The Force Awakens AT-AT

Discussion in 'General Modeling' started by TazMan2000, Sep 15, 2015.

  1. TazMan2000

    TazMan2000 Sr Member

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  2. blakeh1

    blakeh1 Sr Member

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    I've seen them before in this picture. I'm not sure what to think of them yet. I need a closer look and some different angles.

    Right now though, I'm not impressed by the new designs of any of the vehicles. I kind of wish they went with new designs instead of trying to just give a face-lift to old ones.

    At the very least, you think regarding the tie fighters, the Tie Advanced and Tie Interceptor would have been closer to the next step in Tie fighter rather than the original ones.

    I guess the ties must be like the A-10 warthogs, everytime they try to take them out of service they keep proving how useful they are
     
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  3. astroboy

    astroboy Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    In all honesty, so much of this has to do with reacting the the prequels. New, cool designs are too risky for them. I realize that this is premature, but it seems like this film is a reflection of the 1977 star wars and not the franchise as a whole. Nothing here feels as if it's part of an evolution.

    You are right, of course. The interceptors do feel like a logical progression from the original TIEs
     
  4. TazMan2000

    TazMan2000 Sr Member

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    I have to agree with you guys. The designs are not inspiring. The troop transports look like some WW2 German minisub. The X-Wing is probably the only thing that I really like. The AT-AT does have some promise.

    TazMan2000
     
  5. robn1

    robn1 Master Member

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    It looks like some of the early TESB designs, with a gun turret on the belly. It looks like maybe the flexible neck retracts into the body when parked.
    [​IMG]
     
  6. Zuiun

    Zuiun Sr Member

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    I guess I'm looking at it differently.

    In the prequels, there was supposed to be, what, 1000 years of prosperity and peace or some such? So sure, they got to the point where aesthetics played a huge part of vehicle design. We started to see a slide into utilitarian by the end of the prequels and it was full on in effect by the OT. The Empire was spending money on quantity and size over appearances, meanwhile the Rebels were making the best they could out of whatever.

    Keep in mind, in the span of about 18 years (Revenge of the Sith to New Hope) you had an entire Republic fall and replaced by the Empire. The OT only takes place over the span of a few years at best. And now the new films are 30 years later. So 50 years to see one 1000 year old galactic government fall, be replaced, THAT government fall, and now attempt to replace itself?

    I think I'm ok with not a whole lot of innovative ship design. In fact, it would seem strange to me if things WERE radically different. I'd be asking myself how the scattered Empire managed to pull that off.
     
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  7. Dobber

    Dobber Well-Known Member

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    I like that, good post!

    Chris
     
  8. Sluis Van Shipyards

    Sluis Van Shipyards Master Member

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    I'm kind of with you on that. I like the X-Wing and the Star Destroyer, but some of the other designs are really uninspiring. The landing craft in particular just looks, as I said in the Entertainment thread, like the designers were told to design something like a Higgins boat, so that's exactly what they spat out. I'm also disappointed that they used the same old TIEs and not had something really advanced like the EU TIE Avenger or Defender. I'll wait to see the movie first, but those really bug me.



    I said in the spoilers thread that if this AT-AT (if that's what it is) doesn't have a belly turret and/or something on the legs to cut wires then it won't make sense. I'm wondering if this is artillery since it seems to have a way larger gun on it.
     
  9. modelcitizen

    modelcitizen Sr Member

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  10. astroboy

    astroboy Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I hope we still get a couple old designs in this film. Not just destroyed, but still in use. Maybe appropriated by pirates or something

    Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk
     
  11. Dart

    Dart Well-Known Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Agreed. If you look at the Tie fighters, they've gone through more of an evolution than a revolution. The panels look different. They're beefier where the "wings" meet the body. They've got a turret at the bottom which could mean they've got 1 pilot and 1 gunner. They're more like a new mark than a brand new fighter.

    Also, this is only the first of many new movies. Let's remember that they didn't introduce the Tie Interceptor until ROTJ and the Bomber until ESB. Maybe they're just spreading things out? They kinda went nuts by introducing all these different troopers (regular stormies, flamers, snowies, sandies, pilots, whatever else is in the photo).

    Not a huge fan of the troop ships but I can see the logic behind them. They're not fancy and they're probably pretty disposable so why make them anything but utilitarian.

