Smooth On Dragon Skin Issue... PLEASE HELP!

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Jlow73

New Member
So, I've now attempted twice to make my silicone face prosthetic that I am making for a short film...its Chewbacca-ish! I followed all the directions on paper & the smooth-on videos to the letter. Both times it came out beyond sticky and not really solidified...meaning, I could alter its shape simply by pulling on it and it didn't go back to where it was meant to be. I'm wondering if it's the Slacker at this point? When I do the mix up for the encapsulate membrane, what hardens in the leftover cup is perfect....why does the slacker worsen it...I thought it was supposed to help. Should I just make it without the slacker?
 

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animator

Well-Known Member
I would agree with JPH. If you want it softer than Dragon Skin, use Ecoflex.

Also, you can call the Smooth-On help line. They are fantastic.

Are you sure your mold isn't reacting badly with the silicone? The one time I had silicone not cure well was because of a problem with something in the mold.
 

Jlow73

New Member
I dont use Slacker. Dragonskin is pretty awesome by itself.
I also dont use the thickener stuff for Rebound 25.
Ecoflex is also pretty amazing for mask.
Thank you! I was thinking that it seems to be pretty awesome in that little cup form it took on, lol...that's holding up quite nicely. So, thank you for letting me know that you don't use the Slacker...I think that's what I will do. I was interested in using it because it said it helped the pieces move, feel and act a little more like regular skin...i.e. it wrinkles, etc. But, I can't afford to keep trying...not right now anyway.
 

JPH

Sr Member
Thank you! I was thinking that it seems to be pretty awesome in that little cup form it took on, lol...that's holding up quite nicely. So, thank you for letting me know that you don't use the Slacker...I think that's what I will do. I was interested in using it because it said it helped the pieces move, feel and act a little more like regular skin...i.e. it wrinkles, etc. But, I can't afford to keep trying...not right now anyway.
Welcome to the world of multiple side quest.

Alot of this is experimentation. And it can get costly. I used dragonskin and ecoflex for molds alot, it seems better than some of the stuff that gets recommended. I never use Omoo either, that stuff is worse than clay for a mold.
 

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JPH

Sr Member
I would agree with JPH. If you want it softer than Dragon Skin, use Ecoflex.

Also, you can call the Smooth-On help line. They are fantastic.

Are you sure your mold isn't reacting badly with the silicone? The one time I had silicone not cure well was because of a problem with something in the mold.
The tin vs platinum silicone dilemma? Also humidity, ambient temp, all this other stuff you hear about.

Remember to scrape the sides!

Premix!

Degassing is also super helpful! Dont let one or two lucky cast get in the way of not using good technique. I also like to pour thin streams of whatever I am using to get rid of bubbles. It takes forever, but bettter than having to pour again.

Making stuff is SUPER FUN!!!

...sometimes
 

Jlow73

New Member
My mold is ultracal 30, so I don't think it should be reacting to anything ....but I suppose it's always a possibility. Is there a tin or platinum dilemma involved with gypsum? I am new to this...sort of. I did this all back in college, 24 yrs ago, hehehe, theater major. All the products they have nowadays are fantastuc....I just need to adjust.
I do the thin stream pour method as well. I did premix as well. When you say scrape the sides, are you talking about in mixing the stuff in the bottles or are you referring to when pouring together? Either way, I did both. So, maybe it is the Ultacal?
It is super fun! Yes, frustrating at times, but the fun beats it out...whuchi is why we keep coming back I suppose!!
 

Jlow73

New Member
Welcome to the world of multiple side quest.

Alot of this is experimentation. And it can get costly. I used dragonskin and ecoflex for molds alot, it seems better than some of the stuff that gets recommended. I never use Omoo either, that stuff is worse than clay for a mold.
The Ultimate Quest for the Holy Grail of molds, huh?! Lol! Agreed! I don't ever remember being 100% satisfied with my creations...always feeling like I could have tweeked it one way or another. Not to say I wasn't proud, but forever wanting to improve and forever trying new stuff to see what works the best!! And staying up very late doing it so I can get to work and/or the fam the next day.
So, do you think that because I have an Ultracal 30 mold that I'm pouring the DragonSkin w/ Slacker into it would be having any kind of reaction with the product? Someone brought that up to me. I didn't, but I truly don't know for sure.
Btw, the idea of Omoo didn't interest me, so I haven't even tried it.....yet, lol!!
Welcome to the world of multiple side quest.

