What If Star Wars?

[Zombie_61]

...What was it about Star Wars 1977 that made it so much better than anything that went before or came after it? Why couldn't George pull it off a sacond time? What changed?

With regards to the PT designs, it could simply come down to different artists working on each set of trilogies--20 years later, a new group of young individuals with a different mindset, a different aesthetic, and different influences, all trying to make names for themselves in the industry; presumably, working for George Lucas, they're going to "bring their A game", and that would extend to their designs.

Also, by the time the PT went into production (and to a certain extent after Star Wars) Lucas had gone from being "that little guy with the weird ideas" to "George Lucas, the institution". After watching the featurettes included on the PT dvds, I get the feeling Lucas had surrounded himself (either intentionally or unintentionally) with people who were willing to do almost anything to make George happy, so there's a bit of an "Emperor's new clothes" phenomenon happening--nobody in his inner circle was able to say "no" to George Lucas regardless of how "out there" his ideas were. And I can understand this to a degree; I mean, how do you tell the guy who created Star Wars he's getting it wrong, especially when there's no clear-cut template to work from? I guess what I'm trying to say is that on the first film it was much more of a collaborative effort, and this seems to have lessened with each subsequent film.

 

[Rogue]

I mean, how do you tell the guy who created Star Wars he's getting it wrong, especially when there's no clear-cut template to work from?

To be honest he wasn't working without a template. He had three films under his belt to see what works and what doesn't. Sit him down with the non-CGI Jabba scene, then the Phantom Menace Jabba scenes. The CGI just... sucks the life out of the character.

 

[SeanB13]

A few parts from an interview with Doug Chiang that I found interesting and very insightful.

What kinds of thoughts got you started on the art of Episode I?


When I first started, I didn't know whether George wanted more of the same designs that we had seen in the earlier trilogy--the kind of work that Ralph McQuarrie and Joe Johnston had produced. So I thought a lot about trying to identify the exact look of Star Wars in Ralph's work. I wanted to identify his visual style and the qualities that made it distinctly Star Wars, and incorporate that into my own work.

But Episode I is yours! What kinds of influences can we expect to see in your Episode I designs?


George Lucas influences, to start out with! After I had spent all that time studying the Star Wars style, George came in and told me he wanted something as fresh as Ralph's original work, but different. We've been saturated in designs derived from the original Star Wars look for twenty years now, and George wanted something really new. He said, "push the envelope, discover new things." It was a surprise, but really exciting. He said, "I want chrome, sleek shapes, Art Nouveau, and Art Moderne." That's when I realized that this was going to be something new and not just a rework of the earlier material.

What's your toughest challenge in working up these new designs?

There is a fine line between a handcrafted look and a look that is "too sci-fi," or "too design-ey." I think that you get that "too sci-fi" look when you use present-day aesthetics and try to project it forward into a foreign world without the history to back it up. As a result these designs date very quickly. To get around this, I've found that you should avoid making things up without anchoring them to a strong foundation based in world history.

 

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[Howard]

No disrespect to a brilliant artist such as Doug, (and I don't know that he's responsible for it) but the Jedi Starfighter design contradicts everything said in that interview.
It has to be the worst design ever to come out of SW.

 

[Zykotec]

I actually like the Jedi starfighter, if that is the one I posted just earlier. It's a perfect mix of a Tie and an X-wing

 

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[Darth Lars]

Doug Chiang did not work on Episode III.

The Episode III Jedi Starfighter is awful, no matter how you look at it.

1. It is a hodgepodge of the Episode II Jedi Starfighter and the TIE fighter.
The Jedi Starfighter in Episode II was sleek, elegant, high-tech, for the elite.
The TIE fighter is cheap, cheap, cheap in all its aspects. Pilot's lives are cheap. No shields. No curved windows. Raw numbers and raw power to overwhelm the enemy.
Where do you see any influence of the X-wing?

2. The Astromech's feet are dangling below the wing. Seriously ...

3. The pilot can see up, but not forwards or to the sides. There is a large beam right in front of his eyes. The segmented windows in front of him make no sense. If they can manufacture large curved windows for the top and sides, why not at the front? Why not give the pilot some visibility!?

4. Side "flaps" ... They serve no function. They are not flying in atmosphere, so they do not need flaps. They are too small to be used as solar panels. They block the pilot's view to the sides.

