ICONS Authentic Replicas Interview clip?

[James Latta]

Yes, I believe so. Terry had been very good about keeping originals from his films at that point. He only had a few original Armor sets left from Aliens in 1996 as he had sold the others over the years. He was very pleased and proud of having worked on Aliens. As it was such an instant classic. So he held on to the Hudson from what he explained.

However, one would have to do the screen-grab research like all of you on the RPF are so good at, to verify if the Hudson armor 100% lines up as screen-used.

One thing I learned from my 8 years at Planet Hollywood, if it comes down to paying your mortgage or not? A Film pro will put a story behind a piece as being "original" if they have to. And they will sign a letter of authenticity whether it is real or not. Just because they have a screen credit does not mean they are honest. This is a sad truth to realize. Not saying this applies to Terry. Just saying one needs to be mindful of that when doing the research. As many of you know.

During my friendship with Terry, and seeing firsthand what he endured when working on various movies and hearing his stories, he would often say that it was not worth it. Working in the Film industry. All the stress, lies, politics, egos and borderline lunacy. But he said there were those special moments...like when the lights first went down in the movie theater when he saw his armor work in Excalibur...that he said is WAS worth it. All the pain and suffering. And that it was like magic. Sure he felt the same way about Aliens.

 

[James Latta]

When I was working on The Abyss with the Skotak Bros. who won 3 Academy Awards working with James Cameron on Visual Effects, Bob Skotak was recollecting about his special effects work on Aliens. He told me they were working 18 hour days shooting Aliens ( practical miniatures / forced perspective as you know ). And when they returned from filming in the U.K., Bob was suffering from complete exhaustion. As they read his name to come up to the podium to accept his Academy Award for best VFX for Aliens, he started to feel queasy as he walked on camera down the aisle to the stage. And thought for sure he would pass out at any moment and collapse in front of the world. He said he barely stayed concious as he made his speech. Never forgot that story.

 

[ghostryder]

Awesome, thanks Jim!

I owned a set of Hick's armor acquired from the remains of the Alien Wars attraction in London. ( < this find is an interesting story. )

Love to hear it too!

 

[rollerboi]

Okay, now you guys have peaked my interest. Who is this GUY RAZ person, is that his real name, or just a handle, and what is his background? I tried to search on this site, but got every post with the word 'GUY' or "RAT" in it.

That's his name. He initially went by "Razmeister" on the boards. A real piece of crap, his tactics involved keeping detailed records on just about everyone and there have been multiple instances where he took disagreements from the RPF into the real world, threatening peoples' jobs, families, and livelihoods. He was a pathological sort of person.

Guy Raz, who served 3 years in a Federal Prsion for cyber-stalking a 12 year old girl, is the one who spearheaded the FBI investigation into Icons and helped sabotage our public offering.

He was a Hebrew teacher, I believe, at a Jewish school, and that girl was one of his students. Her coming of age spurred him to cross the line, and he arranged the meetup at the local public library with the intent to.. well, he was arrested by federal agents with flowers and condoms on his person. Let's just leave it at that.

Raz posted here for years after his ban, under a sockpuppet account named Proprunner.
Really a ****ed up individual.

Yes, he was banned from here for being a divisive individual who threatened people offline, if I remember correctly. The pedophilia arrest was just the icing on the cake there. So he comes back, right, and insinuates himself back into the community as "Gabe" - to the point where members invited him to visit them at their homes.. members with children who were horrified when he was unmasked.

IMO, that has furthered the schism many of us now feel in the community by eroding even more of the "general trust".

It is pretty much a given that he's here somewhere, lurking, reading, taking notes, and preparing to attempt to re-enter the community if he has not already done so. This is part of the reason many of us are quick to question new members knowing too much about old history, or even asking curious questions. There are always signs and they always emerge. Raz cannot hide forever, and his hubris will be his downfall time and time again. I like to think of him as a fly, a buzzing gnat that keeps getting reincarned back into a fly and always returning to the same pile of poo. He can't help who or what he is, and I believe he is incapable of breaking his own cycles.

 

[James Latta]

Thanks so much Rollerboi for that overview of Raz. It saved me the nausea of having to do so. Dealing with him was one of the strangest and most surreal experiences of my life. And for him to surface when he did, in Icons final 6 months, and become the head of the Icons customer group was beyond damaging to not only Icons, but the customers. As he was secretly on the prop payroll of 3 individuals who wanted Icons licenses. And in the end...they got them. Not Steve D. by the way. He loathed Raz too as he posted.

