What ? A Vader Thread has fallen to pieces ?
Where's my watch ? I need to set the time.
Where's my watch ? I need to set the time.
eFX ANH DARTH HELMET SAMPLE!!
- Thread starter GINO
- Start date
Darth Stone
Well-Known Member
Well said, quite the pissing contest. :unsure
Albatrossone
New Member
Photos of the SL and TM scars were both posted.
sskunky
Sr Member
:lol what did you expect.
Y
Nice, Qui-Gonzalez!
I have nothing against what has been offered and would like a legend myself as said earlier in the thread. I just find it amazing what you call solid evidence.
I'm not talking about fan sculpt?
wannab
Sr Member
Where was that stated by anyone?
I don't take anyone's word as gospel, but I am much more willing to believe those who have HELD the mold than those who have not held the mold. I am also much more willing to believe those who took an original casting from the mold themselves than someone who bought one from someone who claimed that it came untouched straight from the original mold. I also find it interesting that the same people who are willing to swallow tall tales and the WORST COMPARISON PHOTOS IN THE HISTORY OF THIS HOBBY, suddenly can't be convinced by pretty good photos from eFX. Just goes to show, if you don't WANT to believe that nothing will convince you. Does eFx have a reason to lie about the C scar and other details? No. Why? Because 99% of the people who bought a helmet have never heard of a C scar and wouldn't understand what you were talking about if you explained it to them for an hour. Its inclusion or lack thereof was never going to change this being eFX's fastest selling item ever. The masses who bought this helmet care more about the artwork on the box than the details we pour over. On the other hand, do those who have a helmet supposedly from an earlier and more untouched stage of the mold have a reason to protect their investment and their reputation as king of all Vader? Absolutely!
If you have an uncleaned helmet from the Baker mold, there is little doubt that in a number of ways it is more true to the original than the mass produced licensed helmets. Was that ever in question? Here is the real question. Does the quality of the eFx helmet, no matter how close it is to yours, have ANY bearing on the value of your helmet? My answer is no. It doesn't. Apparently, most of the people in that group would not agree as they seem to feel VERY threatened by eFX's offering and have done everything they can to tear it down in the eyes of the public, going as far as to make absolutely ludicrous claims and even more of those horrible comparison photos that show nothing at all.
wannab
Sr Member
Sold out in 4 minutes. Best bet, Ebay or if one pops up on a FS thread. Good luck, it's a good 'un. :thumbsup
Doug
wannab
Sr Member
Art, you are too close, you're getting pulled in. You need to step back as you are just fanning flames here (you may not see it). C'mon bud, moderator not instigator. Smack down via pm if ness. You are bigger than this. Just a heads up. :thumbsup
And guys (all camps), chill out! Refocus. Too many folks getting banned for this sort of nonsense lately. Don't buy in, fold the cards.
Beers all around!
Doug
I apologize if you took that personally, I honestly could not say who exactly the people I was referring to.
I have virtually no interest in this item or product.
I just watch what it has does to this community every time it comes up.
It's just stupid and sucks all the fun out of it.
Probably so, since I know some of what has gone on behind the scenes on the one side and some of the lengths that have been gone to in order to try to damage products like this. I think if every one was privy to some of those details, bannings and lynching would be demanded.
wannab
Sr Member
Now now, should I repost my pics? As my post is so far that anyone trying to read this thread won't reach it before getting totally bored!
Yes please!
Doug
rickrickrick
Sr Member
This thread has derailed SO badly, I think it should be locked, and a separate show-off thread should be started. What's being said and posted now has nothing to do with the advance copy cited in the subject line of this topic.
Then why are you reacting this way to discussion of it?
Well the fact of the matter is, it is instructive to compare a licensed product with something that came before it. That is one of the things that has gone on on this forum for years. I didn't see you getting up in arms about the MR ROTS helmet or the Rubies helmet when it came out and was critiqued.
Art, this is one product. There are many products that have been discussed over the years on this forum. So why are you so engaged in discussion of this particular one?
