Star Trek Beyond

[glunark]

Every generation finds new things to inspire them, that didn't exist in the previous generation.

We might like our fathers music, we probably don't like our grandfathers.

Its 50 years, we cant expect kids today to like the star trek we saw as kids, any more than we can expect everyone who loved the originals to love the new trek made in a faster style for those new kids.

The world is a different place now than it was in the 60's, 70's, even the 80's.

Films are cut faster, scenes go faster, FX have improved to the point where you no longer have to abandon a film idea because its impossible to film.

This isn't a bad thing, its just a different thing.

And a new trek you don't enjoy won't take away your old trek that you do.

New trek doesn't need to inspire, it only needs to entertain, and it does that.

 

[Edraven99]

Remember infinite diversity in infiltrate combinations?

To me that doesn't mean things have to stay exactly the same for 50 years, if anything, it means the opposite.

People talk about being inspired by the series, which is fair enough, but if you are trying to tell me people were inspired by the original films, and not these ones, then I am going to call BS.

Ok... I have to ask... what *themes* are you seeing in the new films?

ST: TMP (as drawn out as it was) had themes of the human condition and evolution and hope
ST: TWoK had themes of vengeance, consequences, and finding relevance with age
ST: TSfS was about unflinching loyalty and rebirth
ST: TVH was about saving the whales and the environment
ST: TFF was about seeking God and our place in the universe
ST: TUC was about redemption and peace

What themes and inspirations are you getting from "Star Trek" and "Into Darkness"?

 

[Edraven99]

New trek doesn't need to inspire, it only needs to entertain, and it does that.

The same can also be said about "Bayformers".... but it doesn't mean that they're not crap films....

 

[CessnaDriver]

Operative word being "some".

But of course, most trailers for films put in the intellectual payload into the trailers right?

Sometimes.
Given the other two films had little to none, but I thought I recalled the Scotty actor writer guy, name escapes me right now,
was saying something about making this one have something more, the trailer is not encouraging to any of that.

 

[AJTaliesen]

One of the things I hate about rebooting iconic things (rebooting a movie no one remembers doesn't count the same as rebooting something that helped shaped the culture):

it makes emotional investment damn near impossible.

Star Trek 3: not a great movie. I did enjoy it at the time, but watching it now, honestly it drags a bit. Also it turns out that without Spock, the whole character dynamic comes across a little flat, especially with Shatner apparently trying to overact enough for two to make up for the missing actor.

and yet....the Enterprise was destroyed. That scene alone was enough to make a largely forgettable movie into a gut punch for longtime fans.

Generations: when the Enterprise crashed it was monumental. For those of you who saw this opening night in the theaters...could you even believe they did that? Holy hell right?



this one: looks like the Enterprise gets destroyed. drag. Wonder what the next one will look like?

It becomes like comic books. No one dies for long. A year...two...they'll all be back. Wonder who new Khan will be in the 2020 reboot...there's no investment in disposable characters.

And thats the major problem with reboots. It's almost impossible to give a rats fart about anyone in it because you can't escape the fact that absolutely everyone is just disposable.


In that sense...JJtrek may have gotten it right. May as well go for temporary action flick, since it can't really have much staying power anyway. Once down the reboot path you start, forever will it dominate your franchise. Expect them to reboot it again...and again...and again.

 

[KrangPrime]

Ok... I have to ask... what *themes* are you seeing in the new films?

ST: TMP (as drawn out as it was) had themes of the human condition and evolution and hope
ST: TWoK had themes of vengeance, consequences, and finding relevance with age
ST: TSfS was about unflinching loyalty and rebirth
ST: TVH was about saving the whales and the environment
ST: TFF was about seeking God and our place in the universe
ST: TUC was about redemption and peace

What themes and inspirations are you getting from "Star Trek" and "Into Darkness"?

regarding the new movies..
the first movie was about rehashing things already done.
the second movie was about rehashing a movie already done.
the third movie looks like copying a earth bound action flick.

I don't see anyone being inspired by these new movies the way the old movies made you think. Hell, they are busy on working on a real life tri corder right now. not to mention bio beds, IIRC.

 

[KrangPrime]

Star Trek 3: not a great movie. I did enjoy it at the time, but watching it now, honestly it drags a bit. Also it turns out that without Spock, the whole character dynamic comes across a little flat, especially with Shatner apparently trying to overact enough for two to make up for the missing actor.

and yet....the Enterprise was destroyed. That scene alone was enough to make a largely forgettable movie into a gut punch for longtime fans.

Generations: when the Enterprise crashed it was monumental. For those of you who saw this opening night in the theaters...could you even believe they did that? Holy hell right?



this one: looks like the Enterprise gets destroyed. drag. Wonder what the next one will look like?

