Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

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David Moeller

Active Member
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

Great find Andrew!!!!

I did not know that the other stuff was on the gun. I have not yet had a chance to post the picture, for some reason it is too large a file to upload???

It is the part just ahead of this assembly on the lower portion just behind the round part from the rail gun, any idea?

Thanks again for that find!

Dave
 

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Andrew C.

Well-Known Member
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

Hi David!

Glad to be sharing with you guys, this thread has two finds I didn't know yet, so I'm still behind by -1.

And good call on your part, you were in the ball park when guessing the 100th scale size of the gun! :):thumbsup

If you mean the Y-shaped piece, that one I haven't identified yet. Am also stumped as to the basic underlying grating (with square holes at regular intervals) that lies underneath the Y-shaped part.

This is a real nice thread! :cool
 

GKvfx

Sr Member
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

..........Am also stumped as to the basic underlying grating (with square holes at regular intervals) that lies underneath the Y-shaped part.............
A few posts back, Mark Dickson has said that it's made up of some track links from the ESCI T-34 kit that also donates parts to the Viper. I certainly trust Mark's research, but I don't know. I think the problem may stem from the fact that I'm looking at the Italieri re-pop of the kit and, 30 years on, some retooling of the tracks may have taken place. The tracks from the Italieri kit have definitive link pattern - a sawtooth edge - that I don't see on my Jim Key casting. It's certainly close enough for my purposes.

Gene
 

Eagle-1

Well-Known Member
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

Hey guys,

Been doing good since I've been gone I see!

Guys, I've got plenty of the ESCI 1/76 sized kits, older versions. What do we need to see and I'll get a picture up. I can scan that 1/125 destroyer too, in a couple days. Anything y'all think will help, just let me know and I may have it to scan.

Mr. Gene, I haven't forgotten the F4 intake scans either. I'm almost certain these are the intakes that were used. They certainly look right. I'm in the middle of housing renovations and have been for a couple months.

Rob.
 

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David Moeller

Active Member
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

Yes Andrew,

I shrank this one down again so here it is... I have an idea where it may be from so I am looking into it. I have been trying to extrapolate dimensions between the viper parts and the kit parts, believe me, it's not easy, just when you have something, it's a little off and you have to change it!


Gene, good to hear from you!

Dave
 
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Eagle-1

Well-Known Member
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

Hey Dave,

I think some of that may be because the Viper kit itself is smaller than it's suppose to be? This was posted a few rwplies ago. Was that for the whole kit OR just for the body, I wonder now?

Rob.
 

GKvfx

Sr Member
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

OK, I'm now blind, so forgive any typos...... I just looked at the Viper casting and the Italieri (ex-ESCI) T-34 tracks I have. Yup, it's a match. I guess I really didn't look close enough earlier. The problem we are all having is from the soft nature of the castings we are working with. It seems to obliterate the detail that would ID it easily. The T-34 track width is the same and I finally found a small portion on the casting I have that shows the edge of the track link. Sooooo..... Greeblie Gremlin had a good hunch a few posts ago, and Mark Dickson confirmed it. Of course, I think I just lost some of my eyesight proving it to myself. gaahhh!

The whole kit has shrunk. I was able to compare the fuselage and wings to an earlier generation casting and the difference was noticeable if you put them back to back. Honestly, if you were too look at the "smaller" castings by themselves, or look at one and then look at another, it would be difficult. But back to back - it's easy to see. Maybe it's me. I look at a model and if it looks good (paintjob, construction, and crispness of details), I'm happy. To each his own, I guess.

Rob - I managed to pick up an F-4 Phantom kit at the IPMS Nats. I did check the intakes. Couple of things. First off, they seem too big. Yeah, I know that I said the casting I have has shrunk, but the intake seems too big, even taking the shrinkage into consideration. (And as "Seinfeld" has proven, shrinkage is an issue.) Secondly, the intakes on the Viper transition from a square profile at the opening to a round profile over the space of about 1 1/2". The Phantom intake just doesn't make this transition. In fact, the Phantom part maintains a squared off profile over most of its length. Seems like too much work to make the kit parts work.

Just my 2 cents.......

Gene
 

Andrew C.

Well-Known Member
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

Yes Andrew,

I have an idea where it may be from so I am looking into it.
Let us know if it pans out! :)

I have been trying to extrapolate dimensions between the viper parts and the kit parts, believe me, it's not easy, just when you have something, it's a little off and you have to change it!
Yeah, thanks to the generational shrinkage the parts need tweaking and a bit of cheating to fit. Wouldn't it be great if the vintage plastic kits would shrink at the same rate? :lol

Andrew
 

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greeble_gremlin

Well-Known Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

Wow,!
Glad to see so many posts on this thread, I leave for a few days and miss out on so much..