If not for members of the RPF at the time, it would have been much, much worse with Raz. As they stepped in in the end and coordinated much of the defense against his complete lunacy.

What you may not know is Raz lost his job at an aerospace firm where he was working, due to phone-calls being made to his work by Icons customers who were upset with his antics. As he was sending out threatening emails from his place of work with his corporate name and contact info on them. He was promptly fired. That lead to him becoming a substitue teacher at the Jewish Religious school and eventually stalking the 12 year old girl. Reading the court documents of what transpired with her was chilling. He was desperately trying to groom her. She was very brave in how she handled them.

Strangest thing of all...when the story broke, I was called by an Icons customer and told to pick up a copy of the Los Angeles Times Newspaper. Where Raz made major headlines. And his news story was on page number....B-9 ( Like the Robot ! ) It was almost as if it was meant to be.

 

[James Latta]

Thanks Willie. Will do on the telling of the Alien Wars story. It involves tracking down a shipping container that held the full-size Alien Queen Warrior puppet and full-size Power Loader and much more. That was not where it was supposed to be and could have been lost at any time. Again..just being at the right place at the right time.

 

[greylocke]

James , I have to tell you from the Guy Raz thing to the aliens back story and Excaliber nuggets, I am beyond fascinated. Please keep the history coming.

 

[propmaster2000]

edit page 02-21-12

.

 

[ghostryder]

Thanks Willie. Will do on the telling of the Alien Wars story. It involves tracking down a shipping container that held the full-size Alien Queen Warrior puppet and full-size Power Loader and much more. That was not where it was supposed to be and could have been lost at any time. Again..just being at the right place at the right time.

Awesome - can't wait to hear it...

 

[IFA]

Waouhhhhhhh....really nice drawing...I LOVE it

I can recognize Al Zequeira and Larry Taylor....maybe JL is at the center of the drawing...also maybe Tone !!!
Great piece, thanks for showing it

Good morning Jim,

I too enjoy reading this thread and want to thank you for sharing your history here.


I thought maybe you and the other readers would get a kick out of seeing this picture
which was drawn by a very talented artist in the ICONS graphic dept.

I know a few of their names, but not all since I never met them personally:

Have a good day


.

 

[Zorger]

Wow.

I'm Petsku, a movie prop collector from Finland - finally became a member here just a while ago.

Never, ever thought I'd see this - this is a real trip down memory lane for me as well...

I too started my movie prop/replica hobby because of Icons way back in 1996 or so, when I first saw their ad in a movie magazine or other.

A year or two later from that day, I bought my first ever prop from Icons, the Luke Skywalker lightsaber (but unfortunately never got it).

I remember calling Icons many times from Finland - I might have even talked to you on the phone, James.

I don't hold a personal grudge because I simply don't know what actually happened, but I have to say this is all incredibly fascinating to read.

I for one am glad this is happening because we're documenting history here.

In 2000 I bought a Timeless Collectibles Endo Skull #76 which I still own and would of course very much like to hear more about Timeless Collectibles:

* The Timeless debacle ( which involved armed guards, Albert Einstein, and the largest SEC stock spam investigation in American history ) ( 2000 )

And James, if you have any information about a company called "Peerless Design Studios" I would love to hear it - I've wondered about them for years, do they have *anything* to do with Icons/Timeless?

In 2001 (or 2002) I stumbled upon their official web site where they announced they had acquired the Terminator 2 license, and to honor its 15th anniversary they produced an extremely limited number of T2 items, like their version of Endo Arms.

This is a pic I managed to find on my computer from way back then that I had saved straight off from their website all those years ago:

That picture sold the item to me, and I still have it (I've posted pics of my actual piece in my gallery).

The product was much more expensive than Icons' or Timeless' earlier offerings, brand new their Endo Arm cost $2,000 - but it was extremely appealing to me because it came with the whole tube, base with lights, etc.

(Unfortunately I never received a certificate of authenticity with it, my edition number is #7/45)

I've always wondered about them but was never able to find much if any information about them anywhere, but always suspected they were somehow tied to Icons and/or Timeless.

Whatever the case, thank you for sharing all the information with us James, this is extremely fascinating to me, and probably everyone else who wants to know about the industry's history, and early days...

Petsku
("Zorger")

 

[propmaster2000]

edit 02-21-12.

