Mass Effect 3 Ending, opinions and feelings?

[Jeyl]

If anyone in the SYW crowd can state how the ending is consonant with the 2 games and 40 hours before the last 8 minutes, please speak up.

1. The Catalyst mentions he created the Reapers!... But why he calls them Reapers is anyone's guess. The Reapers didn't even call themselves Reapers.

2. The Catalyst believes in the cycle!... which I guess is why it didn't do anything when Sovereign/Saren assaulted the Citadel in order to turn the station into a gigantic relay. This entity can create the most powerful machines ever created but can't turn the Citadel into relay when that was one of it's primary functions.

3. The Crucible is a piece of machinery that all species from previous cycles have worked and continued to build on which was hinted at in all the previous games.... Oh, wait. No it wasn't. I forgot that one of the definitive goals of the Reapers is to wipe out all traces of each cycle's advanced species. They've wiped each cycle out to the point that we don't even know what the previous cycles looked like, how they ruled the galaxy and how many different species there were. The one and only thing we each cycle seems to safe keep are the plans for the Crucible, a machine that nobody even knows how it works. Admiral Hackett's excuse? "When we developed the nuclear bomb, there were fears that it might ignite the atmosphere, but they went ahead and used it anyway." The reason they feared that ADMIRAL is because the person in charge of figuring out forgot one tiny little element. Heat loss. If he did the same research on say, a match, the result of the study would show that the match would never burn out. Ever.

God, why does this keep getting worse.

4. The Mass Replays can create portals to other dimensions/planets/somewhereelse when destroyed, kind of like what happened in the Arrival DLC.... Gawddangit. No. Despite Joker trying to outrun what looks like a huge freaking explosion that's destructive and fast, we're supposed to believe it didn't cause harm to any of the planets in the solar system despite what the Alpha Relay in the Arrival did. And why would each explosion lead to the same effect destructive effect?

5. The Normandy crashes on an unknown planet that.... wait... jungle type planet, orbiting a bigger planet with a moon on the far side.... I'VE GOT IT! The planet that the Normandy crashed on is ZORYA!

There! This game is now vindicated!..... This is extremely horrible.

 

[Paul Andrew]

The one thing I've never heard mentioned in this whole fiasco is this. The entire series is about you as Shep making choices that can alter the fate of the story, and the galaxy. So if you turn it around and look at it from another angle, they delivered in spades by giving you the mother of all choices at the end and letting you decide the fate of millions of beings. Whether you're really a fan of any of the options is kinda moot, there is certainly precedent as far back as ME1 for having to make choices where there wasn't really a clear cut 'good' option.

EDIT: Now that I think about it, haven't bioware said that even if ME3 is the end of Shep's story the ME universe will likely continue in other games? What if the decision you make at the end of three feeds into that??

 

[Jeyl]

EDIT: Now that I think about it, haven't bioware said that even if ME3 is the end of Shep's story the ME universe will likely continue in other games? What if the decision you make at the end of three feeds into that??

I don't think they're going to go THAT route. Remember ME2? They said that one of the canon endings would have Shepard actually die story wise. Unfortunately, they didn't go through with that for ME3.

Also, the Collector Base. You would think the choice to destroy the collector base or leave it standing would play a huge part in ME3 to some extent. Here's what happens.

Collector Base destroyed: 100 Assets
Collector Base Intact: 110 Assets

That is the ONLY difference.

So if there's going to be a new game, the likely hood of any choice will be limited to just in-game dialogue and not actually story affecting ways. Or worse, text messages. Ugh! I hated those.

 

[DuneMuadDib]

Honestly, if I could get a concise answer to one question that didn't feel like it was pulled out of someone's rear end it'd shut me up.

Why don't the Reapers just kill synthetics?

The Reapers come through every 50k years and slaughter all the races that have advanced enough to have spaceflight and could create synthetic life so that they don't create synthetic life that kills all organic life. The Reapers leave the less organic races to grow up so they can get slaughtered in 50k years when the cycle repeats.

If the Reapers exist to protect organic life from synthetic genocide why don't the Reapers just kill synthetics?

The ending demonstrates that the Citadel and Mass Replays could have been weaponized to specifically target and destroy synthetic life while leaving organics a-okay. Why couldn't the Reapers install fuses or surge protectors or "don't blow up from the space-magic" fuse breakers in the Mass Relays then just fire off the red space magic every 50k years?

Why don't the Reapers just kill synthetics?

 

[Jeyl]

Why don't the Reapers just kill synthetics?

