Star Wars Archives: 1977-1983

Discussion in 'Star Wars Costumes and Props' started by Roy Batty, Aug 11, 2018.

  1. JediMichael

    JediMichael Sr Member

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    Didn't even know they were making another new book. I just finished the 3 books by Rinzler. Does this new book cover anything not in those other than some new pics?
     
  2. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Bunch of never before seen pics
     
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  3. mugatu

    mugatu Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    From the pics I’ve seen posted here, I don’t think I’ve seen a single square stunt blade.
     
  4. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Nope, I’ve never seen one to begin with. Where did the story originate that the blades were triangle/square?

    I too remember reading back in the day that the blades with 3 sided and 1 side of the blade wasn’t painted with movie screen material and that helped make the blade flicker more when spinning

    Never seen any picture or video to back it up though?
     
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  5. Joek3rr

    Joek3rr Sr Member

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    I remember hearing about a three sided blade from this book
    418DV80R5XL._SX258_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg

    Though come to think about it, I don't think I've seen a picture of a three sided blade either. I think the blade just had black strip running down the length, which gives the illusion of the blade flickering.
     
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  6. dcarty

    dcarty Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    So far I haven't seen any behind the scenes photos but in ANH when Obi-Wan points his Lightsaber toward the camera you can see the rectangular shape of the tip of the blade. Since the blades in ANH were wooden and, for Obi-Wan's Lightsaber at least, it appears they were made from square stock and run through a Jointer to give the blades a taper resulting in the rectangular shape at the tip then they were covered with reflective material (there's a vintage interview with Mark Hamill where he says it was movie screen material and I think I've read accounts from Gary Kurtz saying the same thing) and, like JoeK3rr mentions, added the black stripe down the side. I read an interview with Gil Taylor years ago where he mentioned the blades being triangular and presented that here on the forum during a debate about the shape of the blades (again, many Centons ago). Taylor's memory of the blade being triangular is contradicted by what we see on screen but Obi-Wan's Lightsaber blade certainly seems faceted and I expect they used the same blades for Luke's.

    In one of the supplemental DVD interviews Peter Diamond mentions that they were always breaking blades during that fight scene. It seems we get to the round blades once Empire goes into production and they do away with the rotating blade practical effect. I don't know if they switched to metal at this point to avoid the issues they had on ANH.
     
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  7. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Thanks for all this great info!!
     
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  8. dcarty

    dcarty Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Just received my copy of the book! If you look at the still on page 166 you can see the shape of Kenobi's Lightsaber blade where it is square at the emitter and tapering off towards the end.
     
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  9. Marv

    Marv Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Shame the picture on page 90 isn't bigger showing the Macrobinoculars, we might have gotten to see the wedge shaped piece.
     
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  10. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Checking this out right now....
     
  11. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I can’t say I see square...

    IMG_7250.jpg
     
  12. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Vader’s looks real round as well

    IMG_7251.jpg
     
  13. dcarty

    dcarty Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Well, we may have to agree to disagree but here is the angle that I see:

    IMG_7250.jpg
     
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  14. russellsch

    russellsch Sr Member

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    I'm thinking come payday I'm gonna need this book. I was trying to resist. You all are evil ;)
     
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  15. Marv

    Marv Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Same at the other end too if you look close
     
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  16. Gregatron

    Gregatron Well-Known Member

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    I seem to recall reading that the blades were square, but with only two (alternating) sides covered in reflective material, so as to create a “strobing” effect when spun by the motor.
     
  17. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    We're talking a very small amount of time too. Vader's first motorized stunt they just gave up on. If the blades were turned on the rotation might also blur edges, let alone old over exposed b&W photography. In the final film, it's there though, the square profile of Obi Wan's

    I don't blame them for switching for ESB.

    Looks like the V2's clamp is empty there again!
     
  18. roygilsing

    roygilsing Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I received my copy. Wow! This book is immense!

    IMG_6448.jpg
     
  19. Star Wars Helmets

    Star Wars Helmets Sr Member

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    Thanks for posting the photos guys - any decent ones showing Bob Anderson's shoulder armour from ESB?

    Cheers

    Jez
     
  20. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I didn’t know there was a difference with his armor?
     
  21. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I have a very hard time taking it off the shelf with 1 hand
     
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  22. russellsch

    russellsch Sr Member

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    Ordered. Again, you all are evil. Thank you (y)
     
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  23. Star Wars Helmets

    Star Wars Helmets Sr Member

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    Am thinking the Anderson set had some alterations to allow for his size difference and/or help mobility. Isn’t the cape hook slightly different too?

