Star Wars blu ray in September
- Thread starter jcoffman99
- Start date
Solo4114
Master Member
Can't say I'm surprised. She made the wrong call, though.
Yeah, it's gotten beyond the anger thing about "ruining my childhood" or whatever (not that I ever made such a statement), and more to a place of just shaking my head, sighing, and passing on yet another DVD offering. With only a handful of exceptions, the Star Wars universe being sold today, is not the Star Wars universe I want to buy. I'm sure there are hardcore fans who WILL complain and still buy, but I won't be one of them. With the originals on DVD (even if just as LD rips), I don't really see a point in buying additional versions in new formats. Not until there's an archival version, at least.
You'd think it'd be a no-brainer, too. The Blade Runner collector's set included FIVE versions of the film: U.S. Theatrical, International Theatrical, Director's Cut, Rough Cut, and Final Cut. Having seen the Director's Cut and the International version already, I really only ever watch the Final Cut, but it's nice to at least have the option to see how it played out in each instance, given some of the radical changes involved and how they change the overall film. Why the original versions of the OT (or even the "LD-era" versions) are treated like the red-headed stepchildren of the franchise is beyond me, but whatever. He can sell what he likes, and I'll buy what I like, and if those two don't coincide, I'll just save a few bucks and buy a case of wine or something.
One thing that I find interesting, though, is Katie's alleged involvement with all of this and the sense that she may be the heir-apparent to the Lucas Empire. That's fine and all, but I can't help but wonder what she's been raised to believe about their "realm." My sense is that the folks at Lucasfilm generally believe that they can slap the logo on the product and people will buy it. Mostly that's been true, but I wonder how long that'll continue to be true, depending on what they apply said logo to.
Honestly, I would TOTALLY buy this set if only they included the holiday special. It wouldn't even need to be a high def transfer. Just a clean, SD transfer would be amazing.
Aside from that, I really have no interest in the commentary tracks. Totally bored of hearing Lucas wax nostalgic about how awesome he is about re-interpreting myths for modern audience. If they had Mark Hamil, Harrison Ford AND Carrie Fischer doing their own track on all OT movies, I would totally be in. Even if it was the SE's, which they would probably all goof on.
But even before the artwork came out, I'm already committed to not buying it. Not because of childhood rape. I just have no interest in HD versions of the SE's.
Aside from that, I really have no interest in the commentary tracks. Totally bored of hearing Lucas wax nostalgic about how awesome he is about re-interpreting myths for modern audience. If they had Mark Hamil, Harrison Ford AND Carrie Fischer doing their own track on all OT movies, I would totally be in. Even if it was the SE's, which they would probably all goof on.
But even before the artwork came out, I'm already committed to not buying it. Not because of childhood rape. I just have no interest in HD versions of the SE's.
I'm mainly interested in the documentaries (especially the creatures doc) and behind the scenes photos and turnarounds of the props and costumes. If you into doing alien costumes and appreciating the work of Stuart Freeborn and his team, this release looks to be a goldmine.
I am quite surprised that "Empire of Dreams" is not going to be included on the documentaries DVD. It's a fantastic film in its own right. "The Beginning," the film about the making of Episode I that is more interesting to watch than Episode I is, is also not listed, nor is "From Star Wars to Jedi."
I would prefer to have the original trilogy in a new transfer but I'm more or less resigned to the fact that it will never happen in Lucas' lifetime. It's not something I can do anything about, so I choose not to waste much energy on it.
I am quite surprised that "Empire of Dreams" is not going to be included on the documentaries DVD. It's a fantastic film in its own right. "The Beginning," the film about the making of Episode I that is more interesting to watch than Episode I is, is also not listed, nor is "From Star Wars to Jedi."
I would prefer to have the original trilogy in a new transfer but I'm more or less resigned to the fact that it will never happen in Lucas' lifetime. It's not something I can do anything about, so I choose not to waste much energy on it.
Colin Droidmilk
Sr Member
For anyone who doesn't have the '77 Making of Documentary, the set may be worth getting just for that. Not only does it truly capture the flavour of that long-gone summer since it's a product of the times itself, but it has lots of great stuff. ILMers fixing TIEs to bluescreen mounts, Joe Johnston adjusting the Falcon as it hangs before the bluescreen, Edlund doing the shot of the Falcon entering the Death Star, Lucas and crew doing take after take on sets in Tunisa and London...a must-have.
SVTStingRay
Sr Member
im truly disapointed in this release.
clancampbell
Sr Member
How can you be? It aint out yet!
Seriously, i'm hoping for amazing pic quality and sound.....the extras could be better, the covers are weak, but it's all about the movies for me. I'll be there for the marathon session, tons-o-snacks, lots of Pepsi Max, my 63" telly and 7.1 sound system.
My neighbours are going to complain...i guarantee it!
