Star Trek: Strange New Worlds

[Picard102]

I also fail to see the false equivalency between that observation and the comment regarding New-Trek writing in general and their penchant for flawed characters whose history seems always to be colored by whatever “trauma” motivates their behavior.

The equivalency is that it's present in "Old Trek". From Spock's upbringing, "Let them Die" Kirk, rape gangs and Yar, to Picard and the Borg. Many characters either have had trauma in their backstory, or has it introduced in the series, and it informs their personalities. This isn't "New-Trek".

Rather than attacking any observation made, or opinion held by any other member in this thread, I would be interested in hearing what the virtues are in the version of New-Trek.

This is a thread about SNW, when the show comes out I'll be happy to talk about what I liked about it. But let's not pretend that calling people intellectually deficient or whinging about diversity is an "observation" or "opinion" that should go unnoticed.

 

[Captain Dunsel]

The equivalency is that it's present in "Old Trek". From Spock's upbringing, "Let them Die" Kirk, rape gangs and Yar, to Picard and the Borg. Many characters either have had trauma in their backstory, or has it introduced in the series, and it informs their personalities. This isn't "New-Trek".


This is a thread about SNW, when the show comes out I'll be happy to talk about what I liked about it. But let's not pretend that calling people intellectually deficient or whinging about diversity is an "observation" or "opinion" that should go unnoticed.

Again…I’m curious to hear about the virtues and qualities of New-Trek that I and others must be missing.

Going to great lengths to try to find singular examples of loosely related character traits or
false equivalencies to modern Trek in the prior 700 plus hours of Trek history really doesn’t win many people over to the argument being made.

Again, if the intent is to shine a spotlight on what others may be missing in the quality of New-Trek, I am all ears.

Otherwise, I tend to find that if the intent is merely to badger and attack people into changing their perception it really doesn’t work all that well.

 

[kalkamel]

You're absolutely right. Any quality issues with the writing should be attributable to gremlins (or tribbles?) in the word processor, not the writers. After all, some of them have written episodes for thought provoking shows like Desperate Housewives, Superior Donuts and MacGyver (the new one, not the classic). If anyone knows Star Trek better than us commonfolk, its them. Especially that wizard Akiva Goldsman.

 

[Picard102]

Again…I’m curious to hear about the virtues and qualities of New-Trek that I and others must be missing.

Again, this is a SNW thread. It comes out next week. Stay tuned.

Going to great lengths to try to find singular examples of loosely related character traits or
false equivalencies to modern Trek in the prior 700 plus hours of Trek history really doesn’t win many people over to the argument being made.

Great lengths? Naming off the top of my head key characters with traumatic experiences and backstories isn't a difficult exercise. The dismissing of those examples doesn't make me believe you're interested in arguments to "win" you over.

Again, calling people intellectually deficient or whinging about diversity isn't an "observation" or "argument", and should be pointed out so that people can do better.

 

[kalkamel]

 

[Picard102]

It's not on youtube yet, but here's the opening credits, without text. Mount does the classic monologue.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1520041750005493764

Looks good. Lots of negative space that I'm sure will be filled with credits. Music wasn't what I was expecting, based on the trailers, but they never are.

 

[Lightning]

Look, I've personally witnessed Voyager and Enterprise go from the worst things ever filmed to respected members of the franchise (and so have you), so forgive me if I take the gnashing of teeth over Discovery and Picard with a grain of salt. And I say that while acknowledging Discovery and Picard are very flawed shows. The issue is directly related to a fundamental incompatibility of arc based storytelling with a show set on a Starship that's supposed to go somewhere new every week. Your problem has to be big enough to require traveling the galaxy to solve, hence the reliance on galaxy ending threats. Or you get rid of the ship and get stuck in one place like Picard Season 2. There's a reason DS9, the only one set on a space station, is the only one that has successfully done long form arc based stories. And even DS9 fell back on a Galaxy spanning war in the end.

So, since the fundamental issue with new trek is arc bases stories, and SNW is episodic, forgive me for thinking SNW might actually be good.

By the way Prodigy and Lower Decks are both new Trek and they are both great. Lower Decks is explicitly is stand alone, and Prodigy isn't any more arc based than Voyager.

