Dontdissthefett
Well-Known Member
LFL also made a big deal about Phasma was a woman. I remember the actress being sent out on press tours doing interviews about how what a first it was to have a woman as a main villain.
Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker (Post-release)
- Thread starter Vivek
- Start date
They could have just as easily cast a man for the role because other than her voice you'd never know there was a woman playing the part. She never once removed her helmet. Yeah they're real trail blazers. #eyeroll. Especially Rian who killed her off to get her out of the way rather than take the opportunity to develop her, even slightly.
Sadly empty platitudes and virtue signaling was more important than telling a good story. It just blows my mind that having a clean slate to start from and this was the best they could do.
Sadly empty platitudes and virtue signaling was more important than telling a good story. It just blows my mind that having a clean slate to start from and this was the best they could do.
The Brahma Bull
Sr Member
They purchased Lucasfilm and couldn't wait to do something with it. There was no passion, ni vision just the money and the ingredients to put disney over as a tolerant, diverse company. Congrats to everyone who like the ST. But IMHO it was a pretty cheap cashcow. They did some fanservice, more on the sets than in the actual movies (JJ building real props). Put some fresh faces and some known faces, that didn't have their moment on the big screen to present something new. Then they've managed to hire two directors who seem to dislike each others work.
cboath
Master Member
And it worked so well it kinda vanished for 10 years until they did E1.
I have to say, though, that Finn and KMT seem to both have been afterthoughts in 9. Finn got to tag along, but if he wasn't there, would it have mattered? It's as if they were setting him up for more in 10, but there was no 10 on the horizon so what would be the point?
We also don't know what they were all told beforehand about what their roles were going to be either. But, poor planning and then having each episode retconning the last and having to re-establish the mains leaves even less time for everyone else.
I have to say, though, that Finn and KMT seem to both have been afterthoughts in 9. Finn got to tag along, but if he wasn't there, would it have mattered? It's as if they were setting him up for more in 10, but there was no 10 on the horizon so what would be the point?
We also don't know what they were all told beforehand about what their roles were going to be either. But, poor planning and then having each episode retconning the last and having to re-establish the mains leaves even less time for everyone else.
HMSwolfe
Master Member
No one’s denying that money was made off of the OT, and sometimes in some less than savory ways. The point is, those cash grabs like you’ve referenced were ancillary, and the main things (the films) were to a much higher quality and standard. No one cares if a TLJ coloring book featuring porgs feels like a soulless product directed at very young children. People do care if the main films feel that way.Star Wars has always been a cash cow. Don't blame the farmer for squeezing the milk, when the last owner made millions from it. I mean, let's face it, there have been points waaaay before Disney when SW has been embarrassingly milked...
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CT1138
Sr Member
The Empire's elite legion was defeated by teddy bears with stone age weaponry.
And then there's Jar Jar.
HMSwolfe
Master Member
Okay, again, arguments really can’t be made in favor of the ST when they’re being founded on the universally agreed-upon worst parts of Star Wars. No one is claiming that the OT are perfect films, just way, way better than anything that has followed in this franchise. (And also, really the only entries that can actually be considered films and not products).
CT1138
Sr Member
Or perhaps just pointing out a double standard.
All studio funded films are products. You can blame Thomas Edison for the commercialization of the film industry. In fact, Hollywood itself was founded to get out of the commercialized movie factories back in NYC. Ironic, no?
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HMSwolfe
Master Member
If you’re too dense to understand the difference between a film (being a marriage of art and industry, where talented and passionate people work alongside the business-minded to create art while also earning profits) and pure product (made by an uncaring an soulless monopoly with the intent to weaponize nostalgia in order to rake in billions for the already stupidly rich executives at the top), then you really aren’t worth arguing with. Hell, the kind of company that Disney is today is exactly the kind of thing George Lucas hated most when he made the OT. There’s a reason why he tried to finance the two sequels all on his own. He hated studio meddling and crass, passionless products being pumped out by a dying studio system. That’s the reason for all the merch and your little Ewok example. He wanted to have enough money to make his films without anyone else telling him what to do.
What a shocker...Someone has to resort to an ad hominem simply because someone dares have a different opinion on the merits of a film.
It's a shame that grown men resort to such nonsense. Especially over films (braces for reply calling me a name, because I called them films)....
It's a shame that grown men resort to such nonsense. Especially over films (braces for reply calling me a name, because I called them films)....
I've openly acknowledged the shortcomings of the originals. Some ST fans can't even acknowledge the flaws of the ST at all, no matter how minor. I'd call that a double standard.
HMSwolfe
Master Member
Isn’t that…exactly what you’re doing? Attacking my argument based off of some perceived attack on someone else, rather than actually say anything? And have done every time you chime in here? I don’t see you offering any concrete arguments for the ST, just popping in every now and then to say “Oh, your argument is bad because of Latin phrase that I know or yet another person misusing a word.” Try, I don’t know, contributing to the conversation?
el toro
Sr Member
It’s been several months since the sequels ended, and I’ve had time to reassess them. I’ve come to the conclusion that I still really loathe the sequels.
So, I’ve noticed that certain reddit boards harbor a great deal of TLJ supporters, who are explicitly and automatically dismissive of John Boyega’s claims without any real reasoning. However, I don’t know if this is true across all TLJ fans. Regardless, I think it’s fair to listen to and thoughtfully consider JB’s opinion simply because we’re not in his shoes and did not experience the same facts and circumstances that JB has encountered. So unless you’re a POC who’s acting (or trying to act) in Hollywood, your viewpoint is probably inconsistent with JB’s and may make it difficult for you to empathize with him.
