Classic Viper Build-up -- FINISHED!

Discussion in 'Studio Scale Models' started by PHArchivist, Jul 5, 2005.

  1. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    My approach to this is to build it strictly as if it came off the effects stage, as opposed to the "idealized, desktop display" style. I weathered it as close to the studio models as possible (with some minor variation on the fuelage), including a mounting port cover and all.

    Here are some pics:
     
  2. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    Question is:

    Does anyone have a cast of the 1:24 scale Harrier pilot figure used on the originals
    ?
     
  3. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    Just for fun, here's a pic.

    The base color started as rattle can Camoflage Grey, but I didn't like it.

    Then airbrush Testor's Light Grey; didn't like it either.

    So I started combining Camo Grey, Light Grey, and White to get the color you see here, though the pic sucks...
     
  4. Skyler101

    Skyler101 Sr Member

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    I like it. :)
    As a base, it is definitly a great starting place.

    Now I have a question.. Are you going to place mounting points in your model so it can be mounted for filming, and if so, please post some pic :)

    -Skyler101
     
  5. Watson

    Watson Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Hahahaha your thread is now MINE..... J/K at least someone was posting in my thread. Between selling my house and finishing a commission piece, my model time has been very low lately. Yours is looking good, keep the pics coming.

    If you get a chance to snap a shot of your paint color in better lighting I would appreciate it. I want to compare yours to mine :)

    Again looking good

    Greg


     
  6. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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    Interestingly, as far as I know, the filming models had 2 mount point possibilities. The majority of them were mounted on a rod that went into the nose from underneath just in front of the cockpit. There was at least one that was mounted from the rear. This one, interestingly, has a different tail end with different detail then the one we all normally see and an end cap to cover the hole when it was shot on the ground. (I believe this one was the only version that had landing gear as an option.) I was thinking of someday doing one with a tail mount and the different details...I have all the source to do it.

    Back on topic....viper looks good. I think the camo grey is too brown though...as a base though its sharp.
     
  7. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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    Oh...yeah...Another neat note...there were 6 different pilots (painted differently) used for the Vipers...at least one wasnt 1 was from the Harrier and was from a race car. Not sure on the others..but I have a picture somewhere.
     
  8. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    The "ports" for the mounting points will be simulated. I'm not gonna drill gaping holes into thisthing. ;)
     
  9. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    Great info.

    The ref pics I have (which are NOT uncommon) show the port just forward of the cockpit, and one model with a port on the left engine intake. I believe I posted a pic of that one in Jade's thread...

    At this point, I'm considering an amalgam of the three filming models I have pics of...
     
  10. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    Again -- fantastic info. Thanks.

    Wasn't the Harrier used for the X-Wing too, or was it just the Phantom? Wonder if those 1/24 X-Wing builders have a cast of a pilot laying around...?

     
  11. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    By your command. And thanks for the comps.
     
  12. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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    Looking good.

    Ill dig out the picture of the pilots...I can't remember what I ID'ed... (my mind fades quickly. Sorry)
     
  13. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    Thanks Jesse. Time to dirty her down... Take her from the "fresh off the Viper factory line" look to the "riden hard and put away wet" appearance...

    Or in other words -- the fun part. ;)

     
  14. phase pistol

    phase pistol Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Sweet. :D

    Now leave it out back for a few months so the "natural weathering process" can take place... B)

    - k
     
  15. Skyler101

    Skyler101 Sr Member

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    Well, if anyone is willing to shoot over some pics of the mounts and their placments, "I" will be willing to dtill holes into my Viper kit...

    (Sorry Jestefarean, but I want to mount my model for photography purposes.)

    -Skyler101
     
  16. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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    Nothing to be sorry about. :) There is a photo of the forward mount point model on the CD (I believe) Ill pull that off and upload it later after work (unless someone else can get to it) I don't know if I have a picture of the rear mount point model...but I think I do, and I have a cast of the back end from that version.
     
  17. Lynn TXP 0369

    Lynn TXP 0369 Sr Member

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    Who about a real one?
    I've got two Harriers here I have pilots for I won't use probably.

    Lynn
     
  18. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    That would be awesome.
     
  19. spcglider@aol.com

    spcglider@aol.com Sr Member

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    Yup...that sweet old bird is still just as smokin' hot as she was in the late 1970's. Not a single "update" out there looks nearly as good.

    Good work there fella. Treat her well.

    -Gordon
     
  20. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    A bit of weathering today...