I have no involvement with this new enterprise, because PEOPLE DON'T KNOW HOW TO DESIGN **** ANYMORE! The bridge looks like the insides of a giant iphone. a lens flared mess where it's impossible to pick out detail because the camera doesn't stay on anything long enough to do so...the engine room is a modified beer factory. NO thought or care went into making it something special that this generation could latch on to like ours did with the movie universe. When that engine control panel came out of nowhere in darkness, I was like 'who woke up the designers?'

as for reboots....they all suffer the same thing. where as the originals where forging new areas, the reboots, if they are smart, are relying on NOSTALGIA to draw you in. that's the whole reason they went back to krik and spock...too lazy to think up new future areas...so they went back to something familiar. as bad as 'Time Travel' Braga and 'heir apparent in his mind' Berman where...at least they TRIED on some level to do a good job. I don't see these new people giving a crap to go even that far. and therefore, EVERYTHING will seem less special, because it's easier to REHASH what worked, and change one minor detail to make it seem fresh (kirk dying instead of spock, for instance) rather than going forward with bold new ideas.

only in this case, you'll have a split fan base. old fans will hate it because it's so CLOSE to what they loved, yet, not what they loved, that it makes them MISS what they loved. New fans will latch onto it and hate the older stuff because it's 'slower, more boring'.

ugh. that's the whole trapping with reboots.

 

[JOATRASH FX]

ugh. that's the whole trapping with reboots.

Well, there IS one shining star in the reboot sphere- BSG 2004. That version got it right and improved on the original in every way possible and brought it out of the horribly cheesy cheauvaistic 70's smarm the original swam in. What it didn't do was insult the original or make wink-wink "fun"-poking nods to it like Trek 2009 did.

 

[astroboy]

A friend of mine once said that you should never cover a great song. You should cover one that failed to live up to its potential.

The same could be said of movies

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[drcraig13]

I'm 54 and I Cycle and hang around a young crowd and they have NO interest in trek what so ever which kills me! :lol

Pedophile.

 

[Mola Rob]

Star Trek can be fun and intelligent at the same time. This is a point not understood by anyone working on the new movies, they appear to just want to have characters with familiar names run around and play a game of generic action movie.

 

[CessnaDriver]

Star Trek can be fun and intelligent at the same time. This is a point not understood by anyone working on the new movies, they appear to just want to have characters with familiar names run around and play a game of generic action movie.

:thumbsup

 

[glunark]

I will tell you why trek 2009 appeals to me on many levels.

I felt I could put myself in the characters shoes.

When I was 16 I and about to sit my O levels I had the world ahead of me, I had good grades, when I got to 17 my dad was going to teach me to drive, at 18 he would get me a job working with him, like so many fathers did at the factory, he would buy me my first pint, and give me advice on women, only none of that happened because on the day before my first exam he went to work, had a heart attack, and never came back. I did lousy in my exams, I never learned to drive, and I didn't find the right woman till I was 33.

The death of my father left a massive hole in my life, and changed my destiny, it changed who I could have been.

And when the Nerada came back in time and killed Kirk's dad, it changed his.

Must have been my 4th or 5th viewing before I could get through George Kirk's death scene without crying, and not just because my dad was called George too.

I have a son of my own, and it terrifies me the thought that I might die before I see him grow up, so George Kirk's death was a double blow, because I can imagine the pain of dying not knowing how your son would turn out, and I don't have to imagine the pain of your dad being gone.

James Kirk was an adult, but he wasn't a grown up, he matured in the film, until at the end he was ready to spare the life of the man who killed his own father, and he had gained a new family in the enterprise crew.

Family is important to me, and its also an important part of the fast and furious franchise, it might not make it into the trailers over cars exploding, or people jumping out of planes, but its at the heart of it, its what you come away with remembering long after cars dragging safes has long since faded.

If you don't find merit in the new movies, its not that there isn't merit to be found, its just maybe they arent for you, dosnt mean they arent for everyone, because clearly there is an audience for them. And while I am not a transformers fan, there is a market for them too, or they would not be making a 5th, and since that one is going to have micronauts in, I will definitely be giving that one a chance.

Seeing a film you may not enjoy is a risk, but then as a great man once said, risk is our business.

 

[Father]

One of the things I hate about rebooting iconic things it makes emotional investment damn near impossible.

and yet....the Enterprise was destroyed. That scene alone was enough to make a largely forgettable movie into a gut punch for longtime fans.

Generations: when the Enterprise crashed it was monumental. For those of you who saw this opening night in the theaters...could you even believe they did that? Holy hell right?

It becomes like comic books. No one dies for long. A year...two...they'll all be back. Wonder who new Khan will be in the 2020 reboot...there's no investment in disposable characters.

