Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker (Pre-release)

[NakedMoleRat]

I think the small screen is where Disney will find its greatest immediate success. The Mandalorian is in extremely good creative hands. I have every confidence that it will shine.

The Obi Wan series fills me with excitement as well.

So, stick to the small screen, take 10 episodes to tell a story well and I’ll be 7 years old again with Star Wars.

 

[bwize]

It occurred to me today, that I think the main thing that is spoiling and pissing off so many fans is that these new movies inject too much real world, or PC stuff into them now. The original films were romantic in their story telling and the character reacted like traditional romantic characters. These new films are products of our modern, gritty, real as heck, PC, socially overloaded lives. We needed these films to sweep us away to places unlike our harsh reality where we could not make correlations to our real lives, but rather leave them behind while we "swash-buckled" with the best of them. I believe the books even ventured into this "real world" vibe and left the more enjoyable romantic views behind.

With that said, I do like TFA a lot and I believe it tried to leave the "real world" behind but ultimately failed. Rouge One is my fav of the new films and TLJ is just "unspeakable!"

 

[Psab keel]

Perhaps the long form is what this series needs so they don't have to cram everything into a 2.5 movie.

 

[NeoRutty]

Are they misguided, seemingly without a coherent plan, and off-course? Definitely. Conspiratorially hell-bent on the destruction of the franchise? No way.

100% the people in these vids have ZERO idea how a movie, especially a studio movie, is put together. I love that they think it's a bunch of suits in a board room, trying to figure how to hurt fans.

It is a MIRACLE when any movie works at all. They take years. There are dozens of creatives trying to not make the same movie again, while trying to take the same characters, in the same world, and shove them into a new story... knowing the fans will kill them if they change a personality trait 1%

"YOU MADE THE SAME MOVIE! NO ORIGINALITY!"

okay Luke is a broken jedi who-

STOP CHANGING STAR WARS!!!!

I managed to talk my way into being a "Fly on the wall" for a writer's room of a well known franchise... and it was CRAZY.

Every idea was a retread of things done in previous movies. So they would get shut doen... then they would finally find something new, but then the director or people with rights, or head of studio wouldn't like the change needed in a character to make the story possible. So gets shut down again...

I can't imagine trying to break a story in a Star Wars room... a room where even the best story is still going to be hated by 50% of the audience.

 

[Richard Baker]

It's definitely a no-win scenario.

 

[DARTH ANIBAL]

100% the people in these vids have ZERO idea how a movie, especially a studio movie, is put together. I love that they think it's a bunch of suits in a board room, trying to figure how to hurt fans.

It is a MIRACLE when any movie works at all. They take years. There are dozens of creatives trying to not make the same movie again, while trying to take the same characters, in the same world, and shove them into a new story... knowing the fans will kill them if they change a personality trait 1%

"YOU MADE THE SAME MOVIE! NO ORIGINALITY!"

okay Luke is a broken jedi who-

STOP CHANGING STAR WARS!!!!

I managed to talk my way into being a "Fly on the wall" for a writer's room of a well known franchise... and it was CRAZY.

Every idea was a retread of things done in previous movies. So they would get shut doen... then they would finally find something new, but then the director or people with rights, or head of studio wouldn't like the change needed in a character to make the story possible. So gets shut down again...

I can't imagine trying to break a story in a Star Wars room... a room where even the best story is still going to be hated by 50% of the audience.

 

[Mr Webber]

The top tier of these YouTube creators, say the top 5 and most prominent are far from just uninformed whiners. Anyone who has actually watched their work and not just had an emotional response to their thumbnails would be aware of this. In an age where applying make up or going through a Drive Thru 10,000 times garners tens of millions of views, they themselves are more than open about how they have to do their best to manipulate an algorithm that is designed to bury them.

As an example, the very creator of the video that sparked this particular discussion produced a 2 hr tribute to the late Rutger Hauer that in parts moved me to tears and contains a knowledge and passion about cinema and popular culture that is second to none. I suggest you take the time to watch it, you may even learn something.