Stop... being.. smarter... than.. Shepard!

:cry

 

[Jeyl]

Here's a blog post detailing the collapse of the Child's Play "Retake Mass Effect".

"Hold the Line" using charity as a Shield.

 

[Jeyl]

Harbinger's lines from Mass Effect 2

Shepard and Harbinger have a talk

Does THIS sound like someone who wants to stop synthetics from destroying organics??

 

[Sluis Van Shipyards]

The Mass Relays didn't seem to be destroyed, if they were physically destroyed, in the same way Shepard destroyed the relay in Arrival. For all we know the beam just shut them all down.

I'm pretty sure Bioware has said ME3 is the end of Shepard's story. There will be more Mass Effect games though. I think that unless the relays are rebuilt in a DLC then those game better be before ME3 or you couldn't go anywhere. I'm guessing they will explore other game types, probably a FPS first because that's what everyone does. I'd actually like to see this format continue with different stories. Maybe Mass Effect: N7 where you're a regular soldier. I'd like to play a Spectre in a game where you do normal Spectre stuff, not saving the entire galaxy. I'm guessing the Council sent every Spectre into battle during ME3 so that could be a game where they are rebuilding the ranks.

 

[Wes R]

It is the end of Shepard's story, but i'd bet the character was at least mentioned in the future titles, and i think when the relays were "destroyed" they were more powered down safely unlike ramming an asteroid into it. The Protheans and others had to have seen this coming and would have found a way not to wipe out all life shutting down the relays.
The only part of the end of ME3 that makes a bit of sense is that the space brat uses the reapers to stop races from reaching a point where they create AI. I think the space brat was created, rebelled, and wiped out its creators and out of guilt wants to stop it from ever happening again. So instead of just finding a way to block the development of AI it does overkill and wipes out races entirely. It would make for a neat scifi story if it hadn't been so badly written and went against everything we know about the ME universe.

 

[Riv]

Having finished the game, I can't escape a profound feeling of melancholy about the whole experience. Yes, there is the issue with the ending, but even if it weren't a confused mess I would still feel the same sense of loss I do now. No, the reason I feel that way is because the very long journey I took to get to this point has finally come to an end and I know I have to say goodbye to a universe and characters I've grown to love in the past 5 years.

It's a feeling I have whenever a TV show or movie series I love reaches its conclusion. There's an appreciation for the moments you enjoyed and a sadness at knowing there will be no more to come in the future.

And this game certainly had its moments that I will reflect upon fondly as I would any of the previous games. All of the farewells with characters I'd grown to know over the past few years were all wonderfully done. Liara's "time capsule" scene will stay with me for a very long time, as will my excursion with Garrus to the top of the Citadel and the final goodbyes my Shepard shared with each and every one of the crew along the way.

As to the end, personally I feel like the GameFront "5 reasons the fans are right" is the best summation of all the issues I have with the ending. I would never demand Bioware re-do the ending- as it's their creative prerogative to do whatever they choose to with the world they created. However, I would like more clarity as to what exactly their intent was and a better explanation for what the ultimate implications of my choices were. To be honest, I don't need a new ending for that- just a simple blog post from the writers to explain themselves would suffice. But I appreciate that Bioware is taking the feedback seriously and I'm curious to see what will come of it. I just hope they don't back-track too much simply to accommodate the more ridiculous demands of the fans.

Sacrifice and a significant loss should still be part of the ending. I think it would be a cop out to try and change anything there- but there is room for more closure as I just don't think they provided it.

 

[CB2001]

Having finished the game, I can't escape a profound feeling of melancholy about the whole experience. Yes, there is the issue with the ending, but even if it weren't a confused mess I would still feel the same sense of loss I do now. No, the reason I feel that way is because the very long journey I took to get to this point has finally come to an end and I know I have to say goodbye to a universe and characters I've grown to love in the past 5 years.

I think I read somewhere that Bioware was planning on doing more Mass Effect games set in the same story universe. Could be wrong though.

 

[Jeyl]

I'm just thinking out loud here. If the Indoctrination theory is true, would that mean the game doesn't really end, but just stops? If everything after the moment where Harbinger blasts Shepard is really in Shepard's head, isn't that where the game officially stops? This is weird.

 

[JediCarl]

I'm just thinking out loud here. If the Indoctrination theory is true, would that mean the game doesn't really end, but just stops? If everything after the moment where Harbinger blasts Shepard is really in Shepard's head, isn't that where the game officially stops? This is weird.

