TDK: Harvey Dent/Two Face's Coin

[jaakub]

Hey,
just thinking about the legality of the coin and wouldn't because it doesn't have the tails side anymore make it not legal tender? I would think that it is only counterfitting if it is an exact replica or close enough to pass. If one side is missing than I think it wouldn't be a problem. Look at all the dollar bills that pop on ebay with the sticker over George washington's portrait to make the why so serious dollars. I also could be completely wrong.
Jim

 

[The Stig]

You have to remember that there are actual two headed coins pressed by mistake. I'm willing to bet that the actual prop was either a found item or made in the same way that paper money is for a production. That is to say, made so that it may not be confused with legal tender.

 

[jaakub]

Hey,
I didn't know that there were error ones like that. Also in a couple screen caps like what was pointed out above it looks like the date might be missing on the bottom of the coin. Not sure on the legality of it. The liscensed ones could also be a slightly different size. The one that spins looks like it might be larger then the real coin. Maybe that is how the companies got around the legal issue with them. I know I have seen the giant penny coins for sale and because of their size could never be mistaken for a real penny.
Jim

 

[PTK]

Yikes, Badd Blood has me paranoid now. But, hey, better safe than sorry....I never really considered the legality of the piece.

So I researched this:
U.S. Hobby Protection Act 15 USC-2101

and the parts that pertain to reproducing the Two Face coin states that
Imitation numismatic items (such as coins) must be permanently stamped "COPY" on either the front or back of the coin (and then it goes on to talk about the minimum size and depth requirements for the stamp)

however imitation numismatic items is defined as "an item which purports to be, but in fact is not, an original numismatic item or which is a reproduction, copy, or counterfeit of an original numismatic item."

I'm hoping the Two Face coin would not fall into this category because it does not purport to be an original numismatic item, nor is it a copy of an original coin because it has two faces, and there are no two headed 1922 peace dollars. And in my opinion a coin having two of the same side denotes the fact that it isn't real more so then a small "COPY" stamp ever would

But i certainly don't want to go to prison, so I've contacted the secret service (they investigate counterfeit currency) in hope of getting an official "go ahead" for the project. Hopefully they will reply in a timely manner, and of course I will keep you updated to any news on the matter.

 

[jheilman]

I'm following this with interest. I'm a coin collector and Batfan and also interested in the legality of making this prop. I'd really like one and can't imagine that it would be a crime to recreate a two-headed coin. You're not trying to pass it off as a real peace dollar for sale. Let us know what you find out from the secret service.

 

[Prop Collector]

Two things:

The other image from the book...

And I have a bunch for sale (all 1922) in varying levels of cleanliness (although they can all be cleaned/polished)...

 

[tim]

(although they can all be cleaned/polished)...

Cleaning or polishing would be a bad idea, not just from a numismatic standpoint, but also because detail would be lost.

 

[Prop Collector]

Just looked it up. Didn't know that. Good thing I didn't attempt it myself!

 

[jheilman]

Depends what you use to clean it, but I agree that polishing vintage coins is not generally a good idea from a collector's perspective. Plus, the screen-used coin wasn't pristine. It was carried around for decades and showed wear. The above pic shows chunks out of the coin on the edges. Is that right? Also I remember the film coin as being darker on the charred side. I'm seeing it again Wednesday and will pay attention to the coin shots.

 

[PTK]

update.......so the secret service email address on the US Treasury site doesn't work. (my email just came back to me)..........lame

I found a number for the local Los Angeles Secret Service office and I will attempt to contact them to see if they can point me in the right direction.


this project is quickly becoming a huge pain in the ass

 

[jheilman]

How much are you selling them for and how'd you get so many?

 

[PTK]

Depends what you use to clean it, but I agree that polishing vintage coins is not generally a good idea from a collector's perspective. Plus, the screen-used coin wasn't pristine. It was carried around for decades and showed wear. The above pic shows chunks out of the coin on the edges. Is that right? Also I remember the film coin as being darker on the charred side. I'm seeing it again Wednesday and will pay attention to the coin shots.

Yeah, its closer to the movie coin, but still way off unfortunately.

 

[Prop Collector]

How much are you selling them for and how'd you get so many?

It's from an old coin collection. Depending on how good the condition is, these are worth about 20-30 each.

 

[jheilman]

Cool, I'll wait and see how this project develops before making a purchase.

 

[Rik1138]

Here's some screen shots of when Rachel flips the coin, and then a decent shot of the 'scorched' side on Dent's hand:

First pic is 'side A'
Second pic is side view (looks like a seam where two halves were glued together?)
Third pic is 'side B' after she flips the coin from top to bottom (so one side is inverted like a normal U.S. coin).

 

[The Stig]

Second pic is side view (looks like a seam where two halves were glued together?)

That's what it looks like to me.

 

[Prop Collector]

That picture would also seem to indicate that the second picture I posted from the book is the actual screen used coin.

 

[tim]

update.......so the secret service email address on the US Treasury site doesn't work. (my email just came back to me)..........lame

I found a number for the local Los Angeles Secret Service office and I will attempt to contact them to see if they can point me in the right direction.


this project is quickly becoming a huge pain in the ass

Perhaps there are other collector/hobby groups that might know? I personally don't see an issue--two sided, different material and weight--but nobody ever said the government was logical about these things.

 

[PTK]

prop collector (or anybody with a real 1922 peace dollar) I'm just curious, does the coin have ridges on the edge (like a quarter) or is it smooth...It is customary to put ridges on any US coins over 5 cents, but maybe that started after these coins were minted......if they were smooth it would make my life easier.

tim, i totally agree, and i'm pretty sure it will be ok, i just want to make sure there is no chance of getting in trouble for this project.

rik1138, GREAT quality, thanks very much, what was your source? Would it be possible to screen cap some other sceens with the bad side of the coin? like when batman first finds the coin, or when the coin is in the hospital, etc.
Thanks again!

 

[scarf man]

The peace dollar has ridges on the edge.