LOTR wizard question

[Sluis Van Shipyards]

I've been helping my nephew unlock things on the LEGO LOTR game and he was asking why Gandalf is grey then white, there's a guy named something like Radagast the Brown, etc.. What's the significance of the colors after their names? I thought it was something about how powerful they were because Gandalf comes back as white after he fights the Balrog. I couldn't find anything on the LOTR wiki and I've only seen the movies once, so I have no clue.

 

[Usagi Pilgrim]

Far from an expert, but as I understand it, the Wizards were a race called the Maiar. They were placed there to basically help against Sauron throughout the ages. The Wizards in Middle-Earth were a group called the Istari. Sauruman the White was the leader until he betrayed them by siding with Sauron.

When Galdalf 'died' after fighting the Balrog, he was sent back as Galdalf the White. He was now more powerful & able to take the leadership role as protector.

Originally there were 5 Wizards sent & had different colored robes. Radagast the Brown was too obsessed with the wildlife & nature & was barely mentioned throughout the stories & the other 2 really had nothing to do with anything.

Hope that helps:thumbsup

 

[0neiros]

Tolkien didn't bother to really talk about them, but it did take all 5 to drive "The Necromancer" aka Sauron out of Mirkwood, where he fled back to Mordor. It's
possible the others died in the battle and didn't/couldn't come back.

 

[Usagi Pilgrim]

Dang...forgot that it was all 5 there.:facepalm

 

[Organic Mechanic]

Alatar and Pallando, the blue Wizards, were busy with their own affairs in the East, and had been since they arrived upon Middle Earth.

There is no direct meaning to the robes colors in any of Tolkien's writings that I've seen. Save, that is, for White indicating the head of the White Council. A color Saruman had already abandoned before the mantle was passed to Gandalf. He had taken on the name Saruman of Many Colors.

Deep reading reveals that Saruman was never the greatest of the Istari, but gained his leadership role due political reasons. When the greatest of the Wizards, Gandalf, was given the third Elven Ring, the Flame of Arnor by Ciridan the Shipwright upon reaching Middle Earth for safe keeping Saruman's lust for power was born from his jealousy.

Also interesting: Sauron and the Balrog(s) were Maiar as well, only they were servants of the fallen Valar, Melkor.



***Sorry, I tend to ramble on the subject. :lol

 

[Darth Lars]

They were placed there to basically help against Sauron throughout the ages.

No, they would have arrived during the "third age", "only" a few hundred years before the war of the ring.

Originally there were 5 Wizards sent & had different colored robes. Radagast the Brown was too obsessed with the wildlife & nature & was barely mentioned throughout the stories & the other 2 really had nothing to do with anything.

The individual istari were servants of different Valar (demi-gods, sort of an analogy to arch-angels), where each Vala had a different speciality, and therefore each istar's character reflects that of its Vala.

 

[Organic Mechanic]

No, they would have arrived during the "third age", "only" a few hundred years before the war of the ring.


The individual istari were servants of different Valar (demi-gods, sort of an analogy to arch-angels), where each Vala had a different speciality, and therefore each istar's character reflects that of its Vala.

This! :thumbsup

 

[Sluis Van Shipyards]

Thanks. That's the other question, what are the ages. In the game they have Elrond Second Age (which I assume is when they first fought Sauron in the movie) and then Elrond Third Age which is at the time of the movies. Does it refer to when Sauron comes back or what?

 

[DuneMuadDib]

The Ages are broken up based upon significant events. The First Age started with the rise of the Sun and the Awakening of Men and ended with the overthrow of Morgoth. The Second Age was from the overthrow of Morgoth to the first defeat of Sauron. The Third Age started with the first defeat of Sauron, and ended when the Ring-bearers departed Middle-earth. Tolkien suggested we would now be in the Seventh Age which would have started at the end of WWII.

All these Ages are Years of the Sun. Previously it had been Years of the Trees and before that the Years of the Lamps (which had their own Ages).

It's also worth noting that at least the Hobbits had their own calendar.

 

[DuneMuadDib]

No, they would have arrived during the "third age", "only" a few hundred years before the war of the ring.

The Istari arrived in about TA 1000, so more like a couple thousand years before the War of the Ring

 

[Usagi Pilgrim]

No, they would have arrived during the "third age", "only" a few hundred years before the war of the ring.