Not necessarily. On my second finish I got the ending where it's heavily hinted at that Shepard lives. After everything (I chose to destroy the Reapers this time) played out and after the final scene of the crew coming out of the crashed Normandy it went to a short cut scene showing Shepard's body among rubble (presumably back down on Earth), he takes a quick breath (as if waking up) and then the screen goes to black again. This is the last thing that played before the End Credits.

 

[DuneMuadDib]

Not necessarily. On my second finish I got the ending where it's heavily hinted at that Shepard lives. After everything (I chose to destroy the Reapers this time) played out and after the final scene of the crew coming out of the crashed Normandy it went to a short cut scene showing Shepard's body among rubble (presumably back down on Earth), he takes a quick breath (as if waking up) and then the screen goes to black again. This is the last thing that played before the End Credits.

That's the ending that's used in the Indoctrination Theory. If said theory is true than that breath is Shepard waking up back in London after having been blasted by Harbinger and all the nonsense with Starchild never happened.

So yeah, if the Indoctrination Theory is true the game just stops.

 

[MasterDurangus]

I'm pretty sure BW said the Indoctrination theory was not true when they released their first statement from Casey that said they stick by the ending and that it's exactly what we see. Cool theory, but no cigar.

 

[Riv]

I think I read somewhere that Bioware was planning on doing more Mass Effect games set in the same story universe. Could be wrong though.

Not really sure how, given the state they left the galaxy. I suppose they could set them prior to the final events of ME3 but who would want to play them knowing the ultimate outcome?

Something that just occurred to me regarding the ending- it's basically an all-renegade ending. If you played the game as a synthetic-hating renegade, then the choices at the Citadel are all tailored to your previous decisions. And the "screw the galaxy" ending you get is what I would consider a renegade one.

So really, it just goes to show how many people played this as a paragon- for whom there are no endings. :lol Problem is, apparently the makers of the game all played as renegades. :unsure

 

[MasterDurangus]

There's many ways that they could do it. Off the top of my head:

A. Real Time Strategy (RTS) game using a similar engine to the Star Wars Empire At War Games where the player controls both space and land forces on a galactic scale, the campaign could be built around the Geth threat, you play as the Quarians and have to stave off the Geth in the official campaign, but you could play as any race against any race. I'd love to have my hands on a game like this.

B. First Contact War. Pretty big conflict, written about in a book by Drew K. You could easily make a game out of this.

C. We did everything from the human race. There are the Turians, Asari, Geth, Quarians, Batarrians, Protheans, so on and so forth, out there. Play as one of them in a different game.

D. Prothean-based game of when the Reapers first invade Prothean space. Play as Javik in this game.

They could do things from 50,000 years ago. They built a HUGE galaxy and explained a lot of the lore which leaves significant structure for future games.

 

[Jeyl]

Not necessarily. On my second finish I got the ending where it's heavily hinted at that Shepard lives. After everything (I chose to destroy the Reapers this time) played out and after the final scene of the crew coming out of the crashed Normandy it went to a short cut scene showing Shepard's body among rubble (presumably back down on Earth), he takes a quick breath (as if waking up) and then the screen goes to black again. This is the last thing that played before the End Credits.

Oh, I know that. That's what I got in my first run. The point is, everything after the Shepard being hit by Harbinger was all an illusion by Shepard's indoc process. There's really no other way to explain why Shepard is still amongst concrete rubble in a breathable environment when the Citadel exploded after the destruction choice.

It does kind of make sense that the other two options, merging with synthetics (THEY DON'T HAVE DNA!) and controlling the Reapers all mean you've accepted machines in some way and wiped out your own existence, hence being fully indoctrinated by the Reapers. And since the god child tries to tell you that choosing destruction will kill you and destroy the mass relays, it's not that hard to believe that this is not what the kid wants you to pick. It's been shown in previous Mass Effect games that anyone can fight indoctrination if they're strong enough.

Also, the Crucible should have been a trap... Maybe it still is.

 

[DuneMuadDib]

I'm pretty sure BW said the Indoctrination theory was not true when they released their first statement from Casey that said they stick by the ending and that it's exactly what we see. Cool theory, but no cigar.

Unless when the new DLC comes out Bioware goes "well, the fans seem to like this idea better than what we gave them so let's just roll with it."

 

[Wes R]

My friend's adopted son is playing ME3 and it's taking all i can do to not warn him. i'm sure he's already heard as he's 17 and all this buddies probably played it. i hope the new DLC doesn't suck. gonna be 6 months at least before it hits though.