Star Trek: TMP Director’s Cut 4K

dbuck

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Why would they need to redo the VFX? if it was on 35mm then surely all it needed was remastering to 4k. It looks like they have meddled with it ala Star Wars special editions.
The 2001 Directors cut had its new effects rendered in 480, so those definitely needed redoing. Cleaning up the old effects doesn’t bother me if they did much of that, but the new lounge scene does. I do like the sound better, the dialogue has a much better quality.
 

asalaw

Sr Member
I just hated it. The remixed soundtrack is overwrought and annoying—not every blinkie needs a bell and a whistle. I kept expecting Spock to say, “Ah! I see you brought the machine that goes PING!”

And they ditched the menacing computer voice, which I always loved.

“ATTENTION CREW. A TRAVEL POD IS NOW AVAILABLE, CARGO SIX.”

[Um, the sign above the airlock door says 5…]

”STFU. I SAID CARGO SIX. TRAVEL POD NOW AVAILABLE, CARGO SIX.”

And those titles? Metallic gold with glittering edges? REALLY? They look like a road sign for a Reno cathouse designed by Liberace’s cape maker.

And did we need to see Ilia magically fix Chekov’s shoulder? WTF does that add to the story? That was cut from the theatrical version for good reason. She never uses that ability again. It’s a setup with no payoff. Have these morons ever seen a movie?

On the plus side, the new transfer of Trumbull’s 65mm VFX footage was gorgeous. And they still left out that awful scene snippet of Sulu fumbling with his controls when Ilia first comes in. That was so slapstick. And not even good slapstick, like Mel Brooks-level. No, it was Bob Denver nude wrestling with Don Knotts after a whiskey bender-level slapstick. Bad scene, man. Some negatives are best thrown in the fire.

I still have the theatrical cut in 4K HDR with Dolby Atmos sound on Apple TV+, and in that version they erased the big ugly pipe stand you could see when the Enterprise leaves space dock. That was really the only thing that ever bothered me about the theatrical version, so I’m happy.

They can keep their September release. Hard pass.
 

Treadwell

Legendary Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Why would they need to redo the VFX? if it was on 35mm then surely all it needed was remastering to 4k. It looks like they have meddled with it ala Star Wars special editions.
They had a lot of the individual photographed elements, still, on 35 or 65 or whatever they were shot on, so it was an opportunity to recomposite them to achieve a less grainy image compared to the old multi-generational method. And eliminate blue spill and matte lines while they're at it.
 

Treadwell

Legendary Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
There's a great sound FX YouTube page that posts really cool stuff. They must be in the industry because they feature clean sounds apparently from isolated effects tracks.
However, I'm not crazy about this one (which I'm assuming is from the new mix and not a custom job for this posting):
There are sounds from 50 years of Star Trek in there. No. Just no. Maaaaybe one could justify using a little TOS (but I'd rather they didn't), but there are movie and TNG and later movie bleeps and bloops in there. NO.
 

edge10

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
I just hated it. The remixed soundtrack is overwrought and annoying—not every blinkie needs a bell and a whistle. I kept expecting Spock to say, “Ah! I see you brought the machine that goes PING!”

And they ditched the menacing computer voice, which I always loved.

“ATTENTION CREW. A TRAVEL POD IS NOW AVAILABLE, CARGO SIX.”

[Um, the sign above the airlock door says 5…]

”STFU. I SAID CARGO SIX. TRAVEL POD NOW AVAILABLE, CARGO SIX.”

And those titles? Metallic gold with glittering edges? REALLY? They look like a road sign for a Reno cathouse designed by Liberace’s cape maker.

And did we need to see Ilia magically fix Chekov’s shoulder? WTF does that add to the story? That was cut from the theatrical version for good reason. She never uses that ability again. It’s a setup with no payoff. Have these morons ever seen a movie?

On the plus side, the new transfer of Trumbull’s 65mm VFX footage was gorgeous. And they still left out that awful scene snippet of Sulu fumbling with his controls when Ilia first comes in. That was so slapstick. And not even good slapstick, like Mel Brooks-level. No, it was Bob Denver nude wrestling with Don Knotts after a whiskey bender-level slapstick. Bad scene, man. Some negatives are best thrown in the fire.

I still have the theatrical cut in 4K HDR with Dolby Atmos sound on Apple TV+, and in that version they erased the big ugly pipe stand you could see when the Enterprise leaves space dock. That was really the only thing that ever bothered me about the theatrical version, so I’m happy.

