Prometheus (Post-release)

Ive always thought the true monster in the first series was the Company and in the new story that monster has the very human face of one Peter Weyland. Why did the Engineers want to reboot Earth? dont know, but if I was planning more movies, I wouldnt spell it out in the first one, thats for sure.
 
So, who is writing the 'sequel' to Prometheus? I apologize if that was mentioned a prev post i missed
 
Ive always thought the true monster in the first series was the Company and in the new story that monster has the very human face of one Peter Weyland. Why did the Engineers want to reboot Earth? dont know, but if I was planning more movies, I wouldnt spell it out in the first one, thats for sure.
Well, the company was always more behind the scenes evil monster corporation with a few agents here and there. The Spaihts script showed them as pretty straight-on exploitative before even knowing what they had found and I found that really interesting and the rest of the story should have followed up on that concept, turning the tables and if they needed horror, it should be caused by those actions, disabling the systems keeping the silo pyramid dormant.

The stripmining could then have linked directly to the shake-and-bake type colonies we hear about and see in ALIENS with the terraforming installation being reverse engineered from the Space Jockey tech... but even THAT was dropped.
 
I go on and on about the Star Wars prequels... sure, I can be called a hater... but when it comes down to it, I feel more like I was so severely disappointed and that is driving me to continue to talk about them, rather than me actually hating them. Same with the Terminator sequels and tv-series.

Just as well as those loving the movie wants to talk and talk and talk about it, it seems to me to be the same with movies that really disappoints. Movies people just plainly hates... well... sure, there are those who go on and on and on about that too... hmm... maybe my theory is flawed that it's only disappointed people continuing to voice their opinion. Yeah, never mind me.

I really dislike The Hobbit, a flawed rollercoaster adventure that was so bad it made me want to leave the theater. Many of you guys seem to be fine with it despite its flaws, so I see no point in saying its bad over and over. I can even say that maybe you see quality in it I missed, looking for "my" story after reading the book, and what I wanted it to be. For me its the opposite with Prometheus.

It is interesting that some films, like The Hobbit, gets under the nerd rage radar while others gets bashed and nitpicked endessly though.
 
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Because Prometheus is a film that constantly struggles to escape from beneath the weight of its own expectations, and lets be honest both they and for the fans of Alien were huge, given what the trailers and the constant references and glimpses to the design of the original suggested. It really did seem to be a true prequel right up until the last couple of weeks before its release, when suddenly the marketing “changed”. So its not surprising a lot of people who had so much respect for the first were left pretty disappointed with the newly finished product. I know I was. I never saw it again until the DVD came out. Then I liked it a little better, mostly for the fantastic design and a few set pieces but I still feel the most of the story and the inexplicable character behaviors let it down massively. No matter how many times I have watched it and how many theories I try I cannot make it work very well for me. It still feels as if we were promised a very definite gift then told at the last minute, we’ve brought you something else instead. It’s just a difficult thing to accept. Prometheus is a decent film, but ,perhaps unfairly ,I was looking for something far more brilliant, well thought out and written. And the hardest things we are ever likely to be able to forget (and forgive) are those promises we’ve personally invested a lot in that end up broken. And no matter how good it looks it is still very difficult to explain away some of the most controversial decisions and stupid actions its lead characters take right up to (and including ) the very end. I DON'T hate it, I just quietly despair it didn't turned out to be a better written ,well researched and thought out film. But then the documentaries go someway of explaining just why that happened.
 
Probably a flub but towards the end Shaw stumbles outside and is talking to David's head, shouldn't she be wearing a glove?

Was my second time seeing it, first was at the theater. It was still a great looking movie. I liked it better at home on my tv in 2D but that's me. I still like it as a sci-fi movie but it didn't show enough of the Alien universe that I like about the others or have the same feel.
 
Probably a flub but towards the end Shaw stumbles outside and is talking to David's head, shouldn't she be wearing a glove?