 

[NakedMoleRat]

Back in the 18th, 19th and early 20th centuries, the public transport was by horse, or horse drawn carriage. Hansom cabs carried the public, growlers were large and used by the police force. Whether it was a public or privately owned cab, the horses were housed in stables. In each of these, there was a job called the 'muck raker' and it was one of the lowliest jobs you could get. You took a rake and used it to clear away the 'muck'!

So, a muck raker in those days would get rid of the horses' waste. Today, we don't often use the expression, 'muck raker' but when we do, it usually refers to a person who 'throws crap' at things.

there are a lot of muck rakers in the star wars fandom.

 

[robn1]

People complaining about these videos aren't paying close enough attention to them, and you're missing the point. No one is saying that Disney bought SW to ruin it intentionally, but they are ruining the original characters to make way for the new ones. It's a trend these days, anything new can't stand on it's own without destroying something that came before. Rey can't stand as a new hero facing a new threat, she has to be the one to kill Palpatine because Luke failed to.

 

[Captain Dunsel]

I do enjoy watching The Doomcock, and other members of the “Fandom Menace”, and they usually bring some very good, well-put, and very valid points to the creative discussion, when it comes to pointing out the creative bankruptcy of a lot of current Hollywood movie and show-runners. The Doomcock’s ST: Discovery observations are particularly spot-on.

It’s when they veer off into territory that is completely baseless and sensationalistic, surrounding the personal motives of these creators that I tune out. Statements that start out as “it is rumored”, “treat this as rumor”, “it can be speculated that”, “my anonymous sources say” should really not bear much weight.

There really is a very unhealthy cottage industry being created on YouTube that relies solely upon click-bait by tapping into the negative perceptions of fans, unfortunately. Some of the these “Fandom Menace” videos step into this territory when offense is taken where none was intended and stoking a corporate boogieman / boogiewoman perception. Disney and Lucasfilm execs are not corporate Nosferatus who drink goblets filled with the tears of fans and feast from the dried up carcass of Luke Skywalker.

Witness the histrionics of the “Tears for Ackbar” issue a few months ago, for instance. I think the singular most upset parties in that issue were YouTube video makers and not your average fan.

 

[Mr Webber]

The ones that are trying to just catch the wave of "Disney bashing" etc dont last long and get minimal views. As the old saying goes, the cream rises to the top and these channels have experienced extraordinary growth in the wake of an attempt to dehumanise critics of the rubbish being peddled by Disney and its lapdogs calling out toxicity, bots, and every "ist' under the sun. If you want to see real toxicity just take a look at whats happening to Anthony Daniels on Twitter by the wholesome ST fans. If youre gunna double down on on that aspect of reacting to legitimate criticism, to quote a famous clown, "Ya get what ya fraking deserve"

 

[Captain Dunsel]

Woah.

I just had the disturbing realization that I have spent the past few posts inadvertently defending the character of Disney and Lucasfilm.

Dear God. What bizarro parallel universe did I just step through the looking glass out of? I am a stranger to myself.

Next thing you know I’ll start declaring that everyone’s Snoke theory sucks and carrying around a “Fan Boy Tears” mug.

 

[Psab keel]

The big question is what is the end goal? I mean I agree with most of what these channels have to say as far as narrative criticism, though I don't always agree with how they say it and while they may garner views, it's not going to change the way Lucasfilm or Disney makes movies. For me at least, I'm out. I just choose to not give them my money. If they honestly think that their YouTube channel will get Lucasfilm to change then they are wasting their time.

 

[Master Boda]

”Little man with a big eraser “ might be the end goal?With what FPJ said and now how Anthony Daniels is being treated kind of reminds me of what Padme had said to Bail in ROTS “So this is how liberty dies...with thunderous applause.”One could replace the word liberty with a few different words and it would still be on the money.Meanwhile behind the facade of a friendly looking mouse.....

 

[BTTUK]

”Little man with a big eraser “ might be the end goal?With what FPJ said and now how Anthony Daniels is being treated kind of reminds me of what Padme had said to Bail in ROTS “So this is how liberty dies...with thunderous applause.”One could replace the word liberty with a few different words and it would still be on the money.Meanwhile behind the facade of a friendly looking mouse.....