So, I’ve noticed that certain reddit boards harbor a great deal of TLJ supporters, who are explicitly and automatically dismissive of John Boyega’s claims without any real reasoning. However, I don’t know if this is true across all TLJ fans. Regardless, I think it’s fair to listen to and thoughtfully consider JB’s opinion simply because we’re not in his shoes and did not experience the same facts and circumstances that JB has encountered. So unless you’re a POC who’s acting (or trying to act) in Hollywood, your viewpoint is probably inconsistent with JB’s and may make it difficult for you to empathize with him.
Which is why I posted the article because of where it originated. This isn't the opinion of a fan. This is the perspective and personal experience of one of the lead cast members. His honesty is refreshing. Not to mention he's even doubled down on his comments on twitter.
Couple that with Mark Hamill's disappointment with TLJ and the way his character was handled and I'd say the opinion of these actors says a lot about how these movies were made.
So it's not just "toxic whiny fanboys" who think these things about the ST.
Couple that with Mark Hamill's disappointment with TLJ and the way his character was handled and I'd say the opinion of these actors says a lot about how these movies were made.
So it's not just "toxic whiny fanboys" who think these things about the ST.
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el toro
Sr Member
Yeah I can appreciate JB’s honesty. What he said rings true from my son’s perspective. His favorite sequel character is Finn based on the expectations established in TFA. But after the next two movies relegated JB to the periphery, my son’s enthusiasm for the sequels waned into general indifference.
HeartBlade
Sr Member
Wow did this thread go down a tunnel lol.
first, Finn was totally a main character. I don’t know what ST defenders are smoking. The first two roles up for audition were the following:
YOUNG WOMAN TO PLAY 17-18 YEARS OLD. MUST BE BEAUTIFUL, SMART AND ATHLETIC. OPEN TO ALL ETHNICITIES (INCLUDING BI- AND MULTI-RACIAL).
WAS QUITE YOUNG WHEN SHE LOST HER PARENTS. WITH NO OTHER FAMILY, SHE WAS FORCED TO MAKER HER WAY ALONE IN A TOUGH, DANGEROUS TOWN.
this is Rey, not doubt about it.
THOMAS: YOUNG MAN TO PLAY 19-23 YEARS OLD. MUST BE HANDSOME, SMART AND ATHLETIC. MUST BE OVER 18.
HAS GROWN UP WITHOUT A FATHER’S INFLUENCE. WITHOUT THE MODEL OF BEING A MAN, HE DOESN’T HAVE THE STRONGEST SENSE OF HIMSELF.
and this is Finn.
finn is the first character we see in the trailer and we follow his story until we run into Rey. They are dual protagonists following the same story.
han was arguably one of the best developed characters in OT. He starts out as a selfish smuggler who doesn’t care about justice/revolution etc as long as he gets his credits. He doesn’t believe in the force but just how to survive. He transforms from this to coming back to save Luke and the rebellions’ hide at the end of ANH. He fights with the rebels despite needing to get to Jabba for which he pays the price, while also showing his ingenuity and self-sacrifice.
yes he was underused in RotJ, probably because Ford wanted out. But Han in RotJ was a reverse rescue the princess, then led with Leia on an assault on the base to drop the shield and even let Lando drive the falcon. He took a backseat role since the movie had to end with Luke but he had a lot of development.
and the ewoks, first it was planned to be the Wookiee which would have been much better imo. It’s not too strange that the ewoks who have home advantage, prep time, used guerrilla warfare, and are implied to be incredibly strong was able to get the jump on the empire who came in expecting just a small rebel contingent. The empire still wrecked the ewoks in their fight as well.
first, Finn was totally a main character. I don’t know what ST defenders are smoking. The first two roles up for audition were the following:
YOUNG WOMAN TO PLAY 17-18 YEARS OLD. MUST BE BEAUTIFUL, SMART AND ATHLETIC. OPEN TO ALL ETHNICITIES (INCLUDING BI- AND MULTI-RACIAL).
WAS QUITE YOUNG WHEN SHE LOST HER PARENTS. WITH NO OTHER FAMILY, SHE WAS FORCED TO MAKER HER WAY ALONE IN A TOUGH, DANGEROUS TOWN.
this is Rey, not doubt about it.
THOMAS: YOUNG MAN TO PLAY 19-23 YEARS OLD. MUST BE HANDSOME, SMART AND ATHLETIC. MUST BE OVER 18.
HAS GROWN UP WITHOUT A FATHER’S INFLUENCE. WITHOUT THE MODEL OF BEING A MAN, HE DOESN’T HAVE THE STRONGEST SENSE OF HIMSELF.
and this is Finn.
finn is the first character we see in the trailer and we follow his story until we run into Rey. They are dual protagonists following the same story.
han was arguably one of the best developed characters in OT. He starts out as a selfish smuggler who doesn’t care about justice/revolution etc as long as he gets his credits. He doesn’t believe in the force but just how to survive. He transforms from this to coming back to save Luke and the rebellions’ hide at the end of ANH. He fights with the rebels despite needing to get to Jabba for which he pays the price, while also showing his ingenuity and self-sacrifice.
yes he was underused in RotJ, probably because Ford wanted out. But Han in RotJ was a reverse rescue the princess, then led with Leia on an assault on the base to drop the shield and even let Lando drive the falcon. He took a backseat role since the movie had to end with Luke but he had a lot of development.
and the ewoks, first it was planned to be the Wookiee which would have been much better imo. It’s not too strange that the ewoks who have home advantage, prep time, used guerrilla warfare, and are implied to be incredibly strong was able to get the jump on the empire who came in expecting just a small rebel contingent. The empire still wrecked the ewoks in their fight as well.
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