It's going to take quite a bit to sell to that this lightsaber was both found and some Excalibur-type mystical icon to me. In the first two trilogies we see very little in the way of this type of symbolism... and with Cloud City being pretty darn big and Bespin being a gas giant of a planet (and us seeing Vader leave Cloud City directly after his battle with Luke) just makes the type of recovery just crazy.
We also have the recovery of Vader's helmet - which you think Luke would've kept an eye or made sure was destroyed... or something.
However, our history shows that there have been more than one or two quests for objects like this. Heck, Lucas made a whole other series about that kind of stuff.
Personally - while I am waiting and hopeful of the end result - I still think it's lazy storytelling.
No - you burn it until there's nothing left but ash. You don't leave a helmet or or anything lying around for someone to let someone create a symbol or make some sort of martyr out of him.Do you really think that after Luke torched his fathers body that he would rummage through his remains to make sure nothing was left. He torched him and walked away. And what happened to Luke's saber we will see explained. Not in some silly way but a plausible way. I've read all the spoilers and there's no weak story telling. It's all good. Just wait and see.
Ben
See above.The lightsaber in and of itself is not an "icon", it's more like part of a puzzle. And I never thought Luke would keep anything of Vader, Darth Vader wasn't his father, Anakin was. Why would Luke keep his helmet? He burned the suit and likely walked away.
And nonsense - this whole movie has poor and weak plot holes littered throughout it. Unfortunately, too many fanboys are blinded by the idea that JJ is doing this, that there are practical effects and that Lucas isn't do this. Wake up - too much of this movie sounds like EU stuff that's created to sate the fanboy appetite and that should never make the movies.
No - you burn it until there's nothing left but ash. You don't leave a helmet or or anything lying around for someone to let someone create a symbol or make some sort of martyr out of him.
And nonsense - this whole movie has poor and weak plot holes littered throughout it. Unfortunately, too many fanboys are blinded by the idea that JJ is doing this, that there are practical effects and that Lucas isn't do this. Wake up - too much of this movie sounds like EU stuff that's created to sate the fanboy appetite and that should never make the movies.
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See above.
We'll probably do this whenever there is a lull between trailers.Haven't we had this exact debate in this thread like 5 months ago?! I feel such a weird deja vu....
We'll probably do this whenever there is a lull between trailers.
I imagine that the spoilers thread has more meat to it
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Didn't expect you to. See my comment about fanboys...Your entitled to your opinion but I don't agree.
I like JJ, he's a fan and he's obviously doing something right based on his success and following. I enjoyed his Star Trek - but, having see the original Trek - it's really obvious that he both dumbed down Star Trek and turned it into something decidedly different than the Star Trek we had seen for years and years and years. It's obvious in some of the leaks we've heard about (and I stopped following leaks a bit ago - it seems some new info has popped up) and have seen that him and his fellow writers (Kasdan included) have opted to take what I feel very strongly is the easy way out - this is best represented by the return of Stormtroopers (who are not clones) and the Empire (or the First Order). Yes, we'll have some folks accept this without a second thought (because of thing A or thing B - or in Rebels they did this - two wrongs don't make a right)... but, that doesn't make it any less lazy.This movie is not just made by JJ. It's a team of people who are as passionate about Star Wars as we are. Personally I'm more excited about Lawrence Kazdan being a writer on this. You guys do remember Empire Strikes Back don't you. That guy knows how to bring a story together without plot holes.Yes I loved JJTREK but I really don't like Lost and am not a JJ fanboy in any way.
I'm not sure if debate is the best word for it. Discussion perhaps? I'm sure we'll have it in 5 months again if it the discussion works itself that way.Haven't we had this exact debate in this thread like 5 months ago?! I feel such a weird deja vu....
It's clear in the ESB novelization that this is part of the weather vane assembly. I don't think that's clear in the movie at all and I think a whole of people may've made the assumption that this was Luke's hand and saber. We don't see anything clearly in that chute and there's no reason why the hand/saber couldn't have also been in the same chute - if Luke ended up in it, it's very possible that they could have been, too - for the same reasons Luke was. But, it's moot as it had been established that it wasn't - so it isn't.I don't understand why people are still insisting that what you see falling from Cloud City is Luke's hand or lightsaber. IT IS NOT!! Freeze frame on it, you can plainly see that is is just a piece of debris. This was only put into the shot to give it a sense of scale and add some movement into an otherwise static shot.
Luke's hand was cut off at least a minute or so before he falls. It is NOT in the chute he gets sucked into. As he comes to a stop, before the hatch below him opens, there is nothing there with him. If anything, his hand/lightsaber would have already fallen and been way out of sight before Luke even gets to the weather vane (or whatever it is) that he comes to a stop on.
Recovering a lost lightsaber and helmet, Stormtroopers (not Clones), Empire (or First Order) - there ya go: poor and weak plot holes. No speculation needed and no explanation needed (as if I haven't explained it enough)... this sounds more like EU stuff than stuff that should be on the big screen. And I'm still of perfectly sound mind.Assuming you and I have read the same story synopsis, you're out of your mind. If not, you are speculating and you are still wrong, nothing about the actual story that we will see jibes with what you just wrote.
This movie is not just made by JJ. It's a team of people who are as passionate about Star Wars as we are. Personally I'm more excited about Lawrence Kazdan being a writer on this. You guys do remember Empire Strikes Back don't you. That guy knows how to bring a story together without plot holes.Yes I loved JJTREK but I really don't like Lost and am not a JJ fanboy in any way.
Ben
Recovering a lost lightsaber and helmet, Stormtroopers (not Clones), Empire (or First Order) - there ya go: poor and weak plot holes. No speculation needed and no explanation needed (as if I haven't explained it enough)... this sounds more like EU stuff than stuff that should be on the big screen. And I'm still of perfectly sound mind.
Go ahead and keep eating it up... I wish I could so blindly accept what they're feeding us.
Well, as I said, my initial reaction to the notion of that saber surviving was that it seemed pretty hokey but it is reassuring to me that people that have been spoiled seem to like what they've read. I'm still going to try and stay relatively spoiler free and just take it all in as I watch the movie (a dozen times).
As for the First Order, that box description is interesting. Definitely makes it seems like it's not so much an evolution or continuation of the Empire but rather a somewhat new development on the galactic stage. It certainly sounds like the Empire did definitively cease to exist at some point after ROTJ and then the First Order sprang up some time later. At least that's how I'm reading it. Of course that still leaves the matter of what the status of the Rebel Alliance/New Republic/Resistance is...