    Some streaking with Navy Aggressor Gray. Though these areas are not completly finished yet. Need to add a couple more grays and browns... And the cans need a final Aggressor Gray wash...
     
  21. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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    Thats interesting. MIM used the wrong side details on the right and left side. The right side is glaringly wrong...the left side is also, but closer. Id never seen it up close.

    (no offemse...your buildup looks good, and it will look great done, I'm just stunned they went to the trouble to clean it up, but didn't use the right source material )
     
  22. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    How does it differ?
     
  23. Skyler101

    Skyler101 Sr Member

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    I totally agree with Space-glider on this one. The original Viper is still my favorite single seater space attack vehicle, with the design of the snow-speeder coming in a close second...

    She has some great lines to her. I cant wait to start working on mine...

    -Skyler101
     
  24. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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    Easiest way to tell is look at the picture of this kit. Look at the mid right side detail. There are rivets across the top, a space in the middle, and then a 1/2 circle detail below. The right side is different then the left...which has the gear and two semi-circles. The MIM kit has the same detail on both sides. By the look of it they simply recast the detail from one side and placed it upside down on the other.

    Proper right side:
    http://home.comcast.net/~emyers20/RCN/viperpics/vipers2.jpg

    Comparison MIM
    http://www.rpf.invisionzone.com/uploads/po...-1120789532.jpg


    Id have to look at it up close, but there appear to be differences in the left side back detail as well. I think they used a casting or incorrect kit pieces to recover it.

    Its long been assumed that nearly all the studio Viper models out there originate from the Icons patterns. This is based on some small inaccuracies in the Icons that have carried through all the other kits. One example is there is an intake detail on the originals that is not on the Icons, nor have I ever seen it on any other kit out there. Seeing the left side detail inverted on the right side makes me that much more positive that the MIM casting is simply a recast from the Icons pattern. (Why you ask? ) Well, the right side detail on the Icons pattern was messed up. I replaced it on the masters with the studio accurate part, but it was damaged long before I got it. Ive looked at 3 other studio Vipers I owned before the masters, and all have damaged right side details. (exactly like the Icons patterns) This includes an early MIM casting and a casting with a completely different fuselage configuration. So, now I see the new MIM redone piece and from the looks of it they fixed their problem simply by casting and inverting the left side detail to fix the right side. Ingenious, but inaccurate.

    I don't mean to be nitpicky...99.99999999% of the people who see it when done will marvel at it and not notice the difference. Your buildup is going to be awesome, and I'm eagerly awaiting more updates. The Viper is a truly wonderful ship. I'm just suprised to see that they didn't fix this right.
     
  25. Tordoc

    Tordoc Well-Known Member

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    I was wondering about that. Can you be sure that that is the way the original was cast, or is it possible that the detail 'fell off' and was lost and MIM just replaced the lost detail? I was debating whether or no to replace it on my build up. There are no good pictures of the port side of the original for comparison... at least none I am aware of.
     
  26. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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    Im sure. I have some good pics of both sides, and I have a casting off an original to reference. The detail is actually significantly different. The gears and middle round pieces are not the only differences.

    Ill send myself a reminder to post some reference tonight.
     
  27. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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  28. Tordoc

    Tordoc Well-Known Member

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    I am familiar with those photos and to me it is obvious that the MR Viper was cast from that miniature, but is the other 'hero' model with the open cockpit and pilot different on both sides? That is the one I'm trying to reproduce.
     
  29. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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    Im sure there are folks more knowledgeable then me so please jump in...

    But...from what I know ....there were several "hero" Vipers. While I have tried, I only have limited photo resources of them....that and a lot of screen captures lead me to believe these things:

    1) The hero's, (like the ships in Star Wars) were not identical. There are small differences between them. Based on that, anything is possible.

    2) All the Vipers were built using the same basic molds, and the differences that I note above appear to be small greblie add ons, coloring, or panel lines that were added after. Based on that, I would be suprised if the side or core details changed.

    3) The details (gears, and knobs) are integral to the original detail piece used. They are not seperate. Therefore, someone just didn't decide to use extra or less knobs/gears on one side.

    So...based on that and all the research I did I couldn't find any proof of the afte mid fuselage detail being different between the hero and non-hero Vipers and I couldn't find any pictures of actual props with the right side detail being a duplicate of the left side. Considering that, and the fact that I am positive (or fairly so) that MIM recast the Icons patterns (or a cast from them) and I believe thus it came with the flaws I saw I am fairly comfortable to a high degree of certainty that the detail was not duplicated on the right side upside down. (Ive taken a lot of screen caps too. ) All that being said...Im wrong all the time, and you should do what makes you happy. If you can find information that I'm wrong I'd love to hear it. That aside...if you just like it that way...well thats reason enough to do it the way you want.
     
