The Official Boycott Star Wars Bluray thread
- Thread starter SVTStingRay
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Solo4114
Master Member
I think that'd depend on what "certain distribution rights" means. It could mean that Fox gets a right of first refusal, in that Disney has to go to Fox first and say "We're gonna be re-releasing stuff. You guys want to handle the packaging and pressing?" and then Fox gets to say yea or nay.
I'd figure it'd also depend on how Disney plans to approach branding for the Lucasfilm brand itself -- as in whether to treat it like Marvel or whether to slap the Magic Castle onto Star Wars stuff.
I'd figure it'd also depend on how Disney plans to approach branding for the Lucasfilm brand itself -- as in whether to treat it like Marvel or whether to slap the Magic Castle onto Star Wars stuff.
Colin Droidmilk
Sr Member
Re-reading Rinzler's Making of Star Wars, and going through all the contemporary accounts of Lucas's depression with the finished film - especially Gil Taylor's lighting ( Kurtz and Taylor practically fought on set over this) - I'm beginning to look at some of his revisionism in a new, ahem, light...For instance, his 30 year-old dislike for what Taylor did may be behind the look we find on the Blu-ray...
It's also striking that on the night of the premiere of the film, he was elsewhere, at a mixing facility working on the mono mix. During that night he gives a brief interview in which he expresses total disbelief at reports of the wild reception for the film, considering it - somewhat Threepio-like - 'beyond his capacity to understand' how audiences can like it. As an artist myself, if I was that p***** off with my work I think I'd still be tweaking it 20 years, 30 years later too... heh, imagine, you've got this piece of work you've always thought was full of holes, it's driving you insane, you try and plug them only to find that everyone in the world has deified those very holes... no wonder he's gone somewhat strange....
But what people have to understand is that Lucas, ever since May '77, has felt deeply, personally embarrassed by the film as it stood, in the state he was forced to leave it in. This is why he wants the original release buried. And while the original release is the only version I'm interested in, I do sympathise with Lucas' position. Would you want a deep personal embarrassment preserved for all time?
It's also striking that on the night of the premiere of the film, he was elsewhere, at a mixing facility working on the mono mix. During that night he gives a brief interview in which he expresses total disbelief at reports of the wild reception for the film, considering it - somewhat Threepio-like - 'beyond his capacity to understand' how audiences can like it. As an artist myself, if I was that p***** off with my work I think I'd still be tweaking it 20 years, 30 years later too... heh, imagine, you've got this piece of work you've always thought was full of holes, it's driving you insane, you try and plug them only to find that everyone in the world has deified those very holes... no wonder he's gone somewhat strange....
But what people have to understand is that Lucas, ever since May '77, has felt deeply, personally embarrassed by the film as it stood, in the state he was forced to leave it in. This is why he wants the original release buried. And while the original release is the only version I'm interested in, I do sympathise with Lucas' position. Would you want a deep personal embarrassment preserved for all time?
Too Much Garlic
Master Member
Yes. As a reminder to keep me on the ground that sometimes things don't always work out as I want it, but for some reason hit a home run with other people. I may not like the end result, but wanting to trash it is to trash myself and the impact I had on others. That is exceptionally selfish.
You learn from your mistakes. You learn nothing by running from them or trying to make people believe they never happened.
As a film maker who has made tiny films and released them in various formats, I don't make them for me. I make them for the folks who want to watch them. Sure, the film may have something I wished was included or fixed before it was released, but if the audience doesn't care and can live with it, than I did my job where it mattered the most. Engaging the audience.
If I felt the film turned out really bad even though so many people liked it, I wouldn't try to fix it because that would be short changing the audience who did like it. If I felt that I could fix it in a way that I felt would make it better, I would have the decency to have the original available. There are some fans who like Deckard's monologues.
But most important of all, if this embarrassing work made a lot of people happy, got a lot of my friends recognition for their work and set me up for life, I'm willing to just say that it's just my opinion and understand why everyone else sees it more differently than I do. After all, a filmmaker can never truly see his own work from the perspective of an audience member. A perspective that I still hold dear because that's what got me into film in the first place.
Solo4114
Master Member
An interesting take, and I'd agree that it explains his constant tinkering over time. Trying to attain perfection, even though that's impossible, and never being able to "abandon" the great work of art he'd created. (so to speak)
But a lot of what you say REALLY speaks to his ego and sense of what's right and what's wrong. Not just for himself, but for the rest of us.