    Maybe they'll dust off the Tie Defender in another flick? I'd love to see that one on the big screen.

    As far as the new AT-AT, I have no issue with it. It looks like an evolution and kinda makes sense. It seems like most of the equipment is evolutionary than completely different, and I like that. Makes it seem a bit more realistic than having everything all brand new and completely different.
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2015
  12. TazMan2000

    TazMan2000 Sr Member

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    I disagree with the TIE fighters. It looks like an Original TIE model was put on someone's desk and a child glued bits and pieces from other models.
    Much like this;

    image.jpg

    TazMan2000
     
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  13. blakeh1

    blakeh1 Sr Member

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    yeah, they didn't even get what was supposed to be the engines correct. The put what looks like two miniature hatch bits in their place. I think they thought the thing in the middle was the engines, so they made it smaller and put them on each side where the original engine thrusters (the red dots) were

    csm_06693__D_02_FIRST_ORDER_SPECIAL_FORCES_TIE_FIGHTER_ca36fed285.jpg tieball2.jpg
     
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  14. astroboy

    astroboy Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Oddly, I kinda like the back of that. You have to admit, they never really thought out the engines on the old TIE's. Those little dots look a bit underpowered
     
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  15. Vacformedhero

    Vacformedhero Sr Member

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    I'd say its continuity , remember the backlash from the older fans at the look of the prequels , being too clean
    id say it's to make us feel warm and fuzzy before the designers are given carte Blanche to create what they want for the next 2
    Passing the batten
    i am disappointed that a lot of the empire ships didn't get meatier , but image seeing all the ships bar the falcon looking new .......may not sit right, also I take it there is a lot of instability in the galaxy still so maybe things haven't moved on far .....only 3 months
     
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  16. Wes R

    Wes R Legendary Member

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    You'd think that both sides would have made advances in the last 30 years. I mean I know in the real world we have 40 year old aircraft still in service but we also have a ton of new stuff. Unless they have newer stuff out there they're not releasing images of.
     
  17. blakeh1

    blakeh1 Sr Member

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    I don't mind the beefed up engines, but look close at the nozzles. It like the just miniaturized the back hatch part so they don't really look like engine nozzles to me
     
  18. Jaitea

    Jaitea Master Member

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  19. Wolfsburg

    Wolfsburg Sr Member

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    There are two different types of TFA TIEs seen so far. You guys seem to be talking about the so-called "spec ops" TIE. Most of them, as seen in the trailers, are just the normal OT-style TIEs, painted black.
     
  20. blakeh1

    blakeh1 Sr Member

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    From what I understood, the top hatch was used more like an escape hatch while the rear was generally the main hatch.

    Of course that doesn't work for the Tie Advanced. The top hatch is the only way in there
     
  21. SGK

    SGK Member

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    No, the TFA model is different, imagine the spec ops model but without the wheel-like protrusion on around the solar panel roots.
    ---
    IIRC the Tie Advanced sported the same rear window during the cockpit interior scenes, continuity error?
     
  22. blakeh1

    blakeh1 Sr Member

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    Here is the regular "first order" tie. I believe this is a one seater
    http://starwarscollector.de/wp-cont...ai-First-Order-Special-Forces-TIE-Fighter.jpg

    The special ops two is a two seater and also has the additional mounted guns for the gunner. Not sure if it is larger overall

    As far as the Tie Advanced, its a continuity error since they used the same set for both. It was later retconned as some kind of 'transparent" steel view screen
     
  23. Wolfsburg

    Wolfsburg Sr Member

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    Are there any more pics of the regular TFA TIE fighter? I'm not seeing where it's different than the OT TIE fighter, besides the color.
     
  24. Dobber

    Dobber Well-Known Member

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    From what I can see on Bandai's site so far:
    different detailing around the Cockpit Ball...less greeblie
    different detailing and structure difference on the solar panel pylons.
    new detail on the attachment point to the Solar panels.
    new blasters
    antenna in the same location as the Special Forces TIE just smaller

    compair the picture above with the OT TIE model here: http://bandai-hobby.net/sw/products/mc/mc04.html and you'll start to see the differences.
    the have a very similar silhouette but are actually quite different in the details. Kind of like the difference between the legacy F/A-18C Hornet and the F/A-18E SuperHornet.