Rich
KaanE
Sr Member
We have posted the same at the same time! :lol
I'm in it for the extras. Just to have a nice copy of the 77 making star wars is great for me. I love that show but my copy is pretty crap. And SPFX making Empire as well. Another awsome doc. Also intereted in the archive and prop tour. So yeah for me it's mainly the extras I want. Only the OT box art is appealing to me but I'm not too worried about all that.
I don't see Star Wars nowadays as negatively as some people. Yeah I'm not really into the prequels n stuff but I really dig the Clone wars series and Star Wars liscenced products are the best they've ever been.
I don't see Star Wars nowadays as negatively as some people. Yeah I'm not really into the prequels n stuff but I really dig the Clone wars series and Star Wars liscenced products are the best they've ever been.
cayman shen
Master Member
That's what really frosts my nipples...if he prefers and wants to promote the SE's, fine. A lot of younger fans who want the flashier, cleaner effects will prefer them as well, I get that.
But to totally SUPRESS the originals, a major artifact in film history is just mind blowing. It's doing a disservice to a whole culture. Are they his creations? Yes. But they are more than "product" to be rebranded. They are artworks that have been submitted to the public and embraced. To remove them and supress them is so wierd it's almost like some strange dystopian novel. You know, almost.
And it gets worse! Say you LIKE the 97 SE's. They're gone. The DVD release altered those. Heck, say you like the PT...but don't want the extended parts of TPM or wish AOTC was the same as the theatrical (without Amidala's "to be angry..." line). GONE GONE GONE. It's heartbreaking. An artist does not work alone. An artist needs an audience. To find acceptance, to have your art embraced, and then to alter it and supress it is basically a desecration of heritage. It's painting fig leaves on Michaelangelo's nudes. It's heartbreaking.
I prefer the BR Final Cut. I think the DC and FC are far superior to the theatrical release. But you better believe that I bought the big multi-disc edition when it came out, because it's one of my favorite films and I think it's important to have the whole evolution, if even for personal archival purposes.
Lucas should give us the SEs AND originals in one release and let us decide which to pop in the player.
Jedi2016
Sr Member
That's an excellent point about Blade Runner, Solo. While it's obvious that the latest version got the most attention in terms of remastering and such (which seems perfectly natural to me), the others are still there. I also bought the "complete" set that includes everything.
I'm surprised Spielberg hasn't tried talking some sense into Lucas about this. He understands the idea of saving the original, just look at E.T. or Close Encounters.
The bonuses don't really interest me as much as getting HD versions of the films. But I'm wary of what they're going to look like, given Lucas's history of trying to create the "perfect" image. If he decides he wants to completely remove all traces of film grain from the OT, this is going to be one of the worst-looking BD releases of all time. Hopefully the upcoming release of American Graffiti will give us an idea of what to expect, since that one also has a new master "supervised" by George.
And there's no telling if they've gone back and fixed some of the screw-ups from the DVD release.
But, given George's history, whatever we get is what we're stuck with.. he won't respond no matter how bitterly we complain, it'll always be "director's intent". So we might as well pick it up anyway just for the HD. That's what they're counting on, I'm afraid.
I'm surprised Spielberg hasn't tried talking some sense into Lucas about this. He understands the idea of saving the original, just look at E.T. or Close Encounters.
The bonuses don't really interest me as much as getting HD versions of the films. But I'm wary of what they're going to look like, given Lucas's history of trying to create the "perfect" image. If he decides he wants to completely remove all traces of film grain from the OT, this is going to be one of the worst-looking BD releases of all time. Hopefully the upcoming release of American Graffiti will give us an idea of what to expect, since that one also has a new master "supervised" by George.
And there's no telling if they've gone back and fixed some of the screw-ups from the DVD release.
But, given George's history, whatever we get is what we're stuck with.. he won't respond no matter how bitterly we complain, it'll always be "director's intent". So we might as well pick it up anyway just for the HD. That's what they're counting on, I'm afraid.
SVTStingRay
Sr Member
i know lucas, we all know lucas, hes gonna screw this one up too. the badly colored lightsabers, the sound, the incomplete extras ie making of star wars, empire, but no jedi. someone mentioned it already that why are the original "making of"s included when those original model shots are gone from star wars. makes no sense.
"i sense a great disturbance in the force."
KaanE
Sr Member
The badly colored lightsabers? Compared to what? Because the original Luke lightsaber from ANH sometimes, is green sometime is blue, and it has never been changed, they still remain green and blue. So I don't know what do you mean.
The sound? I thought 6.1 was better than Stereo.
And about the extras... I know 40 hours is not enough for us, the propmakers/collectors, but for the most of the potential buyers it's more than enough, surely they won't even see them...