Exactly. This is where the ego kicks in. It's the notion that, no, I was ALWAYS right, and you guys were all ALWAYS wrong, and since it's entirely within my control, SCREW YOU YOU WILL WATCH MY VERSION OR NOTHING AT ALL.
It views art as essentially a one-way conversation, and I'm sorry, but that's just not the case. The author's intent is only part of the equation. The audience's reception is something entirely different.
And this, I think, is where Lucas parts company from a great many filmmakers. Lucas fundamentally tells stories FOR HIMSELF and invites us all to come along with him for the journey. He's never (apparently) been happy telling stories FOR OTHER PEOPLE, as evidenced by his dissatisfaction with the collaborative process and the end result it produced.
I think there needs to ultimately be a balance (which it sounds like you try to strike, Jeyl) where the author is trusting their own instincts as best they can to make a film that engages the audience AND reflects their own vision...and then they put it out into the world and say "Have at it, kids." Lucas, I get the sense, either never felt or over time grew to stop feeling that sense of releasing the film as a thing separate from him. Instead, it was always an EXTENSION of him because, for him, it was HIS story. HIS vision. This also explains why he has been so disillusioned by backlash from folks who were rejecting HIS vision because, in so doing, they're rejecting HIM.
Here's the thing, though, and it's where I think Lucas misses the point and has done so since 1997.
It's not that they reject HIM per se. It's that they want their version ALONGSIDE his version.
I actually started thinking about this when this thread first popped up, but I think it'd be kind of cool if we had releases of Star Wars that preserved ALL of the changes over time AND the originals. It would be like a living history-of-film-and-f/x-since-1977. As long as they were all done/remastered properly, that could be INCREDIBLY cool particularly for film buffs. In that sense, each new edition might be greeted with curiosity and an upbeat attitude, rather than "Oh god, what'd he screw up NOW."
Ultimately it's not the CHANGE that's the problem but rather the SUPPRESSION of what came before. He can change whatever he damn well pleases. I think it's cool to be able to compare and contrast. But I really dislike the elimination of the old versions.
Hell, maybe release an expensive, educational version of Star Wars to use in teaching film school students. "Star Wars Through the Years" so to speak. You could see the evolution of f/x and filming techniques, note how changes in color timing affect the scenes, examine the narrative impact of even subtle changes (e.g. "Han shot first"), and so on and so forth.
There's a TON that Star Wars can teach filmmakers and film historians, but to do that, the versions have to be preserved as they go, and updated for newer technologies.
Too Much Garlic
Master Member
Best example of this having been done is Blade Runner! Giving the audience the choice, rather than forcing them to only have one version available.
SVTStingRay
Sr Member
im on the fence on this whole disney/star wars thing. maybe now we'll get our ORIGINAL movies, but then again. disney can ***** itself out more than george ever could.
Fox owns Star Wars forever. The other five movies revert back to LucasfIlm in 2020 I believe. It's going to be interesting to see how Fox and Disney handle that situation.
Darth Fetty
Sr Member
I wish there could be an option such as this. I may be lambasted for this, but my overall preference would be the first special editions from 1997. Yes, there are really stupid things in it, but I like most of the cleanup work they did and some of the added details such as the more open Cloud City. They got rid of some really terrible effects that bothered me like the awful looking guy walking on the sail barge for example. For me at that time, the good of the SE outweighed the bad. Despite my preference, this isn't to say that I think the originals should be forgotten in the slightest. They must be preserved.
In the following special editions, the bad outweighed the good, and I'd much much much rather stick with the original versions than watch Vader pick up the emperor screaming "Nooo", Hayden Christensen's awkward ghost, or listening (technically not listening) to the messed up soundtrack at the Death Star.
punisher
Sr Member
Boycott blueray?!?! pshhhhh, I boycotted the dvds! I can 100% honestly say that I have ONLY ever watched the trilogy on vhs before they were basterdised and changed. 
Although I wonder sometimes if I'm missing out on some really good stuff.
What I WOULD look forward to is a new hope blueray screencap of the "jetpack" storm trooper to perhaps shed a little bit of light on the overall hidden details.
Although I wonder sometimes if I'm missing out on some really good stuff. What I WOULD look forward to is a new hope blueray screencap of the "jetpack" storm trooper to perhaps shed a little bit of light on the overall hidden details.
