Unlimited Run Bookhouse Boys (Twin Peaks) embroidered patch

[SquidMan]

Am I crazy, or does this look like the same thread color as the previous sample? Perhaps there was a misunderstanding, and they only paid attention to the design feedback and ignored the color feedback...

Yeah, the new yellow almost seems like a step backward, it looks even less saturated/red-toned than Sample 2. Maybe it's the lighting again? I don't think so though. Maybe ask for one of the other thread colors you narrowed it down to most recently, one that we initially thought skewed more brown, perhaps? The rest of the patch looks great though!

 

[SquidMan]

Perhaps there was a misunderstanding, and they only paid attention to the design feedback and ignored the color feedback...

Hey Patattack, did they ever clarify about the color feedback? Did they ignore it, or was your chosen thread color used in Sample 3 but turned out to be a bad choice?

 

[Patattack]

Hey Patattack, did they ever clarify about the color feedback? Did they ignore it, or was your chosen thread color used in Sample 3 but turned out to be a bad choice?

Evidently they used 2835 (one of the alternative options, a few shades darker than the one that I suggested) in the latest sample. As a reminder, here's that thread on the far right:



Given how different that looks from the photo of Sample 3, I'm having a hard time determining how to proceed. I think I might reach out to customer service and ask if they can't somehow coordinate a way to ship me all three of the samples that have been produced, so that I can examine the thread colors in person.



If I can't convince them to send me the samples, I have half a mind to just tell them to return to whatever thread they used in Sample 2 and move ahead with production. Of the three samples, I think the yellow on that one looks the closest to what we're looking for (especially if we consider that the original prop reference photo seems to have been taken in warm-tinted light that makes the yellow look more orange). Would anyone be terribly opposed to that?

 

[SquidMan]

Evidently they used 2835 (one of the alternative options, a few shades darker than the one that I suggested) in the latest sample. As a reminder, here's that thread on the far right:

Hmm, that is super strange since I assumed from that image of the thread samples that 2835 is too dark/brown.

I think asking for seeing the samples in person would be a good idea. If they don't agree to that, I do think that Sample 2 is close enough, especially when looking at these (admittedly unscientific) comparisons I made of your photo of Sample 2 and two screenshots from the series, which I color corrected to match the blue and green values of your sample as closely as possible without changing colors separately--in other words, I altered the colors across the board in equal proportion to see what the yellow would look like, similarly to how you'd solve for a variable in an equation. The resulting yellow is fairly close, and it looks like Sample 2's yellow is even a bit more orange which is a good thing when comparing it to the prop reference photo you've been using. Thoughts?

 

[Patattack]

Hmm, that is super strange since I assumed from that image of the thread samples that 2835 is too dark/brown.

I think asking for seeing the samples in person would be a good idea. If they don't agree to that, I do think that Sample 2 is close enough, especially when looking at these (admittedly unscientific) comparisons I made of your photo of Sample 2 and two screenshots from the series, which I color corrected to match the blue and green values of your sample as closely as possible without changing colors separately--in other words, I altered the colors across the board in equal proportion to see what the yellow would look like, similarly to how you'd solve for a variable in an equation. The resulting yellow is fairly close, and it looks like Sample 2's yellow is even a bit more orange which is a good thing when comparing it to the prop reference photo you've been using. Thoughts?

https://i.imgur.com/SLEr57f.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/0rD9PLT.jpg

That is an extremely compelling argument! Your color-corrected photos re-contextualize the patch colors nicely. Honestly it feels unlikely that they can send me the samples, since the communication between the customer service and design and production teams seems limited...but I am now even more confident that the slightly refined design of Sample 3 with the yellow of Sample 2 would be a perfectly satisfying option.

 

[SquidMan]

That is an extremely compelling argument! Your color-corrected photos re-contextualize the patch colors nicely. Honestly it feels unlikely that they can send me the samples, since the communication between the customer service and design and production teams seems limited...but I am now even more confident that the slightly refined design of Sample 3 with the yellow of Sample 2 would be a perfectly satisfying option.

Thank you! Glad to help in any way I can!

Just to reiterate though, my color correction is not fully conclusive since it doesn't account for differences in lighting, luster of the thread used, and a bunch of other variables. It's simply the best I was able to do.

If you were to go ahead and order the Sample 3 design with the Sample 2 yellow color now, would you be receiving all of the ones you are planning to sell and distribute in one shipment, or will you be getting them in smaller waves? The latter may be a helpful way to be able to inspect the colors in person with the possibility of revisions since you'd have not received all of them.

Or maybe I'm being overly cautious and the colors don't need further inspection. Let me know, haha.

 

[Patattack]

Thank you! Glad to help in any way I can!

Just to reiterate though, my color correction is not fully conclusive since it doesn't account for differences in lighting, luster of the thread used, and a bunch of other variables. It's simply the best I was able to do.