 

[Zykotec]

1. It is a hodgepodge of the Episode II Jedi Starfighter and the TIE fighter.
The Jedi Starfighter in Episode II was sleek, elegant, high-tech, for the elite.
The TIE fighter is cheap, cheap, cheap in all its aspects. Pilot's lives are cheap. No shields. No curved windows. Raw numbers and raw power to overwhelm the enemy.
Where do you see any influence of the X-wing?

I just think it looks more worn like in the Ot, and the colour scheme resembles the Ot X-wings, + it's a really back heavy pointed design viewed from the side, just like the X-wing and an episode 2 Starfighter (which imo just looks like a mini ISD, it really does)

2. The Astromech's feet are dangling below the wing. Seriously ...

3. The pilot can see up, but not forwards or to the sides. There is a large beam right in front of his eyes. The segmented windows in front of him make no sense. If they can manufacture large curved windows for the top and sides, why not at the front? Why not give the pilot some visibility!?

4. Side "flaps" ... They serve no function. They are not flying in atmosphere, so they do not need flaps. They are too small to be used as solar panels. They block the pilot's view to the sides.

I admit it's not the most functional/practical of designs, but It's clearly a 'prequel' to the Ties designwise . How is the side view in a Tie fighter (not to mention the cockpit looks influenced by the MF.)
The flaps on the sides could work as shielding too, or just blinds, too keep the pilots from looking in the 'wrong' direction. Actually, most of the time while watching Rots I felt like the silly childish cgi'd Pt was slowly evolving more and more into the Ot style

 

[Scott D]

As far as the PT Mecha goes, the Podracers were pretty cool, especially the different sounds of their engines, they also had certain elements from the OT, but overall, IMO, they just didn't work.

Has the fuel supply for those huge jet engines ever been explained? Where was it stored?

 

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[saeltmarae2k]

Nope...not for me. The charm of the old movies is what sold them. Something is certainly lost in the prequels, IMO.

 

[Wes R]

I always wondered what things would be like if the movies had been a flop.

 

[clancampbell]

Doug Chiang did not work on Episode III.

The Episode III Jedi Starfighter is awful, no matter how you look at it.

1. It is a hodgepodge of the Episode II Jedi Starfighter and the TIE fighter.
The Jedi Starfighter in Episode II was sleek, elegant, high-tech, for the elite.
The TIE fighter is cheap, cheap, cheap in all its aspects. Pilot's lives are cheap. No shields. No curved windows. Raw numbers and raw power to overwhelm the enemy.
Where do you see any influence of the X-wing?

2. The Astromech's feet are dangling below the wing. Seriously ...

3. The pilot can see up, but not forwards or to the sides. There is a large beam right in front of his eyes. The segmented windows in front of him make no sense. If they can manufacture large curved windows for the top and sides, why not at the front? Why not give the pilot some visibility!?

4. Side "flaps" ... They serve no function. They are not flying in atmosphere, so they do not need flaps. They are too small to be used as solar panels. They block the pilot's view to the sides.

I agree.
This design always reminded me of some sort of fairground ride spaceships. Too small, too flimsy and the flippy up side wings are just pointless....unless they are there to prevent the pilot from seeing anything that might alarm him....
The E2 fighters are SUPPOSED to echo stardestroyers....Lucas said this in the documentary.....so what the inspiration is for the E3 ones...i don't know.
Rich

 

[Jeyl]

I never liked the Jedi Starfighter in Episode III. It was way too small for the capabilities it was depicted with. It was too fast, to heavily armed and had way too many useless things like folding wings that don't look to affect performance in the slightest. At least when the X-Wings and B-Wings put their S-Foils into Attack Position, you can tell that it would affect the weapons.

Also,

 

[clancampbell]

I never liked the Jedi Starfighter in Episode III. It was way too small for the capabilities it was depicted with. It was too fast, to heavily armed and had way too many useless things like folding wings that don't look to affect performance in the slightest. At least when the X-Wings and B-Wings put their S-Foils into Attack Position, you can tell that it would affect the weapons.

Also,

Yeah, those windows....it's like they had the design finished and somebody just remembered they were supposed to have TIE fighter influences...."just stick a TIE Fighter window on the front....."

Job done.....

Rich

 

[Howard]

I totally agree.
Incredibly lazy from a design POV.
The astromech far too exposed and out of scale with the wings.
I would like to have seen a variation of a standard T.I.E.
It's quite obvious this Ep III design evolved from what had come before, rather than the other way around, as it should be.