 

[kalkamel]

Look, I've personally witnessed Voyager and Enterprise go from the worst things ever filmed to respected members of the franchise (and so have you), so forgive me if I take the gnashing of teeth over Discovery and Picard with a grain of salt. And I say that while acknowledging Discovery and Picard are very flawed shows. The issue is directly related to a fundamental incompatibility of arc based storytelling with a show set on a Starship that's supposed to go somewhere new every week. Your problem has to be big enough to require traveling the galaxy to solve, hence the reliance on galaxy ending threats. Or you get rid of the ship and get stuck in one place like Picard Season 2. There's a reason DS9, the only one set on a space station, is the only one that has successfully done long form arc based stories. And even DS9 fell back on a Galaxy spanning war in the end.

So, since the fundamental issue with new trek is arc bases stories, and SNW is episodic, forgive me for thinking SNW might actually be good.

By the way Prodigy and Lower Decks are both new Trek and they are both great. Lower Decks is explicitly is stand alone, and Prodigy isn't any more arc based than Voyager.

I recently just started watching Prodigy out of curiosity and to my surprise, I liked it. Comparisons with the Clone Wars/Rebels aside, I thought of all the new shows, Prodigy at least FELT like Star Trek. And I like the design of the Protostar.

I've never seen Lower Decks, though. I have no interest in seeing Rick and Morty set in the Star Trek universe.

 

[Cephus]

It's not on youtube yet, but here's the opening credits, without text. Mount does the classic monologue.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1520041750005493764

If it could maintain that feel throughout without all of the garbage being packed inside that we've already seen, I'd be fine with it. We all know it won't though. That will be the window dressing for more Discovery-level crap.

 

[Cephus]

Look, I've personally witnessed Voyager and Enterprise go from the worst things ever filmed to respected members of the franchise (and so have you), so forgive me if I take the gnashing of teeth over Discovery and Picard with a grain of salt. And I say that while acknowledging Discovery and Picard are very flawed shows. The issue is directly related to a fundamental incompatibility of arc based storytelling with a show set on a Starship that's supposed to go somewhere new every week. Your problem has to be big enough to require traveling the galaxy to solve, hence the reliance on galaxy ending threats. Or you get rid of the ship and get stuck in one place like Picard Season 2. There's a reason DS9, the only one set on a space station, is the only one that has successfully done long form arc based stories. And even DS9 fell back on a Galaxy spanning war in the end.

So, since the fundamental issue with new trek is arc bases stories, and SNW is episodic, forgive me for thinking SNW might actually be good.

By the way Prodigy and Lower Decks are both new Trek and they are both great. Lower Decks is explicitly is stand alone, and Prodigy isn't any more arc based than Voyager.

They were crap until they got better and neither of them ever approached the best of the shows. Discovery and Picard will be crap until they get better. I'm not going to assume they're going to get better because we have zero evidence for that. Show us when they're at least tolerable, then I'll care. Until then, they remain crap and the level that Paramount seems capable of these days.

Wishful thinking doesn't make reality.

 

[Picard102]

without all of the garbage

Such as?

 

[Cephus]

Such as?

You've seen Discovery and Picard, right?

 

[NakedMoleRat]

Those opening credits are really well done. I love the voice-over, the visuals, and the score. I'm hoping the series will be good. The snippets they've shown of the characters have not been stellar, but I'll wait to see.

 

[Picard102]

You've seen Discovery and Picard, right?

You've not answered the question.

 

[Gregatron]

It's not on youtube yet, but here's the opening credits, without text. Mount does the classic monologue.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1520041750005493764

 

[Gregatron]

…I can’t tell if she’s crying or low-key orgasming over how awesome she thinks she is.

 

[Lightning]

It's a show set on the Enterprise. The only "problem" is that Archer didn't do it in his credits.

 

[Gregatron]

Those opening credits are really well done. I love the voice-over, the visuals, and the score. I'm hoping the series will be good. The snippets they've shown of the characters have not been stellar, but I'll wait to see.

Trailers and clips are supposed to represent the best that a show has to offer. To entice potential viewers into checking it out.

Think about that. If trailers and clips are “not stellar”, then what does that say about what they’re not showing, if what’s being presented is ostensibly the top-tier material?

I’ve grown weary of people saying that you can’t judge something from a trailer, when trailers are by design supposed to hook people.

 

[Cephus]

You've not answered the question.

Oh, I think I've answered it just fine. You're just trying to avoid the answer.

 

[Lightning]

If it could maintain that feel throughout without all of the garbage being packed inside that we've already seen

Such as?

You've seen Discovery and Picard, right?

Your wording is confusing, it sounds like you are referencing "garbage" in the released footage of Strange New Worlds, but your examples are Discovery and Picard, which are not inside Strange New Worlds.