    Chris
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2015
  25. Wolfsburg

    Wolfsburg Sr Member

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    I'm just not seeing that. The spec ops TIE is certainly different, with the details you describe, but it sounds like there is some confusion here. Maybe I'm the one that's confused.
     
  26. Dobber

    Dobber Well-Known Member

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    I'm definately not talking about the Special Forces Tie with the big COGs on the ends of the pylons.

    Chris
     
  27. SGK

    SGK Member

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    While the AT-AT thread is currently a TIE fighter discussion, I believe the details featuring prominently on the sides of the cockpit ball are air intakes, that and the new engines suggest these new TIEs have been optimized for atmospheric flight.
    They could have made it look more aerodynamic, however.
     
  28. Wolfsburg

    Wolfsburg Sr Member

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    Well, if anyone has some nice pics showing these changes, I'd love to see them. I am now seeing what might be reinforcements where the pylons join the ball, but I'm not seeing any intakes.
     
  29. Vaderios

    Vaderios Active Member

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    There was a fan concept art/illustration that shows a similar design with the film.
    Звездные-Войны-&#.jpeg
    -Angel
     
  30. Swatcat

    Swatcat New Member

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    I disagree with you on this, this film is meant to be after the original trilogy, therefore, why would the vehicles suddenly and radically change after such a short period?

     
  31. jkno

    jkno Master Member

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    I'm curious how the belly guns on the TFA TIE works, because due to the large wings you can only shoot front and back, no lateral.
     
  32. Wolfsburg

    Wolfsburg Sr Member

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    I agree. It wouldn't make any sense at all for things to look radically different. An evolution or natural progression makes more sense.
     
  33. madmikeee

    madmikeee Sr Member

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    Actually it makes perfect sense. One way to make science, research and development make a giant leap forward is war. War FORCES one to make startling leaps forward to have the best, biggest, meanest and most effective weaponry. WW1 they were using bi-planes and trench warfare, WWII was only 30 years later and modern warfare was born. There was the development of tanks, jet engines, missles and finally the mother of them all Nuclear power. We jumped 100 years in technology in 30 just so we could find a way to kill our fellow man more efficiently.
     
  34. Dart

    Dart Well-Known Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    True, but you're comparing stuff over a 100 year time period. Think about developments in the past 30-ish years instead. Nothing has really changed too much, save for stuff like the stealth aircraft, but they only represent a tiny fraction of the aircraft in service.

    Same goes for the Star Wars universe. If it's only been 30-40 years, the changes will be much smaller in scale, more like refinements than something brand spankin' new.

    It's like saying that all military ships should have rail guns on them by now, know what I mean?
     
  35. Wolfsburg

    Wolfsburg Sr Member

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    Nah. War does advance things but as far as we know, full on war has not been raging for the last 30 years in the GFFA. Even in modern times, things have not changed that dramatically in 30 years. The A-10 Warthog of the 70s is not significantly different than the A-10 Warthog of 2015, minus perhaps some avionics and weapons packages.
     
  36. astroboy

    astroboy Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    But there are also newer designs in existence.

    Which is why there should also be old school vehicles being used in this film...as well as newer sleeker models
     
  37. Wolfsburg

    Wolfsburg Sr Member

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    Sure! For all we know, there could be.
     
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  38. madmikeee

    madmikeee Sr Member

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    .
    No I am not, the difference between WWI-WWII is only about 30 Years, We have missles now that can target a toilet in a house 5k miles away.

    But fine, Let's take war out of the equation then. Look at the difference in technology from 1990 to 2010, hell just look at the difference between the cars from then and what they look like and their capabilities are now. In 1990 I was working on VAX VMS and DEC mainframes with reel to reel magnetic tapes now I have 15 servers in a space 1/5'th the size of that one mainframe. 30-40 years is one HELL of a difference and if you think otherwise you are just not paying attention.
     