They can keep their September release. Hard pass.
No the white zone is for loading and unloading...
 

edge10

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
I was browsing on various videos and came across this one. the commentary is pretty funny. The Complaining!
The Slowtion Picture is a good name for the original edit. The DVD Director's cut, fixed that, quite a bit.
 

Gregatron

Master Member
I just hated it. The remixed soundtrack is overwrought and annoying—not every blinkie needs a bell and a whistle. I kept expecting Spock to say, “Ah! I see you brought the machine that goes PING!”

And they ditched the menacing computer voice, which I always loved.

“ATTENTION CREW. A TRAVEL POD IS NOW AVAILABLE, CARGO SIX.”

[Um, the sign above the airlock door says 5…]

”STFU. I SAID CARGO SIX. TRAVEL POD NOW AVAILABLE, CARGO SIX.”

And those titles? Metallic gold with glittering edges? REALLY? They look like a road sign for a Reno cathouse designed by Liberace’s cape maker.

And did we need to see Ilia magically fix Chekov’s shoulder? WTF does that add to the story? That was cut from the theatrical version for good reason. She never uses that ability again. It’s a setup with no payoff. Have these morons ever seen a movie?

On the plus side, the new transfer of Trumbull’s 65mm VFX footage was gorgeous. And they still left out that awful scene snippet of Sulu fumbling with his controls when Ilia first comes in. That was so slapstick. And not even good slapstick, like Mel Brooks-level. No, it was Bob Denver nude wrestling with Don Knotts after a whiskey bender-level slapstick. Bad scene, man. Some negatives are best thrown in the fire.

I still have the theatrical cut in 4K HDR with Dolby Atmos sound on Apple TV+, and in that version they erased the big ugly pipe stand you could see when the Enterprise leaves space dock. That was really the only thing that ever bothered me about the theatrical version, so I’m happy.

They can keep their September release. Hard pass.


As a matter of sheer coincidence, I was just today listening to the recent INGLORIOUS TREKSPERTS episode which presented an interview with TOS sound FX guru Douglas Grindstaff, and he noted that Roddenberry was always insistent that everything make a sound effect. So at least the new TMP mix follows the TOS tradition in that way.


Since I have no interest in CBS/Paramount’s failed streaming service, I won’t be seeing this until the theatrical release in May. That said, there are things about the 2001 version I Iiked, and things I didn’t like. I’m also not a big fan of the sound mix, what with the extensive use of FX from THE UNDISCOVERED COUNTRY and whatnot, as well as a few from TOS.

If it were me, I would have gone with the TWOK Bridge sounds, since that film was the closest to being contemporaneous with TMP, and therefore feels more appropriate than using incongruous FX created over a decade later. And, since the film used no sound FX or visual elements from TOS whatsoever at the time, retconning in the transporter “Pingggg!” and the CG TOS shuttle at the tram station also rubs me the wrong way, since the ostensible goal of the project was to do an approximation of what could have been done back in 1979, had there been more time. And TMP made a conscious choice to redesign all of the visuals and sound effects from the TV series.

I also miss the original TMP Red Alert sound, which is part of the aural identity of the film, as opposed to the rather wimpy replacement used in the 2001 cut.

But I’m good without all the computer voices, although I still find it strange that, in all versions of the film, a computer voice says “Permission granted, Sir!” when McCoy comes aboard, despite the fact that the script and the various adaptations of the film gave that line specifically to transporter chief Janice Rand. McCoy even looks in her (offscreen) direction when he asks permission to come aboard. For some reason or another, they dubbed in another actress with the computer-voice filter applied to it. Very strange.

And, like Robert Meyer Burnett, I also miss Kirk’s second “Viewer off!” to Uhura during the Rec Deck briefing. Although some of the other trims to his dialogue help tone down the rather grating “Kirk is a jerk” vibe of the theatrical cut. On the other hand, I could do without “Dammit, Bones, I need you—badly!”, and “We need him. I need him”, two moments which must’ve made slash-fiction fan-editors giddy, back in the day. It’s really cringey, and symptomatic of the film taking itself so seriously that Kirk comes across as an immature obsessive rather than a man struggling to get back in the saddle. His do-over midlife crisis in TWOK paints the character in a MUCH better light and actually feels like the character from TOS. The guy in TMP does not. Shatner has a few good moments in the film, but Nick Meyer knew how to get the best out of him and present a vulnerable Kirk who was still likable, while Bob Wise clearly did not.