There are no ludicrous claims here, Art. Part of this hobby is to get to the truth about what is authentic and what is not. About what is a prop replica supposed to look like, or how close it is to the original. No one has questioned the authenticity of the eFX and anyone seriously interested in Darth Vader helmets, including myself, has purchased one. So? If we purchase one, then we have a vested interest in discussing it here, on a replica prop forum.
I have a casting from the Rick Baker mold taken long before eFX was even aware of the mold, and at a far earlier stage of its life than when eFX got its hands on the mold, and the C-scar is clearly there. And it isn't like my casting came out of thin air. There were two ILM artists involved in making the pull. And Darth Jones, who himself worked for ILM, and has seen the mold in person himself, confirmed that it came from that same mold, as he himself got a pull from that mold. So I suppose three ILM artists would be lying about my pull?
Furthermore, the Rick Baker mold itself actually has residue of the exact resin that my casting is made of, which is further evidence that my casting came out of that mold.
So if you or anyone would like to argue about whether the C-scar should be there or not, then you should realize that the history of the mold didn't start when eFX had a look at it. And you are not even a Vader enthusiast, so why do you get involved in these discussions? If you have evidence to the contrary, then please show it.
Not only is the C-scar not on the eFX castings, neither is the fine detail that is surrounding it on that front cheek surface.
Anyone with an eFX mask can prove me wrong. And eFX themselves are more than welcome to prove me wrong. That is what this forum is about. Discussing what is really there or not. If I am wrong, then I'll say so and we can move on.
So perhaps why don't you let those who own an eFX helmet defend their interest in its details? But instead you seem to wish to attack anyone who questions the details on this helmet. Well we should all here be free to voice our opinion or to even be able to present evidence to support whatever we think is the case, without being personally attacked either individually or as a group.
You want the proof, well here it is.
The SL ANH helmet, which as you are well aware came from the Rick Baker mold, has detail never before seen at high resolution. This permits us to look at screen shots or higher resolution images of the original ANH mask and confirm that these details were present. Below is just a few examples of such comparisons that clearly show details on the cheek of the SL corresponding to details on the original ANH mask.
High resolution of paint detail on the cheek of the original and the SL ANH:
And closer:
Those grey paint details masked in on the right cheek on the eFX are actually resolvable on the SL ANH as real details.
Take the "rabbit ears" as I call them. On the original, on the SL ANH. And nowhere to be found on the eFX.
And then the C-scar....which is actually an L-scar, on the original ANH mask (left) and the SL ANH mask (middle and right). This is only one detail, yet for some odd reason it received the most attention because there was argument between TM owners and myself about its true shape.
And finally, a comparison I made just to settle this matter, showing images of the right front check surface of the original ANH mask (left top and bottom images), the same area on the SL ANH (center top and bottom images), and the same area on screen captures from the original ANH mask as seen in the Tantive IV scenes.
All the detail is there, and not just the C-scar. It is there onscreen, it is there on the best images of the original ANH mask. And it is there on a pull taken from the Rick Baker mold when it was only 13 years old, using the same resin whose residue still remains in the mold to this day, 35 years later.
vaderdarth
Master Member
Excellent photos Tom. Well done. Wow, that just nails it for me. Oh and by the way, the SL is not the only Baker sourced helmet besides the eFx that is in private hands. That scar is definitely dimensional. It is not and I repeat NOT a paint op on the screen helmet. It is a definitive 3-dimensional blemish in the paint of the screen helmet. Otherwise it would never have shown up on multiple helmets as a scar that you can feel with your fingertip. If it's not on the eFx, something happened during the first pull out of the mould, or else it was removed on the resulting casting so it didn't show up in any production helmets. I'm sorry but there just isn't any other explanation considering multiple helmets with the blemish intact.
Dave
Well done. Wow, that just nails it for me. Oh and by the way, the SL is not the only Baker sourced helmet besides the eFx that is in private hands. That scar is definitely dimensional. It is not and I repeat NOT a paint op on the screen helmet. It is a definitive 3-dimensional blemish in the paint of the screen helmet. Otherwise it would never have shown up on multiple helmets as a scar that you can feel with your fingertip. If it's not on the eFx, something happened during the first pull out of the mould, or else it was removed on the resulting casting so it didn't show up in any production helmets. I'm sorry but there just isn't any other explanation considering multiple helmets with the blemish intact. Dave
Hirohawa
Sr Member
Thomas, I am going to preface my comments by saying that I would think you would be the absolute LAST person who would want to take me to task regarding this issue or anything to do with Gino and eFX... and I'll just leave that at that.
