Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Post-release)

Eh, if you say so but riddled in self doubt is not how I read him at all. Nothing about that scene would imply that interpretation that I can tell. He wants to rush off and save his friends and Yoda and later both Yoda and Obi-wan are begging him to stay. His training is not complete and he's going off half-******. At most, he's torn between his obligations to his friends and his quest to be a Jedi, but self-doubt is not something I get out of it.

I think you guys are kind of splitting hairs here, and are both right.

Luke needs to believe that it is possible -- at all -- for this stuff to be done through the Force. Then, on top of that, he needs to believe that he, himself, can do it. Both are hurdles he needs to clear. First, he needs to believe that the Force lets you do stuff like this, and then he needs to believe that he can personally do it.

I think the "Believe in yourself" thing comes into play in the cave scene, too. Luke strikes out in anger, at least partially because he's afraid. What he needs to believe is that he can defeat Vader without giving in to rage. (Or, at least, that's what Yoda's trying to teach him.)


Let's not forget that the films do make it clear that it's not as if anyone and everyone can use the Force to the same degree if they just believe in themselves. There's a degree of natural affinity involved, too. But once you have the natural affinity, you need to understand what's possible, and then get out of your own way and believe that YOU have the power to do it. I see the scene with Yoda lifting the ship as Yoda trying to get Luke to recognize his full potential. But I don't think he'd ask that of just anyone.
 
That is the reason the midichlorians did not ruin anything for me when introduced.

I don't see why having a natural affinity in the force being because you naturally have more midichlorians is so bad it just gives them away to test for future force ability's in the very Young .
it is supposedly better if there is no reason whatsoever why some people can use the force and others can't?

And I still can't wait to see if we get an actual reason for Kylo to turn to the dark or if it like Yoda said . the whole fear and anger lead you that way . because so far it seems he just thought Vader was " cool" and was rebelling against his parents . like he told Rey about Han being her father figure that he would disappoint her . they infer that Han left after Kylo turned and killed his classmates. So... so far it really seems kylo had no reason to turn except he is a weak willed, weak minded fool.

Another reason Rey could defeat his mind probe so easily without training.

He is strong in the force but weak in his will to control it when challenged .
The only other force users he went up against as far as we know is his classmates .and I'm sure he had the most training as he was born with Luke and Leia around him from the start , while the others were found by Luke later . nc of course he had the knights help as well .

- - - Updated - - -

Makes my wonder though, if someone got a blood transfusion from a Jedi would they then get midichlorians ? at least temporarily ? LOL

Also if a Jedi "believes" in themselves enough why can't they fly ?
They can levitate huge objects, why do they not just woosh around willy nilly ?
Or like Magneto ride on something they are levitating ?
Other than the obvious ridiculousness that people would say about it ?

We even see Ezra get levitated by his master when he falls off a ship .
 
Last edited:
My apology if this has been discussed previously.

I was thinking about the kylo interrogation of Rey scene. While he is reading her thoughts he mentions an island in the sea. This sounds like Luke's location at the end of the movie. What's going on here? Is he seeing a vision of the future? Has Rey been to the island in the past and had those memories suppressed?
 
...What we still don't know is just how independent a (ahem) force the Force actually is. The whole "controls your actions" thing implies that the Force can actually make people do this or that...sort of...
It's not an independent force at all. As Ben explained to Luke, "It's an energy field created by all living things. It surrounds us and penetrates us. It binds the galaxy together." And later Yoda restates this when he tells Luke, "Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you; here, between you, me, the tree, the rock, everywhere, yes. Even between the land and the ship." It is not independent from anything, but rather connects everything. Using The Force isn't really a matter of it controlling your actions, but of the user allowing it to enhance their actions. And this is why the Jedi need to train, to learn how to disengage their conscious actions and allow The Force to guide them (i.e., don't think about it, just let it happen).

...Luke needs to believe that it is possible -- at all -- for this stuff to be done through the Force. Then, on top of that, he needs to believe that he, himself, can do it. Both are hurdles he needs to clear. First, he needs to believe that the Force lets you do stuff like this, and then he needs to believe that he can personally do it...
Spot on. Luke's uncertainty about The Force is his biggest obstacle; his mind is telling him it's not possible, so it isn't. But once he begins to listen to Yoda and see for himself that these things are possible, his newfound belief and confidence grow and allow him to progress.

...Let's not forget that the films do make it clear that it's not as if anyone and everyone can use the Force to the same degree if they just believe in themselves. There's a degree of natural affinity involved, too. But once you have the natural affinity, you need to understand what's possible, and then get out of your own way and believe that YOU have the power to do it. I see the scene with Yoda lifting the ship as Yoda trying to get Luke to recognize his full potential. But I don't think he'd ask that of just anyone.
Also spot on. Anyone can learn how to golf, or play basketball, or become a boxer, but that doesn't necessarily mean they'll ever be as good as Tiger Woods, Michael Jordan, or Muhammad Ali, unless they also have a level of natural affinity that is greater than that of the average person.
 
My apology if this has been discussed previously.

I was thinking about the kylo interrogation of Rey scene. While he is reading her thoughts he mentions an island in the sea. This sounds like Luke's location at the end of the movie. What's going on here? Is he seeing a vision of the future? Has Rey been to the island in the past and had those memories suppressed?

In her force vision, Rey foresaw the duel on Starkiller Base with Kylo, so it's possible she'd seen the island before, perhaps in a dream, without realizing it was a real place.

Edit: or maybe it's explained in a deleted scene?
 
Last edited:
I bet a lot is explained in deleted scenes!. I hate it when they do that! Although, I usually agree with the deletions when I see them in the DVD "extras".
 
12573036_824839254291098_2517421362453507198_n.jpg
 
She didn't see the duel exactly. She found herself in the snowy woods being pursued by Kylo before she fell out of the vision.
 
Seen it again today for my 5th and last time. Still more than half the cinema filled which was great. I think I enjoyed it most this time around. After all the discussion about everything to look out for. Tried sooo hard to see if Rey cuts Kylos saber in half but just couldn't. Still had tears. Lol. My son still loved it. Now bring on the Blu-Ray or is it Blu-Rey. ;)


Ben
 
A short JJ Abrams movie history:

Alias: Jennifer Garner, lots of running through Southern Cal.
MIssion: Impossible III: Tom Cruise, lots of running through Bangcock.
StarTrek Into Darkness: Chris Pine running on Nibiru, Spock and Khan running around San Francisco.
Star Wars: TFA: Renn and Finn doing what? You guessed it......LOTS OF RUNNING !
 
Yeah a Star Wars version of Man from Earth.
Nothing but stories told in one room about the history of the Jedi or something no flashbacks/ visions allowed .
 
Best theory I have heard yet on Reys origin.

Kylo left Rey on Jakku to hide her from both Luke and Snoke as he could not kill his cousin during the jedi student slaughter, which is why he got so huffy about a girl helping the droid escape and how he knows her already .remember " What girl ?" As he force pulls the messenger into his hand
 
Last edited:
Back
Top