Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker (Pre-release)

[PantheraGem]

I just think anyone expecting a delve into the philosophy of the Force is setting themselves up for disappointment. There isn't enough time for that.

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

It doesn’t need deep detailed discussion. It just needs events which we can formulate conclusions.

 

[ConvergencePro]

Didn't Gary Kurtz have far more to do with the idea and development of The Force in the OT than George ever did? I always remember reading how he adapted his own religious thoughts into what he thought The Force would be and that's what we see on film with Yoda's explanation and what not, and George has just kinda sorta run with that over the years making crap up as he goes. He may be the man who thought of the core idea of Star Wars, but I think he gets just a smidge too much credit for the creation in its entirety

 

[Jaitea]

Didn't Gary Kurtz have far more to do with the idea and development of The Force in the OT than George ever did? I always remember reading how he adapted his own religious thoughts into what he thought The Force would be and that's what we see on film with Yoda's explanation and what not, and George has just kinda sorta run with that over the years making crap up as he goes. He may be the man who thought of the core idea of Star Wars, but I think he gets just a smidge too much credit for the creation in its entirety

I agree, quoting George isn't really a stable base to build on, George has been known to contradict himself

J

 

[Psab keel]

Good and evil are subjective terms.

Morally ambiguity does exist to a degree but it doesn't eliminate objective good and evil which does exist too.

 

[Potroclo]

It's also interesting to note that John Boyega came to JJ, telling him that Palpatine couldn't return. And that it messes up things. But JJ talked to John and whatever he said changed his mind.

Source please!

 

[Joek3rr]

Source please!

His exact words are "How? How JJ?"

He's the last interview

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

Morally ambiguity does exist to a degree but it doesn't eliminate objective good and evil which does exist too.

Many would, including my self that that there is no objective way to define good and evil and that it only exists as a moral standard that is defined differently depending on religion, culture, society, and even individually.

 

[Psab keel]

Killing someone in self defense is a morally gray area perhaps but raping someone can never be justified no matter what culture you're from. It's always wrong. Always. That is an objective truth. I agree with you that the degree to which certain aspects of life are defined may differ by culture but there are clear tenets which all cultures use to judge behavior otherwise everything is open to interpretation.

We are all born with a conscience. That is the first judge. There has to be a standard or societies couldn't exist and everything would be chaos because no one could be held accountable for their actions so to claim that all morality is subjective is intellectually dishonest.

Granted this obviously is a larger issue than a film but the same principles apply when talking about mythology who's entire function is about the conflict between good and evil.

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

I wish what you said was true.... but it’s not.

 

[Laspector]

The Romans constantly raped people--slaves, children you name it. Raping a slave wasn't even looked down on. They were considered your property, you could do whatever you wanted with them.

Plenty of cultures throughout history have raped and murdered without thinking twice about it. And it was accepted in their culture to do so.

Human sacrifice, cannibalism, rape, murder, child abuse. Lots of cultures accepted this without batting an eye.

 

[Psab keel]

So you are justifying rape?

Just because those horrible things were done doesn't make them right. Because if everything is subjective then we as a species are ******.

 

[sztriki]

I wish what you said was true.... but it’s not.

Comeback of the century...

 

[Laspector]

No, I'm not justifying rape. I'm just saying that what Mara Jade's Father said is true. Morality is based on culture, not conscience. None of us believe raping someone is right, but if we had been wealthy Romans back in those days, we would all probably be doing it. The conscience of today would be irrelevant back then.

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

So you are justifying rape?

Just because it's done doesn't make it right. Because if everything is subjective then we as a species are ******.

Me? I am not. My personal view is based on current legal, social, culture views at this given time in history tells me it is wrong. But not every legal, culture, society, in various eras in time are based on what I take stock in.

 

[Psab keel]

They knew it was wrong. They justified it by claiming people were property which itself is also wrong even going so far as to create laws to justify their evil. Just because people choose to deny their conscience doesn't excuse morally reprehensible behavior.

You can't honestly say that you wouldn't have a gut reaction to hold someone accountable if they murdered your family. Not all truths are subjective.

 

[Scarecrow Joe]

Sorry but there is not anything like an "objective truth". Truth to you is not the same as a truth to a member of an Amazonian tribe for example. Culture and religions helps to shape what truth is. Not to mention that recent studies and experiments in quantum mechanics have show that objectivity in itself most probable dont even exist, but that is a matter for another discussion.

Also we are not born with a "conscience". If you were born in royalty, and your daddy was King you would have grown up thinking that probably rape, taking what is yours by your "divine" right, was the natural thing to do. What you call conscience is nothing but the construct of what your parents, teachers, peers, cultural and religious backgrounds injected in you. Morality is indeed SUBJECTIVE. So in fact that not even the law passes judgement on what is moral or not. Ask a lawyer sometime.

 

[Psab keel]

It's clear we are at an impasse because we will never agree on this so I'll just move on.

 

[cboath]

I agree, quoting George isn't really a stable base to build on, George has been known to contradict himself

J

Pretty sure he's be quoted as saying that balance was the absense of the dark side as well. Cause a mini-uproar here since the absence of something doesn't create balance by the definition of the word.

 

[Psab keel]

Again it's a matter of interpreting words and giving them meaning they don't necessarily have. That's why I didn't think much of the whole balance idea.