There's another flub in that scene. Note how Shaw's hair is fluttering as if wind was blowing against her hair. Quite impossible since she's wearing a helmet during this scene. We know it's not her suit doing that because we haven't seen the suits do this previously, and that the same wind is affecting David's hair. So the film makers actually forgot that this planet doesn't have breathable air when they shot the scene so they had to CGI the helmet in post.

Cripes, Adywan could have fixed that scene.
 
No matter how many times watching Prometheus,it just wont get bored,love it,oh my..oh my..Ridley what have you done.

Don
 
The whole atmosphere issue is a climatologists joke anyway. Firstly its immediately analyzed as being 71% Nitrogen, 21% Oxygen with trace gases. Then its commented that at a 3% CO2 concentration it is highly toxic.
There is so much wrong here I don’t even know where to start, but I’ll have a go.
First, that much free oxygen in the atmosphere absolutely should have had the biologist screaming “There is life down there!!!!” It’s the only way that oxygen can be sustainably replenished at that level, other wise ,as a highly reactive gas, it gets used up quickly. But nobody says a word.
Human beings can manage to breath CO2 at levels of 3% for days, though they will suffer an increased heart rate and a mild narcosis. At 5% they’ll suffer shortness of breath and at 8% they will slip into unconsciousness with in an hour, and eventual death.
So everyone on the Prometheus could happily run around outside naked and helmet less if they wanted (providing it wasn’t too cold) for days immediately after they landed. They would be more likely to suffer from hypothermia than breathing problems from the atmosphere, though those silicate storms, which are strong enough to gather sands ,small rocks and blow over vehicles would not do them much good. But hey, they didn’t leave a mark on those glass helmets or suits, so what the heck.
People would however be VERY susceptible to what ever biological process is producing all that oxygen, as its highly likely that photosynthetic life as well as microbial life already exists there. That’s why it would be a VERY bad idea to take your helmet off . Yet the atmosphere is described as sterile and yet there were worms living there to tread into the ampule room. Just what were they supposed to have be living on then?
It all makes Milliburn the most stupid and incompetent biologist in the universe ,who not only runs away from the greatest human scientific discovery ever ie the dead corpse of an intelligent alien organism but also that he also fails to notice and comment on all these other glaring clues hanging around that most college kids could pick up on.
Of course it is now possible to argue Fifield was now never a zombie, just rather badly burned human being “infected” the black slime and being changed into something, but why was that something not exactly like Holloways infection.
Incidentally the eye worm infection of Holloway is actually a direct lift from an existing biological parasite of Earth, Loa Loa Filariasis. It originates in West Africa and is known for its rather nasty habit of swimming across the eyeball, look it up, there are plenty of photos out there. So it was way more likely to have been in Shaw than him, though it is likely, given all the ancient sites they travelled to that he got bitten by a fly on Earth and carried it , rather than have been infected from the ampule room, but hey ,he did take his helmet off. And interestingly you do see a fly or some flying insect when Fifield reappears at the ramp and raises his head. Also the Hammerpede looks remarkably like the Hagfish, (again a terrestrial organism that produces a horrible amount of slime as a clever defense mechanism). Just why they show it regrowing its head in those ridiculous few seconds when they could just as easily had the second one attack instead is beyond me, but that’s the kind of thing thats the plaques this film.
Apparently there were supposed to be scientific advisors brought on at the cost of millions to this film to help with the realism , but if that’s the case then Ridley and Fox should sue them.
And that’s the issue with Prometheus for me. If its going to deal with the subject of engineering life on planets and Mankind it needed to have a basic grasp of the mechanics of biology, which it clearly didn’t. And that still pisses me off worse than anything else.Though I have to admit Shaws character behaviors just seems to get worse and more illogical the more times I watch it
 
I think that was more of a flub by the actor than anything else.. I believe the script said that the gas in question was carbon monoxide, not carbon dioxide. Hence, the "tailpipe" comment.
 