I can understand what you guys feel because they sometimes change the history, changing dialoges, facts, etc. But, IMO, getting better with some other things, which DON'T change the history, I'm fine with that.
Jedi-72
Sr Member
The release as it stands should surprise nobody. The artwork is about as atrocious as I had expected. It seems that LFL stopped employing folks with actual artistic talent or an eye for it, somewhere about 15 years ago. I mean, really? THIS is how the most awaited Blu-ray release is presented? Utter and complete garbage. Sad. The fact that his daughter had a hand in this is also not surprising. I've come to believe that as long as there is a Lucas at the helm of Star Wars, it's pretty much done. I know many will disagree with that. But, just as many will also agree. When was the last time Star Wars was actually good? The 80s. At least we'll always have those memories.
Solo4114
Master Member
I think the reference is to the fact that they did rather a half-assed effort on the 2004 SEs. While it's true that in the original, Luke's (and Obi-Wan's) sabre fluctuates between aqua, blue, and occasionally white, and while some shots didn't come out properly in post-production such that the original "shiny tape dowel" look is still there, you'd THINK that in the "lovingly restored" version which changes a bunch of other stuff, that they'd bother to fix the look of the sabre properly and make it a consistent color at least. It's a rather obvious botch that isn't really justifiable.
Either you're working to preserve the originals, in which case why the hell does Greedo even get off a shot and get Hayden out of the end of ROTJ, or you're making the "perfect version" in which case don't half-ass it. There's just no good reason to have done that.
I think he's referring to the ANH surround sound screwup which has yet to be even acknowledged as an error (but probably will on the Blu Ray version...). The error, as I recall, swaps the rear right and left channels, at least for the orchestral tracks. I can't recall if they did that with the sound effects. But the effect of it is that if you hear the brass over on the right hand side in the front, they're on the left hand side in the back. Not sure if this ALSO means that a Tie Fighter that goes screaming towards you from the lower-right to upper-left side of the screen will only sound off on the righthand side of the screen or what.
The answer that LFL's team apparently gave was "That was the way the original surround sound tracks were recorded," which, of course, brings up my previous point about whether you're trying to preserve things (obviously not) or fix things (again, obviously not or if you were, you ***ked up and are just refusing to acknowledge it).
My big gripe about those issues is one of customer service, basically. LFL has never, to my knowledge anyway, acknowledged that any of this was a mistake or poor workmanship, and has made zero effort to correct the problem or to offer early buyers a replacement disc. Why? Probably because they know that they'll do a subsequent release and fix it then, and people will just buy it again, so why incur the cost? Tell the fans to suck it and know that they'll still come back for more.
On the extras issue, I actually agree with you. While it'd be nice to have ALL the extras, this obviously lets them release subsequent editions with different extras to compel completists to keep buying. It's crass manipulation of the fans, but you've got to expect that at this point. They already know you're a junkie -- why would they work to improve the product and give you the ultimate high when withholding that means you'll come back for more? How many fans are actually going to "vote with their wallets" and not buy? My bet is that LFL knows people will *****....but still plunk down the cash when push comes to shove. Thus, they have no incentive to make consumers happy. They know they can half-ass it and enough people will already BE happy, so why bother going the extra yard, let alone the extra mile?
As far as the "changing history" thing, at this point the "history" is so muddled that it almost doesn't matter. There've been a bunch of different versions -- apparently even among the theatrical releases themselves -- some with more subtle differences, some with more glaring differences.
That said, I doubt you'd find a Star Wars fan who WOULDN'T want a restored, "archival" copy of the non-SE versions of the original trilogy. The only reason they HAVEN'T done this is because (A) Lucas doesn't like them and wants "his" vision (whatever the current one is) to be the only one seen, and (B) it's probably not a good move financially. While we can say "LFL would make plenty of money!" how much would it cost to actually do an archival version, and how many people would buy it?
I mean, at this point, the only thing I'd see making sense is them releasing the blu-ray version, then using proceeds from that to fund restoration of an "archival blu-ray" version. Although, given how well the last restoration bit did...I'm not even sure I'd WANT them to "restore" it.
OldKen
Master Member
Ya know. I read this last page here.
And thought... OMG bitching about the cover art? WHO CARES!
Then...
I clicked back a few pages...
That should be the cover art for a bottle of Ippecac. You would never even have to open it. Just look at the label! VOILA!
Wow.
If someone here painted that as fan art I would think NEAT! But, ARE YOU SERIOUS?
Why the hell aren't more of the people that know and care what was good about these movies getting paid by LFL?
STOP LETTING YOUR KIDS DO ANYTHING WITH STAR WARS!!! THEY WERE NOT ALIVE. THEY DO NOT "GET IT".
Make a new all CGI Avatar type film and let them have a field day with it! But PLEASE for the love of God. Stop giving them executive powers with anything to do with star wars!
