metrosonus
Well-Known Member
The point being it had nothing to do with the episode at large and it was just a gimmicky intro to the episode.
New Doctor Who Series Discussion *Spoilers*
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Larry Young
Master Member
Well, that's an odd point to make, given that rarely does a teaser have anything to do with the episode at large. Kirk and McCoy are always talking about good food and Scotch when Cestus Three has been destroyed, and Toby and President Bartlett will be playing basketball in the teaser when the episode is about the senior staff dealing with society's fringe elements and economists and how they learn there's not much difference between the two.
Me, I thought it was quite funny, and particularly apt, given that it's the opening bit to the first episode after a long drought between adventures for the audience. We're all a bit at sea and apprehensive, hoping this series will be good... and we're treated to a parlor romp, a bit of Stalag 17, and some Laurel and Hardy in the span of five minutes.
What you call "gimmicky" I call "putting the audience on notice." Like how W.D. Richter started out the Big Trouble in Little China screenplay: "It's going to be THAT kind of movie."
I don't understand how people don't just roll with a show that's had the main character recast 11 times in 46 years. Writing "that's out of character for The Doctor" is practically an oxymoron.
E-Wan
Sr Member
It was a funny intro to the episode which, as Larry pointed out, was part of a series of ridiculous pranks the Doctor was using to get Amy and Rory's attention. They even explain it right in the episode!
If the show was 45 minutes of exposition - it would be incredibly dull. Jokes, asides and character-building is what makes a show.
If the show was 45 minutes of exposition - it would be incredibly dull. Jokes, asides and character-building is what makes a show.
metrosonus
Well-Known Member
And I don't buy it :unsure Go through all that just to deliver an envelope? it's a redundancy bordering on pointless. How were they supposed to know he was sending them messages? the spend the time since they last saw him sifting through books and watching the last 100 years of movies? I dont think so.. I'd expect him to turn up 30 seconds after he left.
I get it, it's supposed to be funny.. I feel it's disjointed. So sue me :lol
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fan_service
Angelus Lupus
Sr Member
Except, his track record for doing that sort of thing isn't very good. :lol Besides, it worked. He did silly things, Amy noticed, he knew she would.
E-Wan
Sr Member
What does fan service had to do with it? Are they finally satisfying the millions of fans who were clamoring for a Doctor Who / Laurel and Hardy crossover? Or is it fan service in term of satisfying people who tune in expecting an enjoyable 45 minutes of television?
It was a fun, entertaining intro to the show. If you didn't find it fun or entertaining, perhaps you are watching the wrong show.
It was a fun, entertaining intro to the show. If you didn't find it fun or entertaining, perhaps you are watching the wrong show.
Goodwolf
Sr Member
One thing that I'm always impressed by is the ability of UK actors to do very good US accents, esp Southern ones. Heck, even most US actors have a hard time pulling off a believable Southern accents to me, but that's coz I grew up in Georgia I guess and know the little details.
Mark Sheppard's accent was pretty good for a generic US accent, with only one tiny slipup where he referred to a group as a plural instead of a singular like we do here. I can't remember the exact quote, but where Americans would say "The FBI is on the case" he said something along the lines of "The FBI are on the case."
Mark Sheppard's accent was pretty good for a generic US accent, with only one tiny slipup where he referred to a group as a plural instead of a singular like we do here. I can't remember the exact quote, but where Americans would say "The FBI is on the case" he said something along the lines of "The FBI are on the case."
timelordjedi777
Sr Member
I've been having trouble getting used to Matt Smith but I didn't like Tennant at first either. Then a friend of mine remined me that nobody ever likes the "new" Doctor. It was the same way with Tom Baker. In this new season Matt has started to grow on me.
River Song is awsome.
River Song is awsome.
metrosonus
Well-Known Member
Wow standoffish behavior.. You guy's problem is you claim to enjoy the show but you stonewall anyone that doesn't see it your way. Brilliant erudite behavior. way to go..
E-Wan
Sr Member
My apologies is that's how it came across, that was never my intent. It just seems like there is a major disconnect between what the show is and what you want it to be.
metrosonus
Well-Known Member
I'm looking at it on multiple levels. There's parts I enjoy, there's parts I don't, there's plot holes I've noticed, others I can forgive etc. On the whole though I've enjoyed the show so far..
And for me, it's part of the fun to think it through and over analyze everything. That's actually part of my job as a writer
And I'm also half Italian and half Irish.. i tend to let the emotion all hang out..
It's all good..I mean I only talk about it cause I enjoy it.. otherwise i'd be on face book bitching about something
And for me, it's part of the fun to think it through and over analyze everything. That's actually part of my job as a writer
And I'm also half Italian and half Irish.. i tend to let the emotion all hang out.. It's all good..I mean I only talk about it cause I enjoy it.. otherwise i'd be on face book bitching about something
nickytea
Master Member
If you're referring to Dr. Renfrew in "Day of the Moon", he was played by a Canadian actor, not a UK actor.
Clearly, not all UK actors can do spot on American accents:
http://www.buzzfeed.com/provincialelitist/watch-the-cast-of-doctor-who-read-celebr
Birdie
Master Member
There is a level of 'if you don't like it, go away' kind of fourth grade debate in these threads from a few people that is getting every bit as tiresome as 'moffat-hating' is to the people that are really digging it.
From the debate off of the RPF (that I've read) there seems to be a 50/50 split on Matt Smith/Stephen Moffat, and equally in the professional critic pieces, if this was not reflected here I would be very surprised.
Why should there be an assumption that this 'series discussion' (it's in the thread title!) be a never ending chorus of 'that was geat' comments? It's a discussion (OED: the action or process of talking about something in order to reach a decision or to exchange ideas) not an appreciation tnread.
