Prometheus (Post-release)

[AggieChick42]

"The Engineers from 2000 years ago have what appears to be a biomechanoid skin. It appears to be infused with their flesh from the neck on down. Nothing is explained in the film, but the Engineer, or the Engineers creator shown in the mural in the temple has his arm around something biomechanoid looking. The shape is not very defined, but I can see that it is crouching, knees bend, head down."

The Art of Prometheus explains this second skin as the inner skin of the suit fused with the Engineer, including biomechnaical hose connections and ports, and the exoskeleton (Jockey) is the outer suit. So the Engineers actually biomechanically fuse with the suit, or the hypersleep pods.

So they probably don't practice good hygiene... EEWWW

 

[Jeyl]

This implies the forms of the alien we know from Alien, existed at this time, 2000 years ago, and were worshiped.

....those instinct driven, mouth raping, head bashing bugs were worshipped? Why? Did the engineers have some serious mental issues like Golic? Shoot. Another bloody Alien3 reference.

Shoot.... Shoot. Dangit. SHOOT. This is why we're in trouble to begin with. Dangit.

 

[Too Much Garlic]

Several religions worship a harbinger of death and destruction. Since it is described as a perfect creation it certainly has special meaning. It is the physical manifestation of death and it is beautiful.

Also... we've only seen a few cycles of their evolvement. What we saw in Alien was only about a day old... who knows what it could have evolved to. It's practically a baby.

 

[Harada357]

Re: Prometheus (Post-release) Love and Hate

For the RECORD: I love the film. I think when we look back in ten years - it will have a cult following and become a Ridley Scott Classic. :love

I understand everyone want something different.

I wanted the Prometheus crew to be well armed - with an iconic array of weapons. - The ALIENS Pulse Rifle is a prop ICON. Why didn't Ridley and the Art Department give us something besides a Stock Benelli and a stock expensive target pistol. :cry (Still want to collect the pistol)

I wanted more time answering questions.

I wanted ... I wanted .... but Ridley Scott delivered a beautiful film that has people talking. The extended cut and deleted scenes will add more.

The setup for ALIEN is AWESOME. It has story, it has depth, it has visuals, and it has unanswered questions .... i.e. we are still talking about it. Mission accomplished. Thank you Ridley Scott.

:love Gordon

 

[CessnaDriver]

Re: Prometheus - (SPOILERS) ANSWERS to the Engineers - The universe - and Everything

You can go overboard in inventing a scenario and details for this, but going strictly by what is presented in the film, there is a somewhat clear cut layout of who the Engineers are and why they did what they did. Lets just go strictly by what is presented in the film.

Ages ago the Engineers seeded the Earth with the building blocks of life by breaking down their own DNA, creating the building blocks for complex life. Life developed from this, including mankind, who share the same DNA as the Engineers.

The Engineers visited Earth many times, and humans illustrated them pointing to group of stars in the sky, over and over throughout history. By the dates of these artifacts in the film, we know they visited Earth within the time frame of 35020 BCE to 680 CE. Maybe earlier, maybe later.

Many of these images indicate humans worshipped the Engineers gods, and the Engineers most likely posed themselves as those beings. The things they were capable of probably appeared god-like. They likely were responsible for the origin all early deities that mankind worshipped, including Sumerian, Egyptian, Babylonian, Greek, and Mayan gods. This is implied in the art the film makers chose to use as the artifacts.

Humans later discover these ancient pieces of art all have the same star configuration and surmise that it may be an invitation to meet our makers. In 2073 they discover where this configuration of stars is located in space, and determine the Engineers are likely from a moon, LV-223, orbiting a planet around one of these stars. Neither the premise they put forth that this is an "invitation", and the probable location they have chosen due to it being Earth like, may be accurate.

The Prometheus arrives at LV-223 in 2093. The five dome shaped buildings discovered on LV-233 with skulls carved on the tops appear to contain temples, meant for worship. The main chamber appears to be a sanctuary, with a giant Engineer head as the focal point, painted mural on the ceiling depicting an Engineer with his arm around a biomechanoid creature (that we have not seen before). The exact meanings are not clarified in the film.

There is also a sculpted mural depicting a biomechanoid being resembling the xenomorph we all know very well, as a focal point in the temple. The entire life cylce of the alien we know from Alien is also depicted. There is an altar with a bowl on top in front of the altar. The exact meaning of this is not clarified in the film, but one would assume this was an altar meant for worship.

