Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Pre-release)

[JD]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

Well, I've officially gone too far with the SWFA spoilers, by reading info I didn't want to know. I didn't mind the general, vague bits and pieces - but, the stuff I just read was too much, so much that I think it might be time to stop reading a lot of what's being said.

I know it's still rumor and not confirmed, but this last bit was just devastating to me and if it's true, I wish I would've went in blind on this bit. Read at your own risk...

http://www.starwars7news.com/2014/1...ial-scene-in-the-force-awakens-described.html

 

[Bryancd]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

Unless Jason Ward confirms it, I doubt it. Jason has had the most accurate info.

 

[Jedi-72]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

If true, pretty damn dramatic and not a bad story choice as far as I'm concerned. But, until it's on-screen, it's all just speculation.

 

[joberg]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

I don't think we can put StarWars only into a "Kid's movie genre." We know that the first film was made for quite the wider audience and it's its universal message that made it what it was/is. The first one was like a Master Key; a key to our conscience, as if liberating a long lost memory of Myths, Heroes and Monsters that we all possess; that's why!
The other episodes were not as "Mythical" as the first one, but we were hooked. Hooked to the main characters; the story came second.
We wanted to see and experience the same world, thinking that ESB would've been in the same vein as the first one. Kersh had other ideas (as others have discussed in-depth) it was more "human" than Mythic, but it was still a great movie. The expectations for ROTJ were high, of course, but it never quite "closed" the saga and by now the Franchise was running on its own steam: nothing great, but nothing terrible.

 

[seelsa73]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

Still think Adam driver doesn't fit the bill of a child of Han and Leia. I'm going to use that as a reason why I think this is bogus...although what a dramatic ender it would make to the movie.

 

[Sluis Van Shipyards]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

Well, I've officially gone too far with the SWFA spoilers, by reading info I didn't want to know. I didn't mind the general, vague bits and pieces - but, the stuff I just read was too much, so much that I think it might be time to stop reading a lot of what's being said.

I know it's still rumor and not confirmed, but this last bit was just devastating to me and if it's true, I wish I would've went in blind on this bit. Read at your own risk...

http://www.starwars7news.com/2014/1...ial-scene-in-the-force-awakens-described.html

That's just idiotic. I think most fans would be done with the movies after that.


As far as the Prequels, you definitely cannot take away the point of fans' expectations being a part of why they didn't like the Prequels. People went in carrying the huge expectations of 30 or so years of imagining what happened before the OT. I generally liked them, but I do see the faults with them. They're definitely not anywhere near the ballpark where the worst movies are. They aren't even in the parking lot of that park.

 

[Westies14]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

As far as the Prequels, you definitely cannot take away the point of fans' expectations being a part of why they didn't like the Prequels. People went in carrying the huge expectations of 30 or so years of imagining what happened before the OT. I generally liked them, but I do see the faults with them. They're definitely not anywhere near the ballpark where the worst movies are. They aren't even in the parking lot of that park.

I do more than discount that - I believe it worked in the opposite way. I think those expectations buoyed the early reviews and box office. Most of us wanted so badly to like them that we convinced ourselves that they weren't as truly awful as they are. We went back to watch them again. And a third time. And bought them on VHS. It took many of us months and years to allow ourselves to admit that TPM was terrible. With the second movie coming out, I hoped they'd get back on track. I barely got excited for the third one, and it was the most disappointing of them all.

They're not among the worst movies in existence, of course - but they're easily among the worst of the blockbusters and tragically flawed entries when considered in the context of one of the great film series of all time. I love fun, light entertainment. I can easily enjoy a great children's film. Most people can. Blaming the audience for not liking the movie is a bizarre argument for the films.

 

[DARKSIDE72]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

If the plot line about Luke being out of his mind and in seclusion is true then something dramatic/horrific happening to bring him back to reality makes total sense.I like it. You know Ford would only come back for one more.

 

[JD]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

They're not among the worst movies in existence, of course - but they're easily among the worst of the blockbusters and tragically flawed entries when considered in the context of one of the great film series of all time. I love fun, light entertainment. I can easily enjoy a great children's film. Most people can. Blaming the audience for not liking the movie is a bizarre argument for the films.

:facepalm
I don't see anyone "blaming" anyone for not liking the Prequels - I see a rationalization or justification of why some folks may not like them. Heck, the IMDb has Revenge of the Sith at a 7.7 and Return of the Jedi as an 8.4 - not that far apart (of course, the other prequel flicks are even lower). I still say that on its release, the prequels (notably Ep 1 were more highly regarded and celebrated - and it was only as time went by and the whining spread...).

As far as "worst of the blockbusters" - well, that's a matter of opinion and taste, but I'd take a Star Wars prequel over sitting through Avatar, or Transformers or a Pirates sequel.