Your implication is that my only interest in this thread has to do with ensuring eFX's sales of this helmet. Nice spin, but my interest has nothing to do with their sales since I have nothing to gain from them.
I am responding here because I see the same thing I have seen from you and several others before. Nothing will dissuade you from hanging on to the belief that what you have is the best of the best and even when something comes up that never had a chance, in its final form, of competing with an unaltered casting, you will go to extraordinary lengths in order to call everyone from Bryan to Gino to Lucasfilm into question to make sure we all know that you are still king of your hill.
I don't think anyone here is arguing that point.
I didn't see what has been done over the past two years be done when those helmets were produced. If you have evidence to the contrary, where a small cliche came out and did everything possible to call into question the provenance of one of those helmets, please feel free to present it.
Again, nice attempt at a spin, but we have NEVER had an issue with a product being "discussed" but then, that isn't what you have been doing is it?
Your implication is that my only interest in this thread has to do with ensuring eFX's sales of this helmet. Nice spin, but my interest has nothing to do with their sales since I have nothing to gain from them.
I am responding here because I see the same thing I have seen from you and several others before. Nothing will dissuade you from hanging on to the belief that what you have is the best of the best and even when something comes up that never had a chance, in its final form, of competing with an unaltered casting, you will go to extraordinary lengths in order to call everyone from Bryan to Gino to Lucasfilm into question to make sure we all know that you are still king of your hill.
I don't think anyone here is arguing that point.
I didn't see what has been done over the past two years be done when those helmets were produced. If you have evidence to the contrary, where a small cliche came out and did everything possible to call into question the provenance of one of those helmets, please feel free to present it.
Again, nice attempt at a spin, but we have NEVER had an issue with a product being "discussed" but then, that isn't what you have been doing is it?
Jedi-72
Sr Member
Excellent photos and comparison work, SithLord. I don't know that they'll make much difference in the ongoing debate. When folks argue from a position of pure passion, facts are often discarded or ignored as inconvenient obstacles to "belief".
I own a Legend, and can't say that I'm ecstatic to be disappointed in something that I shelled out over a grand for. I'd love for it to be perfect. It isn't....for all the reasons that you so dillgently enumerated and then some. My biggest disappointment is in the fact that the "clean up" seems almost to have been done to deliberately remove the very texture and details that make the ANH Vader what it is. THAT pisses me off. The, "the truth is what we say it is", despite physical and photographic evidence to the contrary also greatly steams my clams.
The biggest WTF is why it (clean up) was even done in the first place since there seems no logical or plausible reason that it should have been done given the nature of what the "Legend" line was supposed to be. It just makes no sense, and the excuses offered for why it was done make even less sense.
Is it the best "licensed" Vader helmet? Sure. That's the asterisk..."licensed". Even more infuriating is that the asterisk was totally unnecessary, if only they had left the thing alone, pristine and untouched. WHY?!
I own a Legend, and can't say that I'm ecstatic to be disappointed in something that I shelled out over a grand for. I'd love for it to be perfect. It isn't....for all the reasons that you so dillgently enumerated and then some. My biggest disappointment is in the fact that the "clean up" seems almost to have been done to deliberately remove the very texture and details that make the ANH Vader what it is. THAT pisses me off. The, "the truth is what we say it is", despite physical and photographic evidence to the contrary also greatly steams my clams.
The biggest WTF is why it (clean up) was even done in the first place since there seems no logical or plausible reason that it should have been done given the nature of what the "Legend" line was supposed to be. It just makes no sense, and the excuses offered for why it was done make even less sense.
Is it the best "licensed" Vader helmet? Sure. That's the asterisk..."licensed". Even more infuriating is that the asterisk was totally unnecessary, if only they had left the thing alone, pristine and untouched. WHY?!
Similar threads