The large head in the sanctuary room may be that of the Engineer's creator, NOT an Engineer. The head sculpture includes rib-like features not found in the Engineers features, along with writing on the cheeks. It also may very well be a head of the Engineer, just stylized. The ceiling mural may imply the biomechanoid creature is a creation of the Engineers, or this may be the Engineer's creator that is illustrated, hand around another of its creations. The temple is full of ampules of a black DNA altering substance. Overall, the intention appears that this room was meant as a place of worship. The exact meanings are not clarified in the film.

The skulls on top of the domes perhaps the domes actually served another purpose, and this image was used to warn others that this was a dangerous place. The substance in the ampules appears was intended to activate in the worshipper's presence, but to what end? It is all very alien, and not clarified in the film.

The Engineer ships in the hangars in front of the domes are full of these stacked ampules, in various sizes. From a human perspective these are weapons (as the Prometheus crew surmises in the film), and the ships that contain them are ships of death. There are multiple hangars around the temples, indicating a whole fleet of these carrier ships are present.

The ampules were possibly manufactured in another section of these domes. The domes may simply be factories for the mass production of this substance, and the ship hangers are there for loading this cargo for transport. This place may be nothing more than a weapons depot, and the crew of the Prometheus comes to this conclusion in the film.

2000 years ago mankind was at the height of civilization, and we were doing some very awful things in the Roman Empire, including the killing of ******, then later ****** was worshipped as the Son of God and the Savior of mankind. The Engineers visited Earth both before and after this event.

For some reason, around 2000 years ago, the Engineers decided to take the black DNA altering substance back to Earth and destroy (or remake) mankind. In the process, the black substance was accidentally, or was intentionally released, infected the Engineers in the temple, killing most. Over the following 2000 years the temples were eroded and worn down, in disrepair, indicating that no Engineers have returned LV233 since the incident. This makes sense if the whole area was considered a biohazard after the outbreak and abandoned.

The 2000 year old Engineer in the ship is awakened. He sees this group of humans before him, a creation of his own kind. He then finds the one who speaks to him in one of the ancient earth languages is not one of his creations, but an artificial being made by his creations. He destroys it and, knowingly or unknowingly, kills the man responsible for its creation, then attempts to destroy the other humans.

He is clearly disgusted or angered with them about something, and powers up the ship to go to Earth and complete the Engineers mission to destroy mankind, according to David. The question still remains, why do they want to now destroy what they created?

This is where you have to examine the Christian symbolism presented in the film. There is too much of it to ignore, and no, it does not mean ***** was one of them. It does not mean other religions may not have contributed to the cause either, but Christianity is the only one presented in the film.

Symbolism - The Prometheus arrives on LV-233 two days before Christmas, Shaw's creature is removed from her abdomen on Christmas Day, and she leaves LV-223 on New Years Day. This totals seven days. The captain playing "Come all ye faithfull" on the squeezbox, Shaw's cross, the story elements of faith presented in the film, and several others.

The Christian references are there to clue you in to ****** as a catalyst for the Engineers decision to destroy (or remake) mankind. Seeing as how the Engineers are more into using rather hellish methods of creation as we see in the black substances, they do not seem to be the benevolent or kind beings in any way that humanity would recognize, very much the opposite of anything ****** like.

Considering that they continued to visit the Earth upwards of 600 years after ******'s death, long enough to witness ****** being declared the savior of mankind and the worship of him as the son of God, this seems the more likely reason they were en route to destroy mankind, or possibly start over. The Engineers created man, and man worshipped them as gods. Mankind had now stopped worshipping the Engineers as Gods in favor of another.

There can be other theories, but this is the only reason I can find presented by the evidence in the film for the Engineers to want to destroy mankind 2000 years ago.

So maybe they are just dicks? Sometimes it's like that. LOL
Maybe the squid mom and David will get to "explain" that to them.

 

[ghostryder]

Prometheus Cinefex Scans - AvPGalaxy

 

[Kit Rae]

So maybe they are just dicks? Sometimes it's like that. LOL
Maybe the squid mom and David will get to "explain" that to them.

By "explain", do you mean with a cargo of of alien black goo ampules delivered right to the home world, James Cameron style.

Yes I want to see that...err, no I don't

 

[SmilingOtter]

Re: Prometheus - (SPOILERS) ANSWERS to the Engineers - The universe - and Everything

One odd thought occurred to me:

1) Since it's reasonable to assume that the Engineers held themselves to be some sort of ideal, whether physical, intellectual, genetic, what have you, and...

2) since it wouldn't be too much of a stretch to believe that the Engineers' sense of superiority would lead them to want to be the only sentient species, period, and...