On the positive side, I understand that the original main title music recording and the original V’Ger whiplash bolt sound FX (or at least something closer to it) have been restored.

I also do like the scene of Ilia stopping Chekov’s pain, mainly because it hints as to why V’Ger chose her to data-pattern—her compassion (and sensuality), which is something V’Ger lacks. It’s also one of those little character moments which was put back in to reduce the rather utilitarian nature of the theatrical cut. Of course, the scene with Spock crying is the Number One most egregious omission from the theatrical release, since it’s the key to the film’s primary theme and Spock’s own character arc.


At the end of the day, the flawed original 1979 release is still the version first published, and therefore the one of historical record. Although, unlike the esteemed asalaw, I’m a little miffed about the two tweaks made to the 4K release of the theatrical cut (the removal of the outline of the FX model’s pipe stand when the ship leaves dock, and the starfield added to the asteroid explosion when the torpedo hits it), if only because I’m not a fan of such revisionism unless it’s for an actual alternate cut of a film. I would prefer the theatrical cut to BE the theatrical cut.

That said, I grew up with the 1983 Special Longer Version on VHS, and would love to see that cut get a release, if only for the sake of thoroughness.


Also, has it been confirmed whether or not that pipe stand removal from the drydock sequence is an actual revision made for the 4K release? I seem to recall reading some statement (or at least speculation) that this was actually an original theatrical shot that was restored for the 4K theatrical release, rather than a sloppy, modern-day CG revision. As the story goes, an additional matte to remove the pipe stand caused the shot to become too fuzzy from optical compositing/generational loss, and so all home video versions included a different version of the shot without that extra garbage matte to help maintain picture clarity, but with the pipe stand error now included. That doesn’t really track, since both the film’s teaser trailer and the stock footage used in TWOK both include the “pipe stand” version of the shot.

Still, fuzziness of the shot aside, the 4K shot’s fix DOES almost look like the sort of crude rotoscoping you’d see in a film of that vintage. Or is it just a sloppy CG fix, with parts of the starboard deflector housing winking out due to a bad digital patch job?


 

Treadwell

Legendary Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Permission granted sir WAS Rand. It had that filtered sound because she was speaking from behind the safety shield thing, via a speaker..
 

Gregatron

Master Member
Permission granted sir WAS Rand. It had that filtered sound because she was speaking from behind the safety shield thing, via a speaker..


Really?!? Sounds nothing like Grace Lee Whitney, to me. If anything, it sounds more like Theresa E. Victor, Nimoy’s assistant, who also did the Enterprise destruct countdown voice in TSFS.
 

PoopaPapaPalps

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
I know they "fixed" some of the effects in this but have they ever fixed the pacing of the first film in any edition? That's my biggest gripe with The Motion Picture. It's a great TOS story but it really needs some tightening in some places.
 

Gregatron

Master Member
You might be right that someone else did the voice in ADR, but it wasn't the computer IMO.


Well, yes, the male computer voice heard throughout the film is very distinctive and consistent, but, even since I first saw the movie, that filtered voice which welcomes McCoy aboard always read to me as a computerized voice, albeit a friendlier, female one, which seems more fitting for a welcome than the cold, “Emergency alert. Negative control at helm.” voice.

Also, in the 1983/2001/2022 cuts, Kirk addresses the female yeoman (“What was the problem down there?”) before McCoy comes aboard without any filtering whatsoever, despite his being in the transporter operators’ booth with Rand.

And, for the 2001/2022 cuts, they even added a beep before the filtered female voice which welcomes McCoy aboard, indicating either an intercom being flicked on, or the computer responding to McCoy’s officially asking permission to board the ship.

If it WAS suppose to be Rand (as the script says), you’d think they’d at least give her a closeup for her line, or use an angle showing her in the shot.
 

edge10

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
I know they "fixed" some of the effects in this but have they ever fixed the pacing of the first film in any edition? That's my biggest gripe with The Motion Picture. It's a great TOS story but it really needs some tightening in some places.

The Director's cut, picks up the pace somewhat.

It sounds like this new 4k version, is not really the Director's cut anymore, if they have added other scenes/made additional changes. Your mileage may vary.
 
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airair

Sr Member
They had a lot of the individual photographed elements, still, on 35 or 65 or whatever they were shot on, so it was an opportunity to recomposite them to achieve a less grainy image compared to the old multi-generational method. And eliminate blue spill and matte lines while they're at it.

That video though showing the matte drawings, they seem to be glaringly obvious now.
 

