Luke's Lightsaber Mando series finale.

[scohrdarkshadow]

I keep hearing it mentioned that Roman’s thermals were used in the show already (although I’m too new to verify sources). So it may make sense they would purchase from the same maker for the lightsaber

 

[Mark P]

I keep hearing it mentioned that Roman’s thermals were used in the show already (although can’t find a concrete source). So it may make sense they would purchase from the same maker for the lightsaber

Perhaps, that's why we asked for clarification. That being said, we do know that the static prop seen in the episode is NOT a Roman or Creepy Uncle unless it was altered prior to filming. I don't know enough about those two versions to say whether or not it would even be practical to do so.

 

[Loneken]

I assume this is mostly directed at my post, if so... You have missed my point entirely. Allow me to clarify.

I actually read this post and thought it was in this thread, this is directly what I was trying to discuss. A quote from Anakin Starkiller. “Actually, I probably won't be able to work on a Mando replica, since as of now it looks like they might have used a Rylo saber in production and Rylo has stated that he doesn't want anyone making a replica of his piece. So, that project might be DOA for me.”

Let’s remove Rylo specifically from this convo
and just talk in general. If a fan prop is purchased from these boards and used on screen, it is improper for said maker to call “dibs” and say replicas are off the table. Once it is on screen, it is now screenused, (duh) it should be, and IMO *IS* fair game to replicate, that is my point.

I was not assuming a new run would be made and I don’t particularly care either way if one was done. I was just sharing my opinion in that I think being nice, being honorable, we would allow the original maker space to produce a run if they wanted to, but if they *can’t* or *don’t* want to, they should not be able to lay claim to the prop.

Something we need to understand as a group.. These shows are going to continue to pull from fan sources. Some much more heavily than others. If we start marking arbitrary rules about what can and can’t be replicated and why, we are going to have a very bad time in the years to come.

Am I the only one thinking this? Am I crazy here? We need to think this stuff through before turning makers away.

Where has Rylo stated that? Did I miss it somewhere or was it in private conversation?

 

[Mark P]

Where has Rylo stated that? Did I miss it somewhere or was it in private conversation?

AS stated the quoted part in his TLJ hilt thread in a response to my post in that thread earlier today. My guess is he asked him about it via PM.

 

[Anakin Starkiller]

It was in a private conversation he had with me when I asked him how he felt about me taking a run at the Mandalorian Luke prop.

 

[Mr Mold Maker]

Where has Rylo stated that? Did I miss it somewhere or was it in private conversation?

As said above, it was posted publicly by Anakin Starkiller in his TLJ hilt thread.
I mistakenly assumed it was this thread since I open a few tabs.

To boil my point down to its simplest form:

Once a fan made piece becomes screen used, it can and should be able to be replicated as such.

If I make a replica prop and it is used on screen, that is the holy grail. I would hope and expect you folks here to replicate it. I would not stand in the way of that, it’s not right. That’s all, I’ll get off my soapbox now. Unless you guys want to continue this discussion, seems not much interest.

 

[BRRogers]

The incentive for most prop replicators is to get as close to the prop as possible based on all the tools and references in their toolkit... to get it as close as possible to what we see on screen by the volition and challenge of figuring it out.

With the possibility (likelihood) that one or more of the props seen on screen were provided by builders/makers from within THIS community:

1. It is no competition, thus no desire
2. There is no improvement thus no need
3. There is no interpretation because it has been made by us.

frankly... this is new and grey territory.
Yes there is opportunity and immediate demand: but to recreate the hilt... for anyone too do so sets a precedent which would yield the least resistance. AKA “recasting” an existing community member product. And as I said, one that an existing license holder has implicit control over due to having the control of the *exact* assets seen on screen.

Anyone assuming to do so in the moment would assume serious folly within the community.
If Rylo and Efx chose not to do so, well.... I think it would AT LEAST be left up to other vendors asking partnership and permissions, and ideally the assets. That, is not an ideal scenario for anyone when we know it should rightly be Rylo to determine. Or Roman or whoever actually is featured.

Thus, I would encourage any builder to champion and support the original makers to continue or reprise the specific pieces.

 

[Anakin Starkiller]

Bryan, I don't think the EFX issue has much to do with this issue. The Rylo prop and the EFX are completely different and Rylo is not connected with EFX. Also, the EFX reveal was not used on screen and does not have ANY of the tells that we're seeing that connect the Mando prop to the Rylo prop.