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  39. blakeh1

    blakeh1 Sr Member

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    it depends on which 30 year block you look at

    Aircraft shapes sure have changed a lot between 1950 and 1980, but shape wise, have not changed much between 1985 and 2015 (although the technology in them has)

    So I guess I could buy the fact that things might not have changed much, but at the same time, there should be some brand new spacecraft models at some point. They just completely dropped the Tie Advance and Interceptor line? Nobody has come up with some kind of tie variant besides the classic one in 30 years

    The Resistance/Rebels abandoned A-wings, Y-wings and B-wings? They haven't found any other design of use?

    No I think they just stuck with what was considered safe by only using Ties and X-wings that were slightly "modernized".

    As someone else mentioned, most likely to avoid the perceived backlash of the prequel designs compared to the beloved OT designs

    I guess it can't be Star Wars unless you have some variant of Lightsabers, Tie Fighters and X-wings.
     
  40. Gnar Gnar Jinn

    Gnar Gnar Jinn Active Member

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    lets not forget about the f-16... how many revisions did it go through? (those revisions also featured noticeable changes to the outward appearance as well) it feels like a million, and it had quite a long service.

    For anyone complaining about new designs, or interested in the backstory for the new designs, read the new books that were released, there are quite a few references to ship technology, and their faults, hinting towards future upgrades... (the AT-AT is specifically mentioned in Lost Stars)
     
  41. rbeach84

    rbeach84 Sr Member

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    I thought it was because the old AT-AT armored neck servos were no longer available due to the suppliers' home world becoming part of the "Rebellion", forcing a redesign of the 'head' module.

    ;^P

    R/ Robert
     
  42. batguy

    batguy Sr Member

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    The development pace of technology always slows down as it gets farther along. The lowest-hanging fruit pays off the biggest.

    Look at how cars or airplanes changed from 1905-1920: HUGE development. But the changes from 2000-2015 were practically nothing in comparison.

    Moore's law says computing power doubles every 18 months or something like that. It has worked for a while now, but won't work that way forever. Eventually we will be surprised to discover it slowing down & leveling off.



    The stuff in the Star Wars OT all seems pretty "mature tech" to me. I wouldn't be surprised if the changes over the next 30 years were minor.
     
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  43. Gnar Gnar Jinn

    Gnar Gnar Jinn Active Member

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    ^This^
     
  44. darthviper107

    darthviper107 Well-Known Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Also consider how much things changed from the PT to the OT, like the AT-AT vs the AT-TE
     
  45. Hunk a Junk

    Hunk a Junk Sr Member

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    I suspect the tech in TFA is designed to evolve juuuuuuuuuust enough to make 40plus year-old fanboys get juicy underwear over seeing X-Wings!!!! and Walkers!!!! and TIE fighters!!!! and DUDE, it's the Millennium Falcon!!!!!

    So there's your design theory right there.
     
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  46. astroboy

    astroboy Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I would say that it isn't for the fan boy at all. Fan boys want a very well thought out design that fits within the organic evolution of this galaxy.

    This is for the generalist who loves the big bang theory.

    Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk
     
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  47. Gnar Gnar Jinn

    Gnar Gnar Jinn Active Member

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    I would say this is for both the fanboys (and girls) and the general public... gives some believable evolution to old classics...

    No matter what it makes sense for the evolution, and if you've read lost stars, aftermath, or luke, han and leah stories, they make many mentions for the reasoning of this evolution.

    to add to other references about military tech... m16/ar15 been around for quite some time... has seen some revisions, but still the same basic gun... we have other new guns out there, but SI has not changed
     
  48. newmagrathea

    newmagrathea Sr Member

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    Personally I think the new TIE's look like a photo negative of the old TIE's, not very creative.... but on the other hand military vehicles are not usually focused on aesthetics. A couple of you have mentioned the A-10 Warthog, it looks the same on the outside but the tech inside has been improved and it's been around for a long time (close to 40 years in service). Can you imagine if they redesigned it today, how different would it really be? Civilian aesthetics evolve quite rapidly, but if this is to be a war ravaged galaxy that evolution may have slowed.
     
  49. Gnar Gnar Jinn

    Gnar Gnar Jinn Active Member

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    Exactly! There are quite a few mentions of issues with Tie tech in the new novels, hinting towards internal upgrades that may happen in the Force Awakens era.
     
  50. astroboy

    astroboy Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    While we're on the subject of AT-AT's, I really want a 3 3/4" scale playset of Rey's AT-AT house. How cool would that be?
     

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