3) since, the Engineers having created life on Earth, of which humans rose to be the dominant species, one could argue that Engineer DNA was "programming" earth life to lead to the development of humanity (rather than sentient lizards, or bugs, or dolphins,) then...

4) I would speculate that the entire program to seed Engineer-like life across the galaxy was simply to ensure that no other species developed that could threaten the Engineers. If the developing humans showed promise, they'd be welcomed as proto-Engineers. If they turned out not to be living up to their potential, they'd be subjected to the goo (and the xenomorphs, which may be connected.)

Not taking Scott's comments into account, we don't know that 2000 years ago, Earth's humans fell short of the Engineers' standards to the point of meriting destruction. After all, they seem to have been breeding humans across the galaxy. If they were gearing up to destroy a planet, it could have been any of them.

It could be that the Engineer would have welcomed the expedition had it not been for David, a different "species" created by the test subjects of Sol III. If not stopped, the androids could easily go the route of the Cylons, Terminators, Agents Smith, etc., and become not only a threat to the Engineers, but a threat that wouldn't be vulnerable to their genetic weaponry.

Just a thought.

 

[Too Much Garlic]

David was certainly something they couldn't control. And the mission to destroy Earth was related by David... so, was he telling it straight or was that what he wanted the humans to believe because that's what he wanted? Did he spur the jockey on to do that, which prompted the jockey to snap and basically go on David's proposed mission?

A translation of what David said would certainly clear up several things.

 

[Kit Rae]

Re: Prometheus - (SPOILERS) ANSWERS to the Engineers - The universe - and Everything

2) since it wouldn't be too much of a stretch to believe that the Engineers' sense of superiority would lead them to want to be the only sentient species, period, and...

Except nothing in the film indicates this. What is in the film implies they create sentient beings and visit them throughout their development as a species, and are worshipped by them. If they want to be the only sentient beings, they would not create other sentient beings.

Not taking Scott's comments into account, we don't know that 2000 years ago, Earth's humans fell short of the Engineers' standards to the point of meriting destruction. After all, they seem to have been breeding humans across the galaxy. If they were gearing up to destroy a planet, it could have been any of them.

The information in the film saying that they were going back to Earth indicates only comes from David, but the the visuals we see in the holograph of Earth back it up, and there is nothing indicating David would lie about it. His motives in the film are clear, and that would not benefit him or Weyland.

I also think if you are going to go outside what is shown in the film, then I think you do have to listen to what Ridley, Spaiths, and Lindeloff have said, as they were the storytellers. Rid and Damon have said they were going back to Earth. Damon has said we don't know if they were really going to destroy mankind, but everything Ridley has said indicates they were.

It could be that the Engineer would have welcomed the expedition had it not been for David, a different "species" created by the test subjects of Sol III. If not stopped, the androids could easily go the route of the Cylons, Terminators, Agents Smith, etc., and become not only a threat to the Engineers, but a threat that wouldn't be vulnerable to their genetic weaponry.

David being one of the things that set the Engineer can definitely be interpreted from the film. Nothing happens until he puts his hand on David's head. Seems most people are in agreement on that point.

Nothing in the film clearly indicates this - but we can assume the Engineer has telepathic abilities, could sense brain waves, or something in his biomechanoid skin may have allowed him to sense David was is a flesh and blood creature - but it is interesting he first put a hand on David's head.

Or, if David did say something that was not what Weyland wanted him to, and it would have not fared well for the humans, the Engineer may have sensed that too, made him even more PO'd than humans had made artificial humans that lie - then off with his head.

 

[nightrider]

It would seem that the idea of mankind worshiping ****** being the primary reason for the Engineers wanting to wipe us out is actually a bit off base. The opposite appears to be indicated by Ridley Scott in interviews.

You throw religion and spirituality into the equation for Prometheus, though, and it almost acts as a hand grenade. We had heard it was scripted that the Engineers were targeting our planet for destruction because we had crucified one of their representatives, and that ***** ****** might have been an alien. Was that ever considered?
Ridley Scott: We definitely did, and then we thought it was a little too on the nose. But if you look at it as an "our children are misbehaving down there" scenario, there are moments where it looks like we've gone out of control, running around with armor and skirts, which of course would be the Roman Empire. And they were given a long run. A thousand years before their disintegration actually started to happen. And you can say, "Lets' send down one more of our emissaries to see if he can stop it. Guess what? They crucified him.
​

 

[Kerr Avon]

It would seem that the idea of mankind worshiping ****** being the primary reason for the Engineers wanting to wipe us out is actually a bit off base. The opposite appears to be indicated by Ridley Scott in interviews.