    Just looking for anything that might help id'ing this armour, tells etc.

    Cheers

    Jez
     
  24. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    no idea, i was hoping for you to teach me something new lol :D
     
  25. Gregatron

    Gregatron Well-Known Member

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    CC2480F4-5F0A-42F2-AB56-337CCFA48C06.jpeg I find myself wondering if Anderson was used in some non-stunt shots. This does not look like Prowse, to me. The person in the suit doesn’t fill it out (particularly the shoulder bells) the way Prowse does.




    On the flipside, we do know for sure that the stunt helmet was used for some closeup/hero shots, too.

    87C4AD5C-CCA4-43B8-AF0D-3A3A1C8E0E30.jpeg
     
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  26. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    So, check out these photos posted by oblagon. I was taking a picture of my K-23 blaster in progress and the over-exposed flash did cool things to my V2. thats Rose-gold sponged over a the original black. Used the tip from the hoth blaster's flash hider to play a trick on the eyes and get that color. I also just got an Ace antique gold spray for my yuma to better match these archive book photos.. we'll see about that one..

    kV3.jpeg
    K-23.jpg kv2-1.jpg
     
  27. Star Wars Helmets

    Star Wars Helmets Sr Member

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    Yes I completely agree with you, I’m sure that’s the case. It makes sense that some of non-combat shots Anderson filmed were used in the final cut

    Cheers

    Jez
     
  28. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    In the Netflix documentary “I am your father” prowse goes into detail about how he was on set less and less for ESB and RoTJ

    And come RoTJ he was in his trailer most of the time...

    Anderson was in a padded suit, and they even had Anderson attempt the palpatine throw scene, but he wasn’t strong enough to lift paps with 1 arm

    That’s when George sent someone to ask prowse if he thinks he could do it.. prowse did it first take
     
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  29. Joek3rr

    Joek3rr Sr Member

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    I wonder if that has to do with the fact that he kinda let the cat out of the bag about Vader being Luke's father?
     
  30. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    That’s false claims... and a rumor, prowse mentioned in a interview/article back in 78 to British press, “wouldn’t it be a kind of twist if Luke and Vader were related”

    That snow balled into all kinds of rumors that prowse let out this huge secret when in fact George never mentioned the relationship and I personally didn’t believe he even thought of the relationship between the 2 at the time

    To back this up, prowse got very anger when he saw the empire strikes back debut with the cast and Lucas there in the theater..

    Prowse’s line was “Obi-Wan killed your father..” and prowse has said on record at the time he believed Vader was lying to Luke

    Lucas only told Hamill that the real line was what it is today, and he only told Hamill that because he wanted to have Hamill pull off a very heart breaking scene...

    Prowse was enraged that Lucas didn’t trust him with this information

    I don’t believe anyone other then Lucas, fishner, Kurtz and Hamill knew of it back then..

    I’m not saying or defending prowse.. he is no angel..

    But there was more bad politics involved that kept prowse locked in his trailer.. but that’s a thread for a whole other day..
     
  31. vader45

    vader45 Sr Member

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    Regarding the stunt helmet, the entire sequence from Luke in ROTJ hiding to vader throwing the emperor is the stunt helmet. A hero only came into play when Prowse did the throw stunt for a few frames since Prowse claimed Anderson could not do it. I guess Anderson refused to wear a hero, then again the lighting was very dark. I know the entire sequence was all Anderson aside the throw stunt, because the helmet changes from stunt to hero and the fact that Prowse stated that he did the throw stunt. I feel Anderson was used more then we realized at the end of rotj. Look at Anderson's arms in the bts photos with out the armor. He looks very padded compared to him from esb. I think Lucas was trying to phase out Prowse. But now I'm getting off topic! Lol

    That is why I argued the hero mpp could have been used in the duel.

    I believe the armor in esb was modified for Anderson to a certain point. It is still a bit big on him but the silhouette is smaller then the armor on Prowse when he had the fixed shoulder bells.
     
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  32. Gregatron

    Gregatron Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I noticed long ago that the stunt helmet was used both in the dark under the Throne Room and also when Luke is being zapped. If Anderson was used for all of those shots (even the close-ups, which didn’t require a tall guy like Prowse to look good), it makes sense that they’d just stick with the stunt helmet which was already properly fitted to him, rather than grabbing a hero.