Colin Droidmilk
Sr Member
^ A VHS man! Good man!
The question I posted earlier - would you want a deep personal embarrassment preserved for all time?.... I was trying to equate the way Lucas feels about the original movie with the way we'd feel if we'd been caught in, say, some mortifying social faux pas - like getting drunk and vomiting in your girlfriend's lap, or appearing in public with excrement smeared all over the back of your pants. No one would want any record of an event like that preserving. Maybe for Lucas the original SW is as mortifying as that, lol... (Of course, the irony is that, for millions of fans, the prequels, Vader's NOOOOO! and the new Kenobi howl etc. are the equivalent of staggering blind drunk out of a toilet at your daughter's wedding with your soiled pants round your ankles only to collide with your mother-in-law whose dress you manage to half tear off as you trip over yourself and dive headfirst to the floor in full view of the entire assembled company)
The question I posted earlier - would you want a deep personal embarrassment preserved for all time?.... I was trying to equate the way Lucas feels about the original movie with the way we'd feel if we'd been caught in, say, some mortifying social faux pas - like getting drunk and vomiting in your girlfriend's lap, or appearing in public with excrement smeared all over the back of your pants. No one would want any record of an event like that preserving. Maybe for Lucas the original SW is as mortifying as that, lol... (Of course, the irony is that, for millions of fans, the prequels, Vader's NOOOOO! and the new Kenobi howl etc. are the equivalent of staggering blind drunk out of a toilet at your daughter's wedding with your soiled pants round your ankles only to collide with your mother-in-law whose dress you manage to half tear off as you trip over yourself and dive headfirst to the floor in full view of the entire assembled company)
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When justified. :thumbsup
I recalled this thread and specifically searched for it to make that joke.
Solo4114
Master Member
It's different, though. This isn't social embarrassment. This is art. I'm sure the guys in KISS are deeply embarrassed about their brief flirtation with disco. I'll bet Harrison Ford regrets making K-19 The Widowmaker. Hell, I'd bet there were paintings that Picasso did where he went back and said "Man, this is a piece of CRAP."
But you know what? You don't then go back and add a pink robot to Guernica just because you felt creatively limited by the unavailability of the one pink pigment you needed to really pull it off at the time. You don't turn Falstaff in Henry IV, Part 1 into a teetotaler because you don't like sending a message to the kids that it's ok to be a drunk.
You don't do these things because it's bad to **** with art, even if you're the original artist. These things exist BEYOND the artist, and that's the thing Lucas has never gotten or at least never cared about. I mean, yeah, legally he can do what he wants. But ethically? I think it's a mistake to not merely change but also suppress past versions long after you've released them, just because you got a wild hare up your ass about how you want all the colors to be brighter or whatever.
Dave Ward
Sr Member
Calling all photoshop people...
Solo4114
Master Member
Oh yeah, you guys were going to boycott the Blu-ray edition unless George releases the original editions on Blu-ray.
So, how did that work out for you guys ?
So, how did that work out for you guys ?
Solo4114
Master Member
Well, I still haven't bought the blu-rays, so...pretty well so far!
As I said waaaaaaaaaay back in the thread, I wasn't "boycotting" them. I was exercising consumer choice. The product offered was one which didn't interest me. So I didn't buy it. If they offer one that does interest me, I'll buy it. I hope they do. I think there's a better chance of that happening now than there was before the buyout. Other than that, I'm just gonna continue acting as an informed consumer and making purchasing decisions accordingly. They'll decide what to produce, I'll decide what to buy. Simple as that. I certainly haven't felt compelled to "settle" for product I view as inferior, and I saved...er..however much Amazon is charging for the series right now. On balance, I'd say that puts me $X ahead.
As I said waaaaaaaaaay back in the thread, I wasn't "boycotting" them. I was exercising consumer choice. The product offered was one which didn't interest me. So I didn't buy it. If they offer one that does interest me, I'll buy it. I hope they do. I think there's a better chance of that happening now than there was before the buyout. Other than that, I'm just gonna continue acting as an informed consumer and making purchasing decisions accordingly. They'll decide what to produce, I'll decide what to buy. Simple as that. I certainly haven't felt compelled to "settle" for product I view as inferior, and I saved...er..however much Amazon is charging for the series right now. On balance, I'd say that puts me $X ahead.
Too Much Garlic
Master Member
Just fine. I don't own the crappy SE BR versions. Money saved is money earned.
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