If you were to go ahead and order the Sample 3 design with the Sample 2 yellow color now, would you be receiving all of the ones you are planning to sell and distribute in one shipment, or will you be getting them in smaller waves? The latter may be a helpful way to be able to inspect the colors in person with the possibility of revisions since you'd have not received all of them.

Or maybe I'm being overly cautious and the colors don't need further inspection. Let me know, haha.

I'm afraid the whole order would be produced and shipped at once, so I likely wouldn't have the ability to revise after approving the sample. I know that your color-correction might not be 100%, but it does reinforce my growing suspicion that the thread isn't nearly as orange as I had first suspected. Honestly, if the final product looks like Sample 2 (where the thread is mostly yellow, but has a slight orange tint from certain angles) I'll be fairly pleased.

 

[el toro]

Personally I like the yellow orange color uses for sample 1. However, based on squidman's second normalized color comparison, sample 2's yellow seems more accurate. However I'm not sure how to process the first comparison as the normalized red looks more blood orange.

 

[SquidMan]

However I'm not sure how to process the first comparison as the normalized red looks more blood orange.

I think that's due to the lighting and how reflective the thread is. But like I said, these comparisons are definitely imperfect, haha.

 

[Patattack]

Well, the good news is that they are going to ship me the samples for review! I'll post here as soon as I receive them, with my thoughts on the colors, and photos from many different angles/light-sources.

 

[Patattack]

Argh, I spoke too soon. My initial instinct about lack of communication between the service/production/design teams was correct to some extent: I've just been informed that they discarded the first two samples, and they only have one remaining. Is it still worth paying the extra fee to receive a single sample to review IRL? (They charged a handling fee of $35 initially, but I'd push back on that since I wouldn't be getting the three samples I thought I was paying for.) Or should I just tell them to go ahead with the Sample 2 thread color?

 

[SquidMan]

Argh, I spoke too soon. My initial instinct about lack of communication between the service/production/design teams was correct to some extent: I've just been informed that they discarded the first two samples, and they only have one remaining. Is it still worth paying the extra fee to receive a single sample to review IRL? (They charged a handling fee of $35 initially, but I'd push back on that since I wouldn't be getting the three samples I thought I was paying for.) Or should I just tell them to go ahead with the Sample 2 thread color?

Dang, that's unfortunate. I'd say it's up to you, whether or not you feel totally confident that Sample 2 fits the bill. I think there's a decent chance that it does, but you may want to check first. Maybe see if they'll lower the price since you won't be getting all three samples?

 

[Patattack]

Dang, that's unfortunate. I'd say it's up to you, whether or not you feel totally confident that Sample 2 fits the bill. I think there's a decent chance that it does, but you may want to check first. Maybe see if they'll lower the price since you won't be getting all three samples?

Sadly they are unable to lower the price, because they claim it's just a flat shipping cost (rather than, say, a "processing fee" for their trouble). I'm pretty annoyed that they accepted my payment before confirming whether or not they'd even be able to deliver what I thought I was paying for. That said, with all of these nitpicky back-and-forths and multiple samples for an order of just 100 patches, I feel like I probably owe them a bit of extra money anyway. And if most of the interested parties I've spoken to end up buying their patches, an extra $35 certainly won't put me in the red.

So as much as this exchange galls me on principle, I've asked them to send along the one sample that they still have--just for peace of mind. If it turns out that the latest yellow looks great, I'll ask them to proceed. If the yellow doesn't look quite right, I'll probably ask them to switch back to the yellow from Sample 2 instead of dragging this out for additional samples. Like I said, the more I consider lighting and whatnot, the more I think the photo of Sample 2 looks pretty darn close.

 

[SquidMan]

Sadly they are unable to lower the price, because they claim it's just a flat shipping cost (rather than, say, a "processing fee" for their trouble). I'm pretty annoyed that they accepted my payment before confirming whether or not they'd even be able to deliver what I thought I was paying for. That said, with all of these nitpicky back-and-forths and multiple samples for an order of just 100 patches, I feel like I probably owe them a bit of extra money anyway. And if most of the interested parties I've spoken to end up buying their patches, an extra $35 certainly won't put me in the red.

So as much as this exchange galls me on principle, I've asked them to send along the one sample that they still have--just for peace of mind. If it turns out that the latest yellow looks great, I'll ask them to proceed. If the yellow doesn't look quite right, I'll probably ask them to switch back to the yellow from Sample 2 instead of dragging this out for additional samples. Like I said, the more I consider lighting and whatnot, the more I think the photo of Sample 2 looks pretty darn close.

Oh they'll be sending Sample 3? Yeah let us know what you think of it in hand, but I definitely feel like Sample 2 is more accurate.

 

[Patattack]

Alright! Sample 3 arrived today, and I have to say...I'm pretty damn happy with it overall. I took photos of it under several different types of light, and I'll go into more detail on my thoughts after the pics, so as not to influence your opinions.