Alot of this is experimentation. And it can get costly. I used dragonskin and ecoflex for molds alot, it seems better than some of the stuff that gets recommended. I never use Omoo either, that stuff is worse than clay for a mold.
8
 

Jlow73

New Member
The tin vs platinum silicone dilemma? Also humidity, ambient temp, all this other stuff you hear about.

Remember to scrape the sides!

Premix!

Degassing is also super helpful! Dont let one or two lucky cast get in the way of not using good technique. I also like to pour thin streams of whatever I am using to get rid of bubbles. It takes forever, but bettter than having to pour again.

Making stuff is SUPER FUN!!!

...sometimes
Also, the Smooth-On help line?!?!?!!!!!!! What a truly AWESOME suggestion! Seriously, why didn't I think of that? Lol! SMH!
 

jahwoo

New Member
So, I've now attempted twice to make my silicone face prosthetic that I am making for a short film...its Chewbacca-ish! I followed all the directions on paper & the smooth-on videos to the letter. Both times it came out beyond sticky and not really solidified...meaning, I could alter its shape simply by pulling on it and it didn't go back to where it was meant to be. I'm wondering if it's the Slacker at this point? When I do the mix up for the encapsulate membrane, what hardens in the leftover cup is perfect....why does the slacker worsen it...I thought it was supposed to help. Should I just make it without the slacker?
What type of clay did you use for your sculpt? If it has sulphur, that could be your problem. Sulphur and latex can cause cure inhibition. Slacker also makes cured silicone sticky. If you think it's the mold you could try Inhibit X but I've never had success with it when I had a mold that was contaminated. Silicone can be very fussy. Inhibit X™ Product Information
 

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JPH

Sr Member
Also, the Smooth-On help line?!?!?!!!!!!! What a truly AWESOME suggestion! Seriously, why didn't I think of that? Lol! SMH!
I have a Reynolds Materials close by, I just call and send em a pic when I have a question.

Great idea from animator, though!

I know what you mean about never 100%.

Yes, scrape side with the pre-mix and the mix.

I use FreeForm air for most of my limited sculpting. I am not a good scultptor. I usually make a model, and then use photogrametry software to make a 3d image THEN make a mold of the printed 3d image.

Now we gotta see what you been working on!!!

Also, if wanting to capture lots of detail, paint a few light layers of mold on --that way you avoid air bubbles and catch every detail.
 

udog

Active Member
I followed all the directions on paper & the smooth-on videos to the letter. Both times it came out beyond sticky and not really solidified...meaning, I could alter its shape simply by pulling on it a
How much Slacker did you add and to what part?
Slacker, when using certain amounts will make it sticky. That´s why it´s encapsulated.
But it should "remember" it´s shape. If it doesn´t it could be too much slacker, not correctly weighting and mixiing or an inhibition.
UC30 shouldn´t inhibit silicone.
The best way to know if there´s inhibition going around is making small tests in mold and cups. Does the plain DgSkin cure properly in the mold?. If not, there´s something wrong going on. Does DgSkin+Slacker cure properly in the cup?. You can force the curing speed with a hair dryer so tests don´t take so long.
Slacker should work for what it is designed, bringing down the silicone shore hardness. You can go further way down than Ecoflex (0030) with it. It´s a standard in prosthetics, as Platsil+Deadener. If it doesn´t work there´s something wrong going on.
 
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udog

Active Member
How much Slacker did you add and to what part?
Slacker, when using certain amounts will make it sticky. That´s why it´s encapsulated.
But it should "remember" it´s shape. If it doesn´t it could be too much slacker, not correctly weighting and mixiing or an inhibition.
UC30 shouldn´t inhibit silicone. I have read years ago about issues due to the kind of water used, but that's a rare situation I'd say.
The best way to know if there´s inhibition going around is making small tests in mold and cups. Does the plain DgSkin cure properly in the mold?. If not, there´s something wrong going on. Does DgSkin+Slacker cure properly in the cup?
Slacker should work for what it is designed, bringing down the silicone shore hardness. You can go further way down than Ecoflex (0030) with it. It´s a standard in prosthetics, as Platsil+Deadener. If it doesn´t work there´s something wrong going on.
 

udog

Active Member
I do recall reading about issues with the water used for UC30 mixing. Water that could carry some sulphur. But that's a very rare situation I'd say.
 