I think that was more of a flub by the actor than anything else.. I believe the script said that the gas in question was carbon monoxide, not carbon dioxide. Hence, the "tailpipe" comment.
There is no atmosphere described in Damon's draft, at least the one that got posted online as "final" did not have anything, and they did not use the description in Spaith's script, which just states there is nitrogen, methane, and sulfates. For that matter, none of the science data in the film is from Spaith's script, and there is no science data at all in Damon's, not even that "exhaust pipe" line. That pre-landing scene does not exist, so it seems to have been created while shooting, on set.

Probably a flub but towards the end Shaw stumbles outside and is talking to David's head, shouldn't she be wearing a glove?
She took her gloves off in the lifeboat. The scene of her taking them off was not used, but if you watch close just after she enters, you can see where they were removed.
 
She took her gloves off in the lifeboat. The scene of her taking them off was not used, but if you watch close just after she enters, you can see where they were removed.

Also, remember that huge axe Shaw had in the escape ship? You see her carrying it the whole time even when the "AIRLOCK BREACH" alert is raised. But when the Engineer comes storming after her, she's holding a tiny piece of metal in her right hand that she just drops. It's way too small to be that huge axe.
 
She took her gloves off in the lifeboat. The scene of her taking them off was not used, but if you watch close just after she enters, you can see where they were removed.

You're right but I was thinking more along she needed it because she's in space.
Vacuum or cold or some other science word, I don't think I'd leave my mitts on board while I roam around a rock.
 
It’s unlikely to be carbon monoxide with that much free oxygen in the atmosphere. Yes, both CO and CO2 come out of a car exhaust but the CO doesn’t hang around for long or else we’d all be dead on Earth by now, courtesy of our daily commutes and other fossil fuel dependencies. It would have also killed the helmetless engineer off very rapidly during his jaunty walk to the life boat. So, flub or not it just doesn’t work. Its just more evidence of the very poor science in Prometheus.
And as it was cold and horrible yesterday I watched both Alien and Prometheus back to back and it highlighted the differences and difficulties in both films more clearly to me.
Firstly even after thirty years the true beauty of the original film lies still with the truly “Alien” atmosphere it provokes. A strange planetoid, a fantastic space wreak ,terrifying evidence of a shockingly different alien life cycle beyond human comprehension and that brilliant Giger/lovecraftian design to the sets and creature that immediately captures the darker aspects of your horrified imagination. It was and still feels like nothing I’d ever seen before . You also get a feeling from the analysis Ash does that the creature the crew are dealing with is way beyond our normal range and knowledge of biochemistry and physical experience. So the decisions the crew make, whilst flawed ,as things go from bad to worse ,feel totally consistent with human nature as the chaos and panic mounts.
We are truly dealing with the Alien here.
Prometheus immediately bursts that bubble by using one of the oldest ideas and overused ideas in sci fi , ie ancient astronauts with periodic visitations to our ancient civilizations. That idea has been Stargated to hell for decades on television. In fact the longer and more times I’ve watched Prometheus the more I realized I was seeing a film filled with ideas lifted by writers who have obviously watched more sci fi from television than really read or written it. It feels so generic, an out of the box , scripted by numbers ,high budget /low concept movie. What saves it from being just another walk in the park are the brilliant production and design values, the superb effects work and some of the set pieces which are just wonderful to look at. And of course David as the unfailing polite,but murderously mechanical Lector android.
However, all the bad science aside it’s the character arcs and motivations that constantly work against the story.
Take Shaw an intelligent, committed woman of Christian faith with Mankind’s best interests presumably at heart. And focus of the story.
And yet ,after loosing her boyfriend to terrifying cellular corruption, escaping the chilling intentions of an android, having a terrifying and bloody forced alien abortion, convincing her shipmates to commit suicide by ramming a ship in order to STOP it getting to Earth and eventually being saved from strangulation by an Engineer (that clearly doesn’t give a damn about humanity) by her giant tentacled squiddie son, she then STILL wants to go FIND THE REST OF THEM to ANSWER her question. Which is
“Why do you want to now wipe out the human race.”
Is it just me or doesn’t this seem a particularly clever thing to do?
The one thing that this film clearly seems to indicate is that the human race has apparently only just survived a terrible apocalypse at the hands of the Engineers “weapons” because of a fortuitous accident two thousand years ago, and yet Shaw STILL wants to go , find the engineers and remind them the human race is still running around!!!
What the HELL is wrong with this woman?
This doesn’t make her look very bright, remotely heroic and more like angel of the apocalypse or a MOD (Moron of Death). Risking the entire future of humanity over what is a pretty philosophical question is a ridiculous course of action. But off she goes without hesitation , with only a beheaded, logically murderous robot for company on an alien ship which also presumably contains another deadly cargo of death with the same maps back to Earth.
All because SHE WANTS HER ANSWER!!
It is tantamount to somebody finding an abandoned nuclear silo plus missiles and asking loudly “Why haven’t we had a nuclear war yet?” yet insisting on continually jabbing their finger on the red launch button to see if they go off. Not very clever at all.
As a stand alone film without any links to the original it would work better, but only just. Having watched it a few times since on DVD, having almost totally divorced my belief that its connected Alien (by hitting the stop button before the chestburster scene at the end), I can just about make up a story in my head that makes it a better experience for me, explains many things away and leaves it open for a sequel. But that’s an awful lot of work for a two hour film and no other story in my experience has ever provoked and needed so much effort or examination. Even the Phantom Menace didn't cause me this much analysis. I just gave up on that. I think its because, despite all my complaints about it ,Prometheus is still a very descent film. I just wished it was better written and had a more critical eye cast across it before it got into production.
 