Thanks for the valuable info on the inset, Andrew C. --Good work!

I feel so stupid , as I sit not 20 feet from a finished Linchberg destroyer kit in a co-worker's office. I looked it over and dismissed it,
I'm an idiot ... :redface
as iI looked closley at it's 20mm and ignored the 40mm Bofers --Duh!
 

greeble_gremlin

Well-Known Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

Not to be contrary, and I am certainly no expert, but I don't subscribe to F-4 Intake theory.
I compared the parts side by side-it just didn't seem right. It is possible an ILM'r simply fabricated the Intake starting with only a short section of tubing.

Glad to hear I had at least one right hunch on those treads.

Regarding the "shrinkage" issue ... I'd like to take some digital calipers, carefully take measurements of the Viper resin castings I have.. and compare them to careful measurements of the donor kit greebles (hey that's why they call me Greeble Gremlin...) :lol

and try to come up with a "scientific" estimate/calculation of the amount of shrinkage. I think I have enough original kit parts to get a healthy "sampling"

anyone else care to try the same ?
 

Eagle-1

Well-Known Member
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

Ok, y'all keep trying to shoot holes all in my "I'm sure they're F4 intakes" theory and y'all are simply gonna piss me off now!!!!!

Just kidding before somebody blows a gasket........:rolleyes

I haven't given up on it yet, but if y'all say it ain't right, it ain't right. I haven't had time lately to do much with the Viper, but I will do some side by side comparison so that I can give up on the idea.

Greeble, I would certainly be interested in what you come up with as a "proper" size. That may help whether or not the intakes were used.....

See, y'all haven't completely convinced me yet!

Rob.
 

Clerval

Sr Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

About four years ago I was going through this same process and also brought around the possibility of intakes. I've had a few folks give me a hand who aren't here on the boards, and have to keep a couple things to myself (silly promises, but promises still--- though one was nailed in this thread already) and we discussed at length whether an intake or fuselage could have donated elements to the Viper. The general consensus (I had voted Yes) was No, and I let that go and pursued other bits, now have about 4 pieces to ID.

Anyway, long-winded way of saying the intake/fuselage debate has been around and not really fully resolved.

I've been using greebles to make nurnies for a good time and have helped a few Galactica guys out in the process, have now a professional need to get a Viper up and running again. Should anything come to light (some guys... well, we think we have conversations or tell each other something, then a few years later find out whe hadn't) I'll definitely toss what I can along.

'grats on the fine looking piece and glad to see such inerest and action on a great ship design.
 

greeble_gremlin

Well-Known Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

Eagle-1

You may be right. I'll look at the f-4 parts again.
What do I know.. I couldn't even spot that Lindberg part right under my own nose.

Regarding my measurements, I have 2 excellent Jesse Kits that (very slightly ) subtly differ from each other and a horrible MIM kit (which I know generally to disregard)

I'll see if Icome up with anything worthwhile. Dave, didn't you mention you had digital calipers?
 

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Eagle-1

Well-Known Member
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

No problem with me being wrong. I'm wrong all the time, so it doesn't even hurt anymore.....

:rolleyes

They just seem so close and there are other F4 parts, so.....:unsure Just seems so unlikely they would go to the trouble to make something they already had so close to what they were making?

I will do some comparing. It simply seems that they just need to be trimmed just right.

GG, I've got digital calipers (6")? And several other machinist's tools. If Dave doesn't, what would you like measured?

I'll get the T-34 ESCI sprues scanned shortly. Y'all seem to get busy while I'm at work and can't check nothin'!

Rob.
 

David Moeller

Active Member
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

Yes, Mike I have those digital calipers! :)

I am glad to see you are back

Dave
 
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greeble_gremlin

Well-Known Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

Hey Mike,

Here is your photo with the part in question boxed in. Thanks for the help!

Dave
Hi Dave,
unfortunately I haven't a clue on that part, at least it doesn't look to hard to scratch-build

close-up Pictures of those wings are coming....
 

Eagle-1

Well-Known Member
Re: Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

Ok guys,

I haven't forgotten about making progress here.

I started digging through the "stash" today to find some of the kits we need scans of. All I can ask is that y'all give me another day or two. There's 27 big storgage containers I will have to go through. I made it through about 6 today before I had to leave for work. The problem is, the ESCI kits are small and stupid me, I've used a few in every container as filler where I had a little space left, so they're scattered all over.

:cry

I'm digging though, so it won't be long. I've got, I think, 4 of the T-34, so all I need to do is come across just one........

Just one.

Rob.
 

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