Ron

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Well, what better way to celebrate Star Wars Day (the actual one) than by watching Star Trek? :lol:

I caught it tonight and to simply say, the film looked fantastic. I was weary of how intrusive the cgi was going to look but it blended in well. You're always going to notice it by virtue of familiarity with the original cut but they did a fine job I thought. I found that the restrained approach of the backgrounds (shots of San Francisco for example) helped. They could've created a highly detailed backdrop but rather kept it more in line with how an actual matte painting would look.

The color balance was good, the sound mix was good (despite some changes here and there). Like some have said, there are elements of the original cut I would have kept like certain dialogue and the original title cards (though I can appreciate it being distinctive). The reinserted scenes and lines of the director's cut are very welcome however.

Also, I have to say one of the most endearing aspects of TMP is Jerry Goldsmith's use of an overture. A standard of a bygone era. I could have sat and listened to it for an hour along with the rest of the score.
 

Gregatron

Master Member
Well, what better way to celebrate Star Wars Day (the actual one) than by watching Star Trek? :lol:

I caught it tonight and to simply say, the film looked fantastic. I was weary of how intrusive the cgi was going to look but it blended in well. You're always going to notice it by virtue of familiarity with the original cut but they did a fine job I thought. I found that the restrained approach of the backgrounds (shots of San Francisco for example) helped. They could've created a highly detailed backdrop but rather kept it more in line with how an actual matte painting would look.

The color balance was good, the sound mix was good (despite some changes here and there). Like some have said, there are elements of the original cut I would have kept like certain dialogue and the original title cards (though I can appreciate it being distinctive). The reinserted scenes and lines of the director's cut are very welcome however.

Also, I have to say one of the most endearing aspects of TMP is Jerry Goldsmith's use of an overture. A standard of a bygone era. I could have sat and listened to it for an hour along with the rest of the score.


I caught it on Monday. Looked and sounded fantastic. A few quibbles here and there, particularly regarding some of the sound effects choices, although the sound mix was better and truer to vintage than I had expected, and better than the 2001 version. Some of the CG was a bit obvious. There are a good number of new, little surprises in terms of sound effects and visual tweaks which are quite clever, like the Enterprise’s running lights now actually blinking during the Captain’s Log establishing shot while they’re inside V’Ger, the entry to V’Ger’s inner chamber actually irising closed after Spock flies through (whereas, in the previous cuts, it just stayed open) and the wrist communicator actually beeping when Uhura pages Kirk in the Officers’ Lounge. Little details which add realism and consistency.

By and large, it finally feels like a finished movie. Its innate flaws are still there, but this is the best version of the movie that there’s ever been.


That all said, I do feel a little hesitant about the fact that they did go in and make more changes without Robert Wise’s approval, rather than just replicating the 2001 cut which he signed off on. Maybe some of these things were discussed at the time (like replacing the Officers’ Lounge windows), but there’s a long list of audio and visual tweaks to this version that he had no say in. Not to assume that he wouldn’t be pleased with them, but calling it a Director’s Edition when other people made all of those calls seems a little disingenuous.

That said, this is a step up from the 2001 version, and, as noted, feels like a properly finished film. Finally!
 

DazzlerFan

Well-Known Member
I met up with two friends Tuesday night to watch this in the theatre. We had a good time.

It reminded me how much I love Star Trek. Not that I particularly love or even really like this movie, but it just reminded me of how I love Trek as a whole.

As for this cut of the movie, I think it’s probably the best. I would love to try to edit this movie into something a little faster paced. Seriously, 25 minutes cut from this movie would help move it along and you would have no loss of story.
 

bwize

Sr Member
I watched this on Sunday at my local theater. Thrilling to see it for the first time on the big screen. I have seen this film so many times via DVD/Bluray and love it, but agree that the first half of the movie is very slow. For me, once Spock takes his space walk, this movie goes into overdrive. I absolutely love Decker's and Ilia's convergence scene. Jerry Goldsmith's beautiful score is probably the best of the series. I have always loved the science of this film with the AI and "boldly going where no man has gone before", with the Decker/Ilia scene. Just a shame that they never revisited Decker/Ilia in any of the other films or TV shows, same goes for Gillian from The Voyage Home. Such a missed opportunity.
 

Treadwell

Legendary Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
I listened to a podcast with the producers, they said they'd had discussions with Wise in the years following the 2001 version and had a list of other things he would like to have done. So I'm confident the further changes would have had his approval.
 

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