I don't even agree with a lot of stuff Metrosonus is saying, there is light and shade. I think Moffat does gags a whole lot better than RTD, for instance.
I just want to see a strong show, and I have a lot of doubts about it right now. So can we lay off with the black and white 'haters get lost' stuff coming from certain quarters (not aiming this specifically at you E-Wan, you've been pretty polite and articulate with your counters) it's juvenile.
And I will also offer up my love for River, it's SM saddling the character with the grating catch-phrases, just like RTD saddled Tennant with the increasingly annoying 'I'm so, so, sorry' schtick.
From the debate off of the RPF (that I've read) there seems to be a 50/50 split on Matt Smith/Stephen Moffat, and equally in the professional critic pieces, if this was not reflected here I would be very surprised.
Why should there be an assumption that this 'series discussion' (it's in the thread title!) be a never ending chorus of 'that was geat' comments? It's a discussion (OED: the action or process of talking about something in order to reach a decision or to exchange ideas) not an appreciation tnread.
I don't even agree with a lot of stuff Metrosonus is saying, there is light and shade. I think Moffat does gags a whole lot better than RTD, for instance.
I just want to see a strong show, and I have a lot of doubts about it right now. So can we lay off with the black and white 'haters get lost' stuff coming from certain quarters (not aiming this specifically at you E-Wan, you've been pretty polite and articulate with your counters) it's juvenile.
And I will also offer up my love for River, it's SM saddling the character with the grating catch-phrases, just like RTD saddled Tennant with the increasingly annoying 'I'm so, so, sorry' schtick.
E-Wan
Sr Member
:cheers
I see a lot of your points, and honestly, threads like this have pointed out plot holes that I hadn't noticed at the time. Moffat has certainly been guilty of leaving a couple of things unanswered, but I think that's a side effect of try to tell such an ambitious story in 2 x 45 minute blocks.
The one I don't really get is the fan service angle. For me, and from the wikipedia entry you linked to, something more like Amy suddenly appearing in a bikini would be fan service. Or 11 showing up in 4s scarf like in A Christmas Carol. A fun, jokey intro sequence just doesn't seem like fan service or that disjointed in the context of the Eleventh Doctor.
I see a lot of your points, and honestly, threads like this have pointed out plot holes that I hadn't noticed at the time. Moffat has certainly been guilty of leaving a couple of things unanswered, but I think that's a side effect of try to tell such an ambitious story in 2 x 45 minute blocks.
The one I don't really get is the fan service angle. For me, and from the wikipedia entry you linked to, something more like Amy suddenly appearing in a bikini would be fan service. Or 11 showing up in 4s scarf like in A Christmas Carol. A fun, jokey intro sequence just doesn't seem like fan service or that disjointed in the context of the Eleventh Doctor.
Larry Young
Master Member
Examples of two well-known teasers, one from the "Arena" episode of TOS and one from "The Crackpots and These Women" from The West Wing, neither of which had anything to do with the story proper.
Larry Young
Master Member
metrosonus
Well-Known Member
I agree with a lot of what you're saying.. but for some reason we just don't seem to connect on the idea the right way. No biggie..
I also called it pandering earlier too.. So let me see if I can explain what i mean. The intro sequence was a liberty taken by Moffat to get a rise out of the audience. Like way back when in the 80's and 90's action flicks.. You know, Chuck Norris would jump kick a guy through a wall and he'd land in the next room (like in a hotel or something) and a guy and a girl would be having sex or something and she sits up and screams, thus exposing her boobs. The only reason that happened was so the guys in the audience could see her boobs..
Same thing. He just made all this wacky stuff happen to surprise the audience, make them laugh, feel excited etc. I don't have a problem with the opening sequence in literally what happened on screen, but only in that they say he did it because he was trying to get them a message. In this case, the explanation was Chuck Norris and the boobs were the laurel and hardy scene, the back in time stuff etc.
In reality, there was no real reason for them to be looking through history books and films. Especially when they got an envelope 5 minutes later. I personally don't think that the why of all that will be explained. I agree with Birdie in that the big elusive pay off isn't going to happen the way we think or hope it will.
Do I know that it won't? No.. That also doesn't mean I can't enjoy the show as it is either.
I just personally don't like to see manipulations on the audience like that. Sight gags, jokes, side lines and all are great, they add spice to the show. But when they are presented as part of the plot, they leave audience hoping for something that isn't going to happen and it's easy to keep using the method to build excitement in lieu of a strong plot line.
It's happened in the past in many shows and hopefully this is where Birdie and I agree, we don't want to see it become a theme here.
Anyway, thanks for keeping the lines of communication open. everyone.
Goodwolf
Sr Member
And ironically he didn't to a very good Southern accent. While I'm no expert of the demographic makeup of the Canaveral area in the late 60's, today it's pretty Northern in sound. FL is the exception to the Deep South in that the further south you go in the state, the more northern is the feel, thanks to the retirees. His accent was much closer to what I've always associated with a more posh southern accent like you heard from educated people in Georgia, Alabama and Kentucky. Lewis Grizzard's accent was very similar, with the non rhotic R's, broad vowels and the soft drawl. What's his face from True Blood does a good job with this one too. Much better than some American Actors I've heard try it. Patrick Swayze in Blue and Grey comes to mind.
I dunno, while they weren't representative of any particular accent, they were pretty good for a generic one. Much better than some I've heard on the Beeb. But UK and even Australian accents seem to adapt to a Southern accent pretty easily. Speaking of True Blood though, the guy that plays Sooki's brother is an Australian. Shocked the snot out of me the first time I heard him speak out of character.
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