I had to come to a realisation the other day.
I don't even really like the movies themselves anymore. I love the thought of what they were. I love the nostalgic feeling of "what is out there" I got when I first saw Star Wars. And I still get that feeling through the props I hold.
The SE used to not bother me THAT bad. Now I really cringe when certain "improved" scenes pop up.
Jedi wasn't that bad untill Jedi rocks... dear God. That scene is the worst in ALL SIX films.
The scenes in TPM with Jar Jar are WAY more tolerable.
The original piece of music for the Jabba throne room was AWESOME. I want all of that back.
I want RID of the new "improved" Wampa.
I want rid of the pointless ronto that walks across the screen in SW.
Either clean up the new jabba scene and make it look right or delete it.
Han shot first.
Let someone else have all the PT footage that was digitally stored on your computers and re edit and produce them.
Then...
Then I would truly watch them without wanting to puke or cry again.
I loved the OT the way it was. I LIKED the SE when it first came out. Some of the color correction and cleaning up WAS for the better.
I don't mind a NEW SE. But FFS improve the quality of what was there. Stop trying to make them look like the PT cause WOW the PT already looks digitally dated IMHO.
Sorry. I blacked out... Where am I? What happened?
Hey, new box art!
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO...
NOoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo...
:sick
And thought... OMG bitching about the cover art? WHO CARES!
Then...
I clicked back a few pages...
That should be the cover art for a bottle of Ippecac. You would never even have to open it. Just look at the label! VOILA!
Wow.
If someone here painted that as fan art I would think NEAT! But, ARE YOU SERIOUS?
Why the hell aren't more of the people that know and care what was good about these movies getting paid by LFL?
STOP LETTING YOUR KIDS DO ANYTHING WITH STAR WARS!!! THEY WERE NOT ALIVE. THEY DO NOT "GET IT".
Make a new all CGI Avatar type film and let them have a field day with it! But PLEASE for the love of God. Stop giving them executive powers with anything to do with star wars!
I had to come to a realisation the other day.
I don't even really like the movies themselves anymore. I love the thought of what they were. I love the nostalgic feeling of "what is out there" I got when I first saw Star Wars. And I still get that feeling through the props I hold.
The SE used to not bother me THAT bad. Now I really cringe when certain "improved" scenes pop up.
Jedi wasn't that bad untill Jedi rocks... dear God. That scene is the worst in ALL SIX films.
The scenes in TPM with Jar Jar are WAY more tolerable.
The original piece of music for the Jabba throne room was AWESOME. I want all of that back.
I want RID of the new "improved" Wampa.
I want rid of the pointless ronto that walks across the screen in SW.
Either clean up the new jabba scene and make it look right or delete it.
Han shot first.
Let someone else have all the PT footage that was digitally stored on your computers and re edit and produce them.
Then...
Then I would truly watch them without wanting to puke or cry again.
I loved the OT the way it was. I LIKED the SE when it first came out. Some of the color correction and cleaning up WAS for the better.
I don't mind a NEW SE. But FFS improve the quality of what was there. Stop trying to make them look like the PT cause WOW the PT already looks digitally dated IMHO.
Sorry. I blacked out... Where am I? What happened?
Hey, new box art!
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO...
NOoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo...
:sick
Jedi-72
Sr Member
I could live with the garbage SE verisions IF, IF they take the time to go back and fix the god awful color issues throughout...the over-saturation, and constantly fluctuating hues are a nightmare. Star Wars NEVER looked that way. The palette was much more subtle and natural, and not this comic book looking crap. Just a crying shame.
The other issues, as mentioned...the sabers. With cores, without cores, varying shades, and all within the same sequence. Really bad work there. And why were the saber sound effects changed at times, as when Luke ignites his saber in the freezing chamber for the first time? That's the ROTJ saber sound. Was never a part of the original Empire sound effects.
And, as has been said, the audio issues. If these things are all fixed, and the surround sound track backs off the oppressive bass that it has on the DVDs, I'd be reasonably content. Fix the picture and sound issues. Restore, don't re-do, and include the original stereo or mono mixes (which I prefer to the overdone 5.1 mix) and I'd be about as content as I can be without the actual originals finally being released.
The other issues, as mentioned...the sabers. With cores, without cores, varying shades, and all within the same sequence. Really bad work there. And why were the saber sound effects changed at times, as when Luke ignites his saber in the freezing chamber for the first time? That's the ROTJ saber sound. Was never a part of the original Empire sound effects.
And, as has been said, the audio issues. If these things are all fixed, and the surround sound track backs off the oppressive bass that it has on the DVDs, I'd be reasonably content. Fix the picture and sound issues. Restore, don't re-do, and include the original stereo or mono mixes (which I prefer to the overdone 5.1 mix) and I'd be about as content as I can be without the actual originals finally being released.