Jlow73

New Member
How much Slacker did you add and to what part?
Slacker, when using certain amounts will make it sticky. That´s why it´s encapsulated.
But it should "remember" it´s shape. If it doesn´t it could be too much slacker, not correctly weighting and mixiing or an inhibition.
UC30 shouldn´t inhibit silicone.
The best way to know if there´s inhibition going around is making small tests in mold and cups. Does the plain DgSkin cure properly in the mold?. If not, there´s something wrong going on. Does DgSkin+Slacker cure properly in the cup?. You can force the curing speed with a hair dryer so tests don´t take so long.
Slacker should work for what it is designed, bringing down the silicone shore hardness. You can go further way down than Ecoflex (0030) with it. It´s a standard in prosthetics, as Platsil+Deadener. If it doesn´t work there´s something wrong going on.
The plain DgSkin does cure properly in the cups. The DgSkin + Slacker does not. I used 50g part A & B, 100g Slacker...twice. I weighed it for measuring to be sure. It has been a little colder as of late her in Vegas, but nothing crazy (upper 60's). My workshop is currently my garage. I have a project room, but it's not ventilated properly; so, I moved out there for this project. My point being, I tried to check off all the boxes. I realize that doesn't always make for a perfect outcome, but my fingers were crossed, lol!
 

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Jlow73

New Member
I have a Reynolds Materials close by, I just call and send em a pic when I have a question.

Great idea from animator, though!

I know what you mean about never 100%.

Yes, scrape side with the pre-mix and the mix.

I use FreeForm air for most of my limited sculpting. I am not a good scultptor. I usually make a model, and then use photogrametry software to make a 3d image THEN make a mold of the printed 3d image.

Now we gotta see what you been working on!!!

Also, if wanting to capture lots of detail, paint a few light layers of mold on --that way you avoid air bubbles and catch every detail.
Love the mold n trick!! Thank you! Sculting I actually enjoy quite a lot!
 

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animator

Well-Known Member
I like your sculpt!

When I had a issue with some silicone not curing well, it was actually the bolts holding the mold together, the mold was fine. But if I had touched the bold and then handled the mold, I could have issues. Problems can come from unexpected things.

For what you are trying to make, it seems like Ecoflex would be a great choice and you wouldn't need Slacker which seems to be where you are getting problems. I have limited experience, but both Dragon Skin and Ecoflex are fantastic and have given me great results. I am about to start a new project that will have a thin layer of Dragon Skin 10 on the outside, then backed with Ecoflex 00-20 or 00-30.

The Stan Winston online school has a recent 3 video series called Silicone Mask Making where the people from Immortal Mask go through their process of molding and casting silicone masks. Every tip they give is useful and I wish the videos had been available before I wasted tons of money trying to make molds. I think it is well worth joining and watching the videos if you plan to make more molds in the future. Even if you don't use their exact process, just knowing how they deal with silicone and such is useful.
 

Jlow73

New Member
I like your sculpt!

When I had a issue with some silicone not curing well, it was actually the bolts holding the mold together, the mold was fine. But if I had touched the bold and then handled the mold, I could have issues. Problems can come from unexpected things.

For what you are trying to make, it seems like Ecoflex would be a great choice and you wouldn't need Slacker which seems to be where you are getting problems. I have limited experience, but both Dragon Skin and Ecoflex are fantastic and have given me great results. I am about to start a new project that will have a thin layer of Dragon Skin 10 on the outside, then backed with Ecoflex 00-20 or 00-30.

The Stan Winston online school has a recent 3 video series called Silicone Mask Making where the people from Immortal Mask go through their process of molding and casting silicone masks. Every tip they give is useful and I wish the videos had been available before I wasted tons of money trying to make molds. I think it is well worth joining and watching the videos if you plan to make more molds in the future. Even if you don't use their exact process, just knowing how they deal with silicone and such is useful.
Thank you! I have watched a couple of Stan Winston's freebies and I was considering joining....perhaps I will go ahead and join because I di plan on making more and more and MORE! LOL!
Thanks for the info about the bolts, too. I'm racking my brain trying to figure out what it could be...maybe something I cleaned it out with? I don't have bolts in mine. I used Turpentine and eventually acetone to clean the first silicone mishap....but, the silicone reacted exactly the same as the first silicone mishap. Smooth-On should be contacting me back today...we'll see. I'll let you guys know what they say. In the meantime time. I'm going to try my last bit of DragonSkin by itself. I may run and grab some Ecoflex as well....just because now I kinda want to play with it, hehehe!
Thanks again!
 

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