  30. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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    One other interesting (or interesting to me) note. The 1:1 mockup has a simplified version of the detail as shown on the left side...and the identical detail on the right side. (identical...so not the left upside down on the right, and not the detail I'm referring too on the right...but the same detail as on the left) There are several other detail descrepencies on the 1:1 as well.
     
  31. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    Jesse, the detail inside the left side intake -- do you have better pics of it? I'd noticed it too, and wondere just what I was looking at...
     
  32. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    Incidentally, these are the three models/pics I'm using as primary reference material:
     
  33. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    I posted the pics fairly small, but those familiar with these shots will know the bottom two Vipers are different models with varying finishes.

    And I believe all three to be three individual models. AM I correct?

    Does anyone have additional shots (besides the rest of the collection with the blue background)?
     
  34. Tordoc

    Tordoc Well-Known Member

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    I am scribing mine with the extra paneling present on the model on the right. I just think it's the best looking one. I'm just 'making up' additional scribing for the starbord side.
     
  35. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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    The one on the upper right is (I believe) the same one that was on the cover of Newsweek. That shot, BTW, is of a hero set up with the nitrogen bells going left to right so it shows the right side detail...and it confirms that the right side detail is in fact different from the left side and the same as the Icons Masters I have (fixed) I don't have my scanner online right now, so I can't scan it (sorry) and my file server is offline as well so I can't pull it from there...but if someone else has it and can post it youll see. *(sorry ...I am having a pool put in and had to shut down my office while they setup a dedicated circuit for the pool) Ill try and get something over the weekend, but I thought someone else my have the Newsweek pic)

    As for the intake detail...I don't have a picture of it. It's visible on my casting, but barely...Im trying to recreate it ...but havent done it yet.
     
  36. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    (BTW-- The AM wasn't supposed to be all in caps for emphasis or anything -- just a caps key typo.)
     
  37. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    Newsweek cover? I've not heard of that...
     
  38. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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    There was a Newsweek at the end of 1970 that featured Galactica models on the cover. I can probably scan it tomorrow or Sunday.
     
  39. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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    As far as I know, yes. Two are heros, and there are differences between them, so I believe them to be all different.
     
  40. Tordoc

    Tordoc Well-Known Member

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    Please.
     
  41. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    Was the model in the photo shoot with the blue background a "pyro" version (as suggested by the black underneath and blacked-out canopy), and not a "hero"?

    More weathering later today, hopefully more pics.
     
  42. Tordoc

    Tordoc Well-Known Member

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    It is my understanding that no models were destroyed and that all explosions were produced optically. Some did have exhaust.
     
  43. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    Progressing on weathering...
     
  44. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    This shot is a tad out of synch, but shows the current progress in context...
     
  45. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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    I take back what I said before. All 3 of the Vipers pictured are heros...or by that I mean all 3 have pilots. I was mistaken the top left one for something else...but its got a pilot...look close behind the windows and youll see it.
     
  46. Skyler101

    Skyler101 Sr Member

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    PhArchivest...

    Can you run through how you are achiving that type of weathering?

    -Skyler101

     
  47. Jestefarean

    Jestefarean Sr Member

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    Sorry...failed miserably on that one....Ill try and get to it during the week.
     
  48. t2sides

    t2sides Sr Member

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    PH,
    Not sure if you've seen my take on the MIM, but here's a link if you'd like to check it out. I didn't go for quite the extreme weathering as the filming miniatures.

    Yours is looking great.

    I agree, this MIM casting is not the best, but it is a great looking ship, and with patience you can make it look real nice, as you are doing.

    Keep it up.

    -Sean
    http://squaremodels.com/viper.htm
     
  49. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    Its largely just Testor's paints, various shades of gray, thinned and streaked on. I started each streak with a base of Navy Aggressor Gray, then added a touch of Euro 1 gray. I have tiny bits of Rust thrown in, and Ive also used some black pastell chalk rub and smeared on.
     
  50. PHArchivist

    PHArchivist Master Member

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    YES. Definitely saw yor work. I think I came across it on a Yahoo image search. Was VERY impressed. LOVE the work on the tube.

    Nice to have you around these parts and welcome to the RPF.

     

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