And it's idiotic. Theres no way they would do anything to the guy other than kill him on site. He wouldn't be walking around as some kind of spiritual advisor or rabbi or anything. People back then would fill him full of arrows or spears the moment they saw him as he'd be nothing more than a MONSTER to them, a giant to slay.

Even today I suspect people would be shooting him on sight due to his freakishness.

 

[NAZGÛL]

And they would have needed one helluva big cross. I take it the emissarie would have been or looked human.

 

[Kerr Avon]

And they would have needed one helluva big cross. I take it the emissarie would have been or looked human.

If that's true, now we need interviews asking about previous interviews to understand his film. That's as ridiculous as the film itself. :lol

 

[nightrider]

He said "emissary", which does not imply that ****** was one of them. They are "engineers" after all and one must keep in mind the story of the "virgin birth" in relation to what is shown in Prometheus. Obviously this "emissary" was not an engineer but a product of their genetic manipulation of an earth woman(Mary) thereby producing whatever it is they desired to produce. Throughout this whole muti-page discussion I've noticed a recurring lack of imagination on the part of many posters. A strange occurance on a board largely devoted to "imagination" among other things, lol.

 

[Kerr Avon]

Dude, he said "emissary". They are "engineers" after all and one must keep in mind the story of the "virgin birth" in relation to what is shown in Prometheus. Obviously this "emissary" was not an engineer but a product of their genetic manipulation of an earth woman(Mary) thereby producing whatever it is they desired to produce. Throughout this whole muti-page discussion I've noticed a recurring lack of imagination on the part of many posters. A strange occurance on a board largely devoted to "imagination" among other things, lol.

So now we have to construct an entire method of them genetically engineering a 'lesser life form' and teach it their values and then somehow slip it into Mary when she's asleep so it can spend 30 years growing up before it does anything, and then just happens to get nailed to a tree? Man, we might as well have blank white screens with no sound in theatres if we're all going to just go make it up as we go along!

I mean really, I paid HIM to tell ME a story. I shouldn't be expected to have to make up half the story for the movie I PAID FOR to make sense!

 

[ghostryder]

Prometheus In One Min - YouTube

 

[Kit Rae]

It would seem that the idea of mankind worshiping ****** being the primary reason for the Engineers wanting to wipe us out is actually a bit off base. The opposite appears to be indicated by Ridley Scott in interviews.

As has been pointed out a few times in this thread, that is from an early version of the script. As presented in the final version of the film, the Engineers came back to earth at least twice since ****** was crucified, based on the dates of the artifacts Shaw and Holloway presented. Nothing if the film indicates ****** was one of them, nor is there a mention of ****** whatsoever, other than swearing. The opposite conclusion can be drawn to what Ridley refers to in this interview.

It is no sure thing either way, since Shaw's carbon dating of the head is 2000 years. The last time they know the Engineers came back was about 600 years after that.

 

[nightrider]

This lack of imagination seems to account for the largest majority of "plot holes" here rather than the film itself. People seem to want everything very neat and perfectly spelled out for them.

Is the film perfect? No, but neither is it's predecessor or any of the other films most of us revere so much. Most of them are in fact far from it.

I watched Alien just a few weeks back and for whatever reason it didn't seem to hold up as well as I had remembered. The chestburster scene where the "alien" scoots across the table in fact made me laugh.

If I had been responsible for that scene I would have recognized it was counterproductive to the desired effect and realizing the limitations of the time I would've cut it with the alien bursting out and left the table moon-walk on the cutting room floor. It was indeed a little cheesier than what I had remembered.

 

[Jonny B]

yay...a movie WE have to try and explain to each other because the movie didn't.

OK, here's a few for you:

We were lab monkeys. They seed planets with life so they can try out new Bio-weapons on them. If the lab monkeys start get to smart and present a threat to their dominance of the Galaxy...drop a little bubonic plague, or influenza, or cholera, or ebola on them. THAT's why the "Pilot" freeked out, he woke up and was confronted by animals.

Xur, the Engineer in the begining of the movie, is a renegade scientist who wants to prove his new "Super Evolution 2000" formula works. Only later do they find out this will create a VERY war-like spieces (us) and establish military bases to prevent us from expanding out into the Galaxy.

David lied. The translation of what he said to the newly awaked Engineer was: "They're here to kill you and your spieces unless you give them what they want...oh and are you a male or female? I can't tell because your junk is so small." {gets head ripped off}

or maybe he said :

"Hi there, sorry to wake you so early on a weekend but we're from The Church of ***** ****** of Latter-day Saints." {gets head ripped off}