Anthony Daniels is far down my personal list of sympathy, considering how he's behaved towards his co-workers and the fans over the years.

 

[Psab keel]

Ultimately this is the reason why I haven't done film critiques on my channel because what could I possibly say that others haven't said a million times over? I'd rather focus my efforts on creating something of my own far from the Star Wars sandbox rather than limit myself creatively.

I appreciate these types of channels for what they are and I think they are important to the debate but at the end of the day there are more important things to really be upset over. I mean I know it probably sounds ridiculous coming from me when I get bent out of shape about this stuff, but I'm just trying to keep it all in perspective.

Is it terrible what they've done with the OT characters? Yes. Do I like the stories they choose to tell? No. What difference does it make now though? None. These movies exist. So rather than lose my mind, I'll just stop watching and move on with my life. I can't control what Lucasfilm does and neither can any of us on a forum or a YouTube channel.

Ten years from now I doubt many people will really care about this trilogy. There will be so much more Star Wars content by then anyway.

 

[HeartBlade]

I agree the critics can be over dramatic but they make good points. The conspiracy that Disney is killing OT characters because of license fees to Lucas seems too much as is buying tickets for Captain Marvel but their issues on storytelling are on point.

Disney under Kennedy has done a really bad job with Star Wars, especially with their characters.

Good guys
Rey is Superman
Finn Is a joke coward, not good at anything
Poe is borderline OP

Bad guys
Captain Phasma is also a joke.
General Hux is a running joke
Snoke is a dead mystery box
Kylo Ren is an interesting villain but destined to lose

 

[HeartBlade]

Yeah I’m not a fan of Anthony Daniels either but respect the fact that he has huge love for C-3PO. His critique that C-3PO is a side prop in the new trilogy is valid, given that C-3PO and R2 were the observational characters to witness our heroes adventures as well as add some light humor.

The “fans” stating C-3PO should die, etc are ignorant, stupid “deplorables” to quote a presidential candidate. C-3PO isn’t my favorite but his is an important character and to attack him for voicing legitimate critique is deplorable.

 

[Mr Webber]

Ultimately this is the reason why I haven't done film critiques on my channel because what could I possibly say that others haven't said a million times over? I'd rather focus my efforts on creating something of my own far from the Star Wars sandbox rather than limit myself creatively.

I appreciate these types of channels for what they are and I think they are important to the debate but at the end of the day there are more important things to really be upset over. I mean I know it probably sounds ridiculous coming from me when I get bent out of shape about this stuff, but I'm just trying to keep it all in perspective.

Is it terrible what they've done with the OT characters? Yes. Do I like the stories they choose to tell? No. What difference does it make now though? None. These movies exist. So rather than lose my mind, I'll just stop watching and move on with my life. I can't control what Lucasfilm does and neither can any of us on a forum or a YouTube channel.

Ten years from now I doubt many people will really care about this trilogy. There will be so much more Star Wars content by then anyway.

If people just sat back and let the status quo of sub standard cinema and insidious campaigns of misinformation and demonizing just continue unchallenged then thats what the future will be. Where is the arrogance of Disney less than a year ago "A Star Wars movie every year for the rest of your life" No fate but what we make.

 

[Mr Webber]

Yeah I’m not a fan of Anthony Daniels either but respect the fact that he has huge love for C-3PO. His critique that C-3PO is a side prop in the new trilogy is valid, given that C-3PO and R2 were the observational characters to witness our heroes adventures as well as add some light humor.

The “fans” stating C-3PO should die, etc are ignorant, stupid “deplorables” to quote a presidential candidate. C-3PO isn’t my favorite but his is an important character and to attack him for voicing legitimate critique is deplorable.

And where is the shill media outrage or even coverage over this, absolutely nowhere. The same Dollar Store outlets that to this day still falsely claiming the driving off of social media by Disney SW actors have burrowed deeply back in to the sand. If it wasnt for the alternative voice of "Subversives" on YouTube etc, we wouldnt even know about it.