White LED bulb


Direct sun (I took two pics here to illustrate how the color changes based on the viewing angle, which is intensified in the brighter light)


Indirect sun


Even-less-direct sun + incandescent light (specifically attempted to adjust the white balance based on my skin tone)


Warm incandescent light (after the sun went down)


My thoughts:
- The embroidery looks amazing to my eyes. I can identify a couple of spots that we had mentioned in our feedback, but seeing it in person at its actual size--rather than blown up to the full height of my monitor--they're definitely negligible.
- I'm a lot happier with the yellow thread than I thought I'd be. A bit less orange than we were leaning originally, but I think this is quite accurate to what the prop would probably realistically look like in proper white light. We could ask them to switch back to the Sample 2 yellow, but now that I've seen this one in person, I'd be perfectly satisfied with it.
- When viewed head-on, the blue is nearly perfect. However, it's got a borderline-metallic sheen that causes it to shift colors pretty dramatically as it moves. I suspect that's not accurate to the prop...but I don't think I'd call it a dealbreaker.
- Somewhat depending on the lighting, the tree trunk comes across more like a burgundy than a brown. The perfectionist in me is slightly bothered by that, but it's so close to brown (and such a tiny portion of the patch) that I don't think it really impacts the overall look.


I don't know if the existing minor issues are worth the hassle of going back to the drawing board and having more samples made. How do y'all feel?

 

[Patattack]

Oh, and I took a short video to try and show how the color shifts from different angles:

 

[SquidMan]

Alright! Sample 3 arrived today, and I have to say...I'm pretty damn happy with it overall. I took photos of it under several different types of light, and I'll go into more detail on my thoughts after the pics, so as not to influence your opinions.

Well first off, that is a gorgeous patch. Beautiful embroidery. Thank you for all the great pics and the video!

To respond to your concerns:

The tree trunk looks sufficiently brown to me when compared to series screenshots and the photo of the crewmembers' patch. The blue looks great and the metallic sheen is beautiful, and I think the color shift is actually quite accurate even though the intensity of the sheen may be higher on your patch, but that's totally fine with me. Looks great with it.

The yellow looks good here, and I really can't tell the difference between this yellow and the Sample 2 yellow from the photos, to be honest. I do think it's clearly less orange than the crewmember's patch but it honestly looks good compared to screenshots of the prop from the series. Make of that what you will. I would be okay with this yellow, I think. Unless you want to switch to Sample 2's yellow which looks good too.

My only real concern is this: Does the green look sufficiently green to you in person? In most of these photos, it looks like it might be verging on teal (or maybe that's just my display). Either way, let us know.

Overall, looks amazing!

P.S. Awesome rugs!! haha

 

[Patattack]

Hmm...I can see what you're saying about the green. It looks green enough in person--with only a slight "cool" tint that gives it that teal look in certain lighting--but I could see an argument for potentially selecting a more "warm" green.

357 C is ostensibly the thread they used; perhaps something like 2427-C could be good? I could at least ask what green thread options are available to them.


Same for the brown...490 C is what they used, but maybe it would be worth asking them to try 732 C (or something like it)?

 

[SquidMan]

Hmm...I can see what you're saying about the green. It looks green enough in person--with only a slight "cool" tint that gives it that teal look in certain lighting--but I could see an argument for potentially selecting a more "warm" green.

357 C is ostensibly the thread they used; perhaps something like 2427-C could be good? I could at least ask what green thread options are available to them.
View attachment 831214View attachment 831218

Same for the brown...490 C is what they used, but maybe it would be worth asking them to try 732 C (or something like it)?
View attachment 831216View attachment 831219

That new green looks good to me, but as always picking the exact right color is a long, time consuming process so I would understand if you wanted to keep the current green if it looks accurate in person. Up to your discretion. If you were to change it, 2427 C looks like it could fit the bill, but again might need in-person inspection to verify.

The brown of the tree trunk honestly looks good to me, does it look very maroon in person? It looks just about right in your photos, to my eyes (and monitor).

 

[Patattack]

After a lot of deliberation, I've approved the latest sample to proceed with production! Ultimately, while I could spend more time going back-and-forth with the designer to bring the green and brown ever-so-slightly more in line with the desired color palette...it's probably not worth the trouble. I'm not willing pay another $35 to have another sample shipped--and since I was 95% satisfied with sample 3 in person, why take the risk of switching to new colors that we'd have to rely on their photos to convey accurately?

Anyway, I'll post again once patches have arrived and I'm ready to start taking payments--I'll probably reach out directly to anyone who put their contact info into the Google survey. According to the embroiderer's schedule calculator, my order should be shipped between 3-4 weeks from now.

OH! And just for fun, here's a comparison of an old Bookhouse Boys patch I found online a few years ago, next to the latest sample from this run. My girlfriend--also a huge Twin Peaks fan--said that the old one looks like "a cartoon version for kids" compared to the new one, which I'll take as a big compliment.