The individual istari were servants of different Valar (demi-gods, sort of an analogy to arch-angels), where each Vala had a different speciality, and therefore each istar's character reflects that of its Vala.

...OK...thanks.

 

[SmilingOtter]

And as another bit of trivia, when the events of LOTR occur, Arwen is a youthful 2700 years old, Elrond is 6000, and Galadriel (Elrond's mother-in-law) is literally older than the sun and moon.

 

[Sluis Van Shipyards]

I'm going to stick this question in here instead of doing another thread. I re-watched the movies and was wondering, does Legolas have some kind of magic quiver or did they just figure the audience wouldn't notice he fires hundreds of arrows? :lol

Also my nephew was asking about getting an extended version of the movies because he looked up the Mouth of Sauron (because he's in the LEGO LOTR game) and it said he's in extended scenes. Is it a bunch of scenes or not worth getting another version? My sister just has the regular versions of the movies.

 

[DuneMuadDib]

It's no different from any movie where a cowboy fires 15 rounds from a revolver without reloading, just a Hollywood convention you ignore. Pretty sure there's a scene or two of Legolas grabbing spent arrows out of downed orcs or the ground too.

The extended cuts add 30 minutes to FotR, 42 to TT, and 50 to RotK. It's entirely worth getting if you're into the story and want to see more. If you can barely sit through the films with their theatrical run times you probably should pass.

 

[Metaluna mutant]

I'm going to stick this question in here instead of doing another thread. I re-watched the movies and was wondering, does Legolas have some kind of magic quiver or did they just figure the audience wouldn't notice he fires hundreds of arrows? :lol

Also my nephew was asking about getting an extended version of the movies because he looked up the Mouth of Sauron (because he's in the LEGO LOTR game) and it said he's in extended scenes. Is it a bunch of scenes or not worth getting another version? My sister just has the regular versions of the movies.

There is at least one scene in the book Two Towers where Legolas mentions "scrounging for arrows" on the battlefields. But the movie? Nope, it's a magic bow, like the old western "six-guns" which shoot every episode of the cliffhanger serials without reloading.

The Mouth of Sauron is only in one scene, when he taunts Aragorn outside the Black Gate. He lies, saying Frodo is dead (he shows them Frodo's captured mithril mail) which makes pisses off Aragorn they fight, which, dramatically makes no sense.

In the book, the Mouth taunts them saying they had CAPTURED Frodo so scram or he gets it. In the movie he boasts of having KILLED Frodo which just pisses off Aragorn and he starts the battle.

While it's a interesting addition, the Mouth of Sauron is far more charismatic and sinister in the book than the leather clad monster-version in the movie. The fate of Saruman is a better reason to see the ROTK ext Edition. Again, different from the book, but still pretty good.

As for Wizards' colors, no significance. The 2 "east wizards" were a duo, both the same shade of blue (sea-blue), and both sent together to bypass Gondor, Rohan, Elves etc and go much further east into parts unknown ("Enemy territory" Tolkien called it) and fight the enemy.

Even Tolkien only had vague ideas about what to do with them. In some writings Tolkien says the failed & even helped the enemy (like Saruman) and other writings he says they succeeded and actually kept FAR more eastern Empires from joining Sauron in the final battles. Take your pick.

 

[Sluis Van Shipyards]

Thanks! I think he just thought the character looked cool and wanted to see him in the movie. My sister's copies are scratched and skip so I'll tell her to pick up the ext. editions when she replaces them.

 

[Fosse]

I've been helping my nephew unlock things on the LEGO LOTR game and he was asking why Gandalf is grey then white, there's a guy named something like Radagast the Brown, etc.. What's the significance of the colors after their names? I thought it was something about how powerful they were because Gandalf comes back as white after he fights the Balrog. I couldn't find anything on the LOTR wiki and I've only seen the movies once, so I have no clue.

Great game! Anyways, it's basically a ranking system. IIRC.....brown>blue>gray>white.

Saruman is initially 'higher up' than Gandalf (before the Balrgog incident), so once Gandalf comes back and is revealed to be a white wizard, that's why everyone, especially Saruman is so shocked. He now is powerful enough to face Saruman (though that never directly happens) because he's of equal ranking.

Radagast is usually looked down upon for his unusual behavior and his low "ranking" (I know I keep using ranking, but that's not exactly what it is), 'cause he's only brown.

The books don't ever truly explain this, it's just kinda implied. Like leveling up and getting new armor ^^