    And I tend to believe that the MPP seen in the duel was just a stunt dressed like the hero (with the colored wires). There are examples of stunts filling in as belt-hangers (the Luke V2 being the prime example, of course), but no confirmed examples of belt-hangers being pressed into service as bladed stunts.
     
  33. russellsch

    russellsch Sr Member

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    Got my book delivered today :)
    I know you guys kept saying this book was big... but holy crap this thing is huge!!
    Love the Obi-Wan stunt saber shots! Would've liked to have more hero shots. All in all, however, this is a great book (y)
     
  34. clancampbell

    clancampbell Sr Member

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    On the subject of sabers,
    did you notice the pic of Luke's Hoth stunt double with the Holiday Special saber????

    Rich IMG_2235.JPG IMG_2236.JPG IMG_2235.JPG
     
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  35. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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  36. Psab keel

    Psab keel Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    To my eye the angle you see in that shot of Alec Guinness holding the saber is the nipple of the emitter reflected in the light.
     
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  37. oblagon

    oblagon Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Here's a clearer picture of the spinning attachment
    240620_645096762184305_1502940723_o.jpg
    1147084_495430350548960_75982123_o.jpg
     
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  38. kurtyboy

    kurtyboy Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    The square is visible at both ends of Obi-Wan's, and like dcaty said, very clearly visible in the unaltered pre-special edition.

    From watching the scene frame by frame I am pretty sure Vader's did not spin - hence the need for a round blade. It shows none of the flickering or black line anomalies that Obi-Wan's does, and the dents and dings are very apparent. Explains why the unconnected wires can be seen hanging from Vader's in that press still of the duel.



    The vintage screen material must be quite different to modern Scotchlite too, because you can see thousands of particles flying off with each clash. Looks like yellow dust.

    Yes, I studied the scene obsessively, over and over, frame by frame when I built my motorised stunt saber!

     
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  39. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Kurt, you still see obiwans as being a 3 sided blade?

    I too always noticed the dust during the ANH duel. And since I was a kid always wondered why there was so much dust lol
     
  40. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Kurt do you have any better pictures, or a video clip of the square tip?

    IMG_7596.jpg
     
  41. kurtyboy

    kurtyboy Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I've never seen a square with three sides! :p

     
  42. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I can’t even talk... so you believe the blade is square, 4 sided that goes down to a taper? 3 sided painted, 1 side bare (or painted black)?
     
  43. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I’m literally going insane this morning... I’ve been up early due to a broken water pipe over my bed.. real fun...

    Anyway...

    So on this mission to find the square blade I hunted down Kurt’s build.

    While searching for his build I found some pics Tom posted awhile back

    IMG_7598.jpg

    I can see what everyone is saying about the tip, but I still wasn’t sold... until

    IMG_7597.jpg

    This picture here I can finally see the sailboat...

    IMG_7600.gif

    Now I’m on a mission to find a lightweight square material...
     
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  44. kurtyboy

    kurtyboy Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Well its only what I deduced, and I've been wrong many times, but my blade is 10mm square at the tip, tapering to 15mm square at the base that's visible. Then round into the hilt. And I switched from two sides coated, to four with a thin black line, then to three coated and one black.

    The black line still puzzles me though. A wise man I know thinks it's just an uncoated seam where the ends of the reflective material meet.

     
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  45. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I always thought the black light was just shadow of the blades

    But I totally understand it’s purpose of giving the blade it’s flicker
     
  46. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I’m ready to boot up tinker cad and start modeling a freak’n blade...
     
  47. ALLEY

    ALLEY Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Funny...as a kid, I noticed that Kenobi’s saber flickered, while Vader’s did not. I had assumed this was intentional to show that Kenobi’s saber was old, worn out, and barely working compared to Vader’s saber.

    Now I know why there a difference between the two.
     
  48. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Never noticed that, I’m watching the de specialized edition tonight!
     
  49. halliwax

    halliwax Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Only thing that scares me is the weight of the wood blade. These golf clubs I have are super light and have proven to spin.. yet I don’t have the scotchlite yet, so I can’t prove it flickers correctly

    ... eeerrr tomorrow my new parts should show up. I just want to get this working again lol
     
  50. russellsch

    russellsch Sr Member

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    I love the Despecialized Editions. I rarely watch, what I call, the Ruined Editions anymore.
    & when I was little I always thought, that because Obi-Wans lightsaber flickers while Vader doesn't, is why Vader says "Your powers are weak old man."
     

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