 

[James Latta]

propmaster2000 - Thank you so, so much for posting that amazing drawing rendered by the BRILLIANT Tone Rodriguez. Who after leaving Icons went on to become a star in the Comic Book industry as you must know. A giant talent as well as a giant guy. And one of the kindest and coolest artists I've ever had the good fortune of working with.

Here is a bit of background on Tone. He was hired as a Runner initially for Icons. And became friends with Icons Fabrication & Design Group. The equally gifted Brian Bero and Tone began hanging out at lunch at Icons. Bero's always wanted to work on a re-boot of Battlestar Galactica as a TV series ( < another great story which involved Richard Hatch aka "Apollo" ). Brian asked tone to doodle a Cylon one day at lunch on the top of a work table covered with brown paper ( to protect from paint and solvents and such. ) Tone rendered a Cylon head quickly and it was most impressive. Tone's speed is mind-blowing.

I was walking to my office and was speaking to Brian about a manufacturing problem or something like that and looked down onto the brown paper and Tone's rendering caught my eye. I asked who drew it and Brian told me "Tone did. Our runner." And I was like "What?" I asked Brian to ask Tone to bring in his portfolio the next day, met with Tone and was shocked at the level of his extraordinary talent. So I immediately promoted him to the illustrator at Icons for product development. Gave him his own office and set it up as an art studio. He was able to take meetings in his office with a comic book publisher at lunch and after work, about pursuing his ultimate dream, drawing comics. Eventually he ended up rendering I.P. ( Intellectual Properties ) as Icons was lead towards developing it's own properties prior to the planned IPO ( Initial Public Offering ).

Seeing those faces remdinds me of the incrediblty talented and friendly artisans who worked at Icons. Many were and still are geniuses and went on to reach great heights and achievement. As independents and at other collectible companies including the legendary Gentle Giant. Which produceds ( as you all know ) some of the most impressive product ever made.

Very pleased to see those faces again. Should be easy to Identify most of them. Tone could have easily been a lead artist at MAD magazine. He often kept us laughing with his humorous renderings of the staff. And even I was not spared. lol. Although I am not in depicted in that drawing. That was "The Crew."

 

[James Latta]

Greeting Zorger. Thanks so much for your post. I am sorry for what happened to you with Icons. Please pm me directly.

The Rise & Fall of "Peerless" collectibles, which followed the demise of Timeless, involves a colorful group of characters, a suicide. Playboy, Hugh Hefner and a convicted Felon.

So I will recap that as well here soon. Perhaps there are lessons to be learned from what happened. Or some may find it at least entertaining to read.

I want to express my great thanks again for even being permitted to post on this RPF thread. I know I am being shown great class, mercy and major understanding by being allowed to share my story, after 12 years of silence. Again, my sincerest apologies to all I am offending by commenting here. I will not post on any other thread and know that I am not being accepted as part of the community.

 

[James Latta]

The genius in the lower exact middle of the Tone Icons Crew drawing is reading this thread. He was the head of Icons electronics department and went on to work in the film industry these past 12 - 13 years after the company closed at a highly respected prop shop. I know he will remember some of the names of the people shown in the drawing.

That is Tone in the exact middle of the drawing. Perhaps we could number the images.

Tone really captured the essence of each person who worked at Icons back in the day in the image. The one he rendered of me is spot on and very funny. Depicting myself and an encounter with the one and only Paul Francis. Which we laughed over many times during difficult times. Tone's talent kept us smiling. He inspired us and motivated us with his many gifts.

 

[Zorger]

Thanks again for sharing, James.

Greeting Zorger. Please pm me directly.

Pm sent.

Seeing you reminisce about that drawing propmaster2000 posted, recognizing the guys in it, remembering their stories (how the guy who drew it got to eventually realize his dream - drawing comics), well, that strikes a certain chord with me, because I've been doing what I love for 20+ years now and still remember every single colleague I ever worked with and shared my passion with...

Regardless of all that went wrong, I believe there are some real human stories to be told here... whatever the hardships and failures, there were people who genuinely loved what they were doing, believed in it, and it showed in their work.

Without movies, none of us would be here now, discussing props, replicas, etc. and sharing amazing stories with one another.

As a game designer I've been surrounded by like-minded creative people for the past 20 years, and the hardships we've faced, the ups and downs, "crunching" (means working without resting for many days straight, etc.) to get a finished *great* product out for people to enjoy... we faced those moments together, and I have some seriously treasured memories of all those times and the people who were there to make it happen.

That's why I believe that despite everything that went wrong with Icons, there are still some real human stories behind to tell, and so I think it's fantastic that some of those stories are