 

[joshvanrad]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

As far as "worst of the blockbusters" - well, that's a matter of opinion and taste, but I'd take a Star Wars prequel over sitting through Avatar, or Transformers or a Pirates sequel.

I'm not a fan of the prequels, but I 100% agree with this.

 

[Westies14]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

That's an awfully low bar - I wouldn't sit through any of those - but that's a good grouping to associate them with.

Like I said, it's fine for anyone to enjoy them. Maybe you saw them as a kid and there's nostalgia. Maybe it's just up your alley. Maybe you'll take anything with lightsabers and STAR WARS on the poster after waiting so long for it. For whatever reason, if you like them that's great! It's just annoying to have our disinterest always chalked up to our too-high expectations. We have valid issues with the movies on many crucial levels, and we're not all so hopelessly lusting after the OT that we can't rationally consider something new.

- D

 

[seelsa73]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

And you don't think the rest of us get annoyed when we're told that we only like the PT because it's called Star Wars and has lightsabers? Look, nobody is saying too-high expectations is the only reason you could possibly hate the PT, just that it can't be denied that it is a contributing factor.

 

[Westies14]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

And you don't think the rest of us get annoyed when we're told that we only like the PT because it's called Star Wars and has lightsabers? Look, nobody is saying too-high expectations is the only reason you could possibly hate the PT, just that it can't be denied that it is a contributing factor.

I don't mean any offense. That wasn't the only possibility I raised, and I really thought it was one of the more valid ones. I like weaker seasons of good TV shows because I like spending time with those characters, and it could be a similar phenomenon. I don't know why people like the prequels. I don't actually see people defend them often. I put a list up there of my best guesses as to why someone might enjoy them, but not liking them myself I don't pretend to know why anyone does.

On the other hand, I often see people try to explain to other fans exactly why they don't like the movies - and almost without fail, the discussion is met with some variation of "well you were never gonna like it anyway" or "they're for kids, and you're old now."

It sure can be denied that "too-high expectations" are a contributing factor in our disliking those films. I've denied it several times! It's really got nothing to do with it whatsoever. That's the problem. That's what I'm trying to say. I don't like them because I think they're terrible movies. After someone takes the time to explain why they don't like something, it's a bit odd to tell them again and again what their real reason for not liking it is. Or to insist that it's undeniably part of it. It's not. They're just bad (to me).

If no one wants to debate the merits of the prequels, that's great - probably best for everyone! Don't jump in just to discount someone else's thoughts on them though. I'm not telling anyone why like these movies, because I don't know. The prequel fans clearly understand their detractors about as much as we understand people who enjoy them. It's honestly got nothing to do with what we hoped we'd see, and they fall short of the OT on many objective levels. I, for one, still tap into my childlike sense of wonder often - and these movies don't come within a mile of tapping into that.

 

[JD]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

Just because you deny something doesn't make it not true. (Likewise, just because we think something doesn't make it true as well... but, I stand by everything I've said here and feel strongly that it's true). The proof is in the pudding... these movies were very successful, they sold tickets, they sold merchandise and now here comes a sequel (yes, all that can be trivialized, too).

But, that's a whole other debate and this thread is meant to discuss Star Wars The Force Awakens and I don't think it's proper to continue that discussion here.

 

[OldKen]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

Sounds like your describing... Man of steel...

these movies were very successful, they sold tickets, they sold merchandise and now here comes a sequel.

 

[Westies14]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

In this case, the subject of the discussion becomes us (those who don't care for the prequels) rather than the films. We know exactly why we don't like it, and that's why we deny your theory about why we don't like it.

 

[batguy]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

The PT was initially received better than our attitudes a couple years later. That's definitely true.


Looking back, Ep#1 is a pretty good kids' movie if you don't measure it against the expectations of being a STAR WARS MOVIE. It feels finished and has a coherent narrative, which is not always the case in the PT. It's also the only SW movie out of the entire 6 where the SFX quality lives up to the full promise of modern digital-era ILM.

 

[gizmo]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

If that latest rumour is true it will make for some great drama.I really like it and as I've said before I think this movie needs to make some bold moves instead of just playing it safe. I can just imagine Luke in the heat of battle doing what is said and then coming back to his sanity when realising what's just gone down. A costly accident I guess and It could be epic at pulling our heart strings. I don't beleive any of these rumours until it on screen though. Grain of salt material.

Also the whole PT argument has been done so many times I've just been skipping through posts with arguments related to it. It's gotten so old already.


Ben

 

[SofaKing01]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

I had a feeling the only way Ford would return to the franchise was if "that" happened... I might be worong - we might ALL be wrong. Also, Adam Driver does have a unique resemblance... How Luke is pulled back from that situation... We'll just have to wait and see...

I can't wait to see it!

 

[joshvanrad]

Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens

Well, Ford has been looking for a way out, so...