You're right but I was thinking more along she needed it because she's in space.
Vacuum or cold or some other science word, I don't think I'd leave my mitts on board while I roam around a rock.
She was not in a vacuum. The moon had an atmosphere, apparently at the same or similar pressure as Earth. She needed gloves no more than a diver needs to wear gloves when diving. They are also wearing second-skin suits, not gas filled suits, so losing air is not a major issue. Although Shaw was running out of air, but I think that was because she was passed out under the Juggernaut for a while.
 
I remain baffled as to why anyone, being a huge fan of the original Alien - particularly someone who is intrigued and delighted by the bizarre nature of the Space Jockey, and more particularly, someone to whom that element is supremely important and who would therefore take any bastardisation of it very badly indeed...why would that person subject himself to seeing Prometheus?
 
I only had two real problems with the movie, but they were kinda deal breakers for me.

One was when the ship was rolling like a huge doughnut on edge, and the women kept running straight ahead of it. After discussing it with my friends, I now know I'm not the only one who kept screaming "TURN TO EITHER SIDE!"

Second was when they made the statement of the human and engineer DNA being a perfect match? Really? Then why aren't we all 7 feet tall, build like a linebacker and have + shaped pupils?

Little things to some, maybe, but they really broke the movie for me.
 
No, it's the axe she drops.

If it didn't disappear, than where did it go?
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Maybe if we look at the room from further away, we'll be able to see it.

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That might be the axe..... but where did the struggling Engineer and Trip-whatever thing go?
 
That was a response to you stating she was holding a tiny piece of metal. Back up a few seconds before those snapshots you posted to the shot looking at Shaws back as the Engineer comes through the door and you can see the butt end of the axe handle in here hand for a split second and hear the sound of it hitting the floor when she drops it.

If you are asking why you can't see it on the floor in your screen caps, look closer at where she dropped it in the previous shot. It's probably just out of frame. If you want to see the whole scene and what she really does with the axe, watch the deleted scenes on the BR.
 
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