And thats the major problem with reboots. It's almost impossible to give a rats fart about anyone in it because you can't escape the fact that absolutely everyone is just disposable.

Well, I'd say the emotional investment with Trek is also partly due to the fact that you have known the characters longer than one or two movies... you have an entire series of 1-hour episodes that came before the movies. That tends to be a larger investment than the movies. The JJ-Trek movies don't have that so while the characters are known, the fact that they have new faces changes things.

Agreed on the resurrection thing with comic books. Can't let a good character just stay dead.
At least with Trek2, wasn't it at least a couple movies before they got a new Enterprise, like the end of 4 they got it, right?
Maybe the reboots have kind of a rushed feel because the actors are only contractually obligated to do 3 movies and after that it's either show them the money, replace main characters with new actors (always a fail in my book), or reboot again. What was nice about classic Trek is none of their careers really took off so all of them were probably sure things for any Trek sequels that were offered to them. Most of the actors in the new ones have other aspirations and most actors today try to diversify so they're not typecasted and pigeon-holed into one brand of movie.

 

[RougeAvenger81]

Ok... I have to ask... what *themes* are you seeing in the new films?

ST: TMP (as drawn out as it was) had themes of the human condition and evolution and hope
ST: TWoK had themes of vengeance, consequences, and finding relevance with age
ST: TSfS was about unflinching loyalty and rebirth
ST: TVH was about saving the whales and the environment
ST: TFF was about seeking God and our place in the universe
ST: TUC was about redemption and peace

What themes and inspirations are you getting from "Star Trek" and "Into Darkness"?

Star Trek: Finding your place in the world, dealing with loss, and unity of team members that don't truly know each other.
Star Trek ITD: A couple come to mind like humility and humbleness. However, these themes were not emphasized in this film like the original films were because they were to busy rehashing what has already been done and giving a near Micheal Bay treatment to Star Trek without him actually directing it.

Although there were roughly the same amount of time in between films being made with the original cast, they had substance and originality. They told a story and as stated by you, most had a lesson or theme. The new film (simply based on the trailer) like the previous two are action packed to attract the general movie goer, appeal to a new ADHD generation by keeping things fast paced and bright and shiny with lots of cool things to look at rather then TELL A STORY.

I think my point is the original films were just that. Original and told a unique story. This film looks like an original film. Great. Still missing one thing. What story is it really going to tell?......BOOM, CRASH, FLASHY LIGHTS, CAMERA SHAKE, STUNT STUNT STUNT, SHINY, BOOM, LIGHTS AGAIN..........

 

[RougeAvenger81]

A friend of mine once said that you should never cover a great song. You should cover one that failed to live up to its potential.

The same could be said of movies

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Excellent analogy. I could name a couple failures that done differently on film, or given a deeper story could have gone far. Stargate....DON'T HURT ME. Yes, good in it's own right, but not great. That's just me. Seaquest....if done as a deep sea submarine style film....never know....the Rocketeer.....I'm just naming things I think have potential, but weren't as good as they could have been. Good in their own respects, but could actually use the reboot treatment. Not riding the coat tails of an already successful franchise.

 

[Jedi-72]

I'm not a trek fan, but I enjoyed the previous two films. This trailer killed my interest in this movie. It's aimed at the brain dead. Awful.

 

[CessnaDriver]

At the end of the day, the heart wants what it wants.
And all hearts are different. Movies attempt to make us feel so we connect with them, or also intellectually engage us and again we connect.
I think that is why we can somewhat take it personally when others embrace what we reject or reject what we embraced.
Why don't they "get it"? I'm sitting there blown away by Fury Road or Interstellar, or Guardians, huge hits, great reviews and someone else is this is the most idiotic thing they have ever seen. LOL How is that possible!?? Like things I like! People can like the same thing and yet for different reasons. When there was only one Star Trek everyone was more on the same page. But it's all going so many directions since the films and so many series now.

 

[astroboy]

Excellent analogy. I could name a couple failures that done differently on film, or given a deeper story could have gone far. Stargate....DON'T HURT ME. Yes, good in it's own right, but not great. That's just me. Seaquest....if done as a deep sea submarine style film....never know....the Rocketeer.....I'm just naming things I think have potential, but weren't as good as they could have been. Good in their own respects, but could actually use the reboot treatment. Not riding the coat tails of an already successful franchise.

I would also say that Stargate wasn't that great. But it was made during a Drought. There wasn't any real fantasy stuff going on back then. Certainly no comic book movies.

However (much like Buffy ) the franchise that followed was incredible. I personally think Stargate is miles beyond the star trek franchise

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[ghostryder]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Yr_1K5YOAq0