn't need to be so close to the D-ring; they could be placed at any o'clock position around the circumference of the flash. Hell, they could even have put them under the grips if they'd wanted to.

I always figured they put the side rivets on what was supposed to be the 'back' side of the saber when hanging on a belt. I think there was only one day of filming (and I think I also read it was the first day of filming with the prop on his belt) where Mark Hamill has the saber hanging with the side rivets outward. That's where this image comes from:

 

[Gregatron]

Going by the shooting order as presented in Rinzler’s MAKING OF book, the first scene shot to involve the prop would be where Luke, Ben, and the droids observe Mos Eisley in the distance, which I believe is indeed the scene where that photo comes from. Maybe Hamill just had the prop hooked to his belt the other way around, that day, but decided it was a bit more comfortable the other way?

 

[SethS]

Somebody draw a ding dang diagram, cause after a year and half since the Elstree discovery I still can’t picture it in my head.

(sidebar, this reply can be applied to a LOT of threads on here!)

 

[roygilsing]

Somebody draw a ding dang diagram, cause after a year and half since the Elstree discovery I still can’t picture it in my head.

(sidebar, this reply can be applied to a LOT of threads on here!)

I'll make you a drawing Seth. In 3D.

 

[vadermania]

I‘d say the rivets just cover two holes in the prop which were the result of an earlier attempt to attach a ring or hook or whatever to hang the prop on Lukes belt.

 

[roygilsing]

Like this SethS

 

[teecrooz]

I think you guys should re-evaluate your rivet size and positions. Smaller rivets still don’t make sense and Roy’s overlay shows this fact.

 

[IronDestinyProps]

I have also raised that observation with Roy, and I think he is still not finished tweaking the 3D model yet?

 

[roygilsing]

The rivet sizes are correct. What you see there is a work in progress and not every view was aligned correctly.
Here's that detail again:

When the update is done I will also update the blueprint accordingly and post some new findings with regards to grip sizes and positions.

Roy

 

[Gregatron]

Over the last months, I’ve had a nagging feeling that my replica could be better. So, I’ve been collecting parts (grips, new replica lower, Roy’s new bubble strip and RAF sidebar, etc.) to prepare for another round of revisions. Then, like kismet, this thread comes along, and promises new discoveries. Looks like that instinct will pay off!

 

[v312]

Looks like the side rivets were placed before the grips.

Going by the shooting order as presented in Rinzler’s MAKING OF book, the first scene shot to involve the prop would be where Luke, Ben, and the droids observe Mos Eisley in the distance, which I believe is indeed the scene where that photo comes from. Maybe Hamill just had the prop hooked to his belt the other way around, that day, but decided it was a bit more comfortable the other way?

In all props they have the bubbles show on the front side when hanging on the belt. I think it is by design like that.
But I can imagine it is also more comfortable as the ring is attached little to the rivet side of the saber and of course not having the control box bumping into you all the time.