 

[teecrooz]

In my opinion, the Elstree design itself is fair game as long as people do the work on their own. What should specifically be frowned upon is reverse engineering Rylo’s work. As someone who owns one, I wouldn’t want to see it ”recast”.

I believe a static or f/x non-reveal will end up being fair game. That‘s what people will want because that’s what they saw. Also, most runs are now designed with FX in mind. External accuracy only for that because there is not room for the reveal and fx in this design at the same time. If not on the rpf, you’ll see it on FB or the other forums. I guarantee it‘s already being designed.

I would hope Rylo would do a non-reveal run. A visual replica of his replica.

 

[BRRogers]

Bryan, I'm not sure what the EFX issue has to do with this discussion. The Rylo prop and the EFX are completely different and Rylo is not connected with EFX. Also, the EFX reveal was not used on screen and does not have ANY of the tells that we're seeing that connect the Mando prop to the Rylo prop.

Anakin Starkiller, although it IS completely different in nuance is the current license holder EFX un related to the Efx licensed product that was ‘based’ off of Rylo’s reveal?

 

[Mr Mold Maker]

In my opinion, the Elstree design itself is fair game as long as people do the work on their own. What should specifically be frowned upon is reverse engineering Rylo’s work. As someone who owns one, I wouldn’t want to see it ”recast”.

I believe a static or f/x non-reveal will end up being fair game. That‘s what people will want because that’s what they saw. Also, most runs are now designed with FX in mind. External accuracy only for that because there is not room for the reveal and fx in this design at the same time. If not on the rpf, you’ll see it on FB or the other forums. I guarantee it‘s already being designed.

THIS is exactly what I wanted to say, but I no do words good. Thank you Teecrooz.

 

[Loneken]

Has it even been confirmed 100% that it is a Rylo? has Rylo been able to confirm himself? What if it's an Elstree? What happens if we find out it's a modified Rylo - does that still fall under his "IP"? Still lots of questions to answer before ruling out a run I would think.

Technically should anybody not be able to do a run as long as they don't use his hilt to create measurements and only use screen references? Of course it'd be hard to enforce.. definitely not a straightforward case.

 

[BRRogers]

Yeah sorry, just seems like new territory (with hot demand too). I would love to see Rylos and Romans
1. Confirmed
2. Support new runs themselves (or approved for others)
3. Not butt heads with Efx.

that sums my concerns up

 

[Mark P]

I agree that if someone were to create their prop based on what is seen in the show, that is fair game, even if the original prop is Rylo's as one wouldn't be copying the reveal or even the exact specs. If a particular maker doesn't want to do that, then that is of course their call to make. Now if someone with access to a Rylo saber directly replicated that in every dimension because they believe that is what was used or it was confirmed to be the case then that would be entirely unethical.

Personally, I think the best thing would be for someone to go in blind and create something base on what is seen in the show without knowledge of who made it.

The good news is that there are plenty of Hero builds with even rings to choose from if someone just wants something close to what was used onscreen. It will be exciting either way if it is confirmed that the prop seen in the episode was in fact fan-made!

 

[Anakin Starkiller]

Personally, I think the best thing would be for someone to go in blind and create something base on what is seen in the show without knowledge of who made it.

It might be cleaner if that was possible. But even this thread already contains close up photos and exact measurements from Rylos saber. You can't unsee details and you can't unlearn measurements.

 

[BRRogers]

I assume this is mostly directed at my post, if so... You have missed my point entirely. Allow me to clarify.

I actually read this post and thought it was in this thread, this is directly what I was trying to discuss. A quote from Anakin Starkiller. “Actually, I probably won't be able to work on a Mando replica, since as of now it looks like they might have used a Rylo saber in production and Rylo has stated that he doesn't want anyone making a replica of his piece. So, that project might be DOA for me.”

Let’s remove Rylo specifically from this convo
and just talk in general. If a fan prop is purchased from these boards and used on screen, it is improper for said maker to call “dibs” and say replicas are off the table. Once it is on screen, it is now screenused, (duh) it should be, and IMO *IS* fair game to replicate, that is my point.

I was not assuming a new run would be made and I don’t particularly care either way if one was done. I was just sharing my opinion in that I think being nice, being honorable, we would allow the original maker space to produce a run if they wanted to, but if they *can’t* or *don’t* want to, they should not be able to lay claim to the prop.

Something we need to understand as a group.. These shows are going to continue to pull from fan sources. Some much more heavily than others. If we start marking arbitrary rules about what can and can’t be replicated and why, we are going to have a very bad time in the years to come.

Am I the only one thinking this? Am I crazy here? We need to think this stuff through before turning makers away.

To respond to the question directly:
I don’t think you’re crazy. If everyone says no: a hole gets left. That hole has a name. Demand. And if there are no originators or licensees who agree to fill that hole...
Well, I suppose some-one will fill it.
We just don’t want to see it be filled with an unsolicited recast, but rather an honorable, new, cleanly self-derived product which bypasses that grey area entirely and fills that demand hole

 

[SethS]

This is the paradox I was referring to. At the end of the day Lucasdfilm could C&D any fan builder down to the ground. What we're talking about is benefitting off of somebody else's hard work, not their IP.

At any rate, I am curious about Roman's maybe being used for stunts. I posted higher pics on the last page, anyone taking those apart yet?

 

[Mr Mold Maker]

To respond to the question directly:
I don’t think you’re crazy. If everyone says no: a hole gets left. That hole has a name. Demand. And if there are no originators or licensees who agree to fill that hole...
Well, I suppose some-one will fill it.
We just don’t want to see it be filled with an unsolicited recast, but rather an honorable, new, cleanly self-derived product which bypasses that grey area entirely and fills that demand hole

You and I are in agreement.

Let me try one more time, like I said above, I’m not good with words..

The saber, once canon and on screen is no longer “Rylo’s saber.” All screen caps or official BTS reference we may get is “Luke’s Mandalorian saber.“ This is the *screenused prop.* This is fair game.

I do not support buying a Rylo and calipering it. Never said I did. That is “HIS piece.” Off the table, and that is perfectly fine.

Do you see the difference I’m trying to make here? Just as an example, what Anakin Starkiller was doing should be perfectly acceptable without question, because as far as I can tell he worked solely from screen caps. He is replicating the “Screenused prop.” He is NOT replicating Rylo’s saber. It is a fine line but a line none the less. All this is just my opinion of course, I don’t have the solid answers. This is new territory, but I know we need to discuss it pretty quickly with what’s coming.

If Rylo or an official source makes the saber, all the better. It will not be an issue anymore. But as you said it does potentially open up a larger issue with LFL and Disney. That a whole different can of worms.

 

[Anakin Starkiller]

Just as an example, what Anakin Starkiller was doing should be perfectly acceptable without question, because as far as I can tell he worked solely from screen caps.

Since my name came up, and for the sake of full disclosure this is not 100% correct. Although I do not own one of Rylo's sabers, a year of so ago, I purchased some of the leftover parts from his Elstree run. Most of these parts are the internals, which do not apply to the Mando saber, as you are describing it and as I am also thinking about it. However, I do own one of Rylo's control boxes, the clamp tube, and the pommel cubes. Which I have been recently looking at and examining in the process of determining if Rylo's saber was used in the film, and which I referenced for the purposes of scaling in building the model I used in my comparison shots above.

I don't think it's entirely possible to say "I'm recreating the Mando saber, but not Rylo's work" if Rylo built the saber. You can't make a Mark IX tricorder without copying HMS's work. You can't make an 11th Doctor's sonic without copying Nick Robatto. You can't make a Vader helmet without copying Brian Muir. All these people are part of our community and all of these people have had their creations measured, scanned, directly referenced in the effort to make exact reproductions.

 

[Mr Mold Maker]

Since my name came up, and for the sake of full disclosure this is not 100% correct. Although I do not own one of Rylo's sabers, a year of so ago, I purchased some of the leftover parts from his Elstree run. Most of these parts are the internals, which do not apply to the Mando saber, as you are describing it and as I am also thinking about it. However, I do own one of Rylo's control boxes, the clamp tube, and the pommel cubes. Which I have been recently looking at and examining in the process of determining if Rylo's saber was used in the film, and which I referenced for the purposes of scaling in building the model I used in my comparison shots above.

Gotcha. Slightly different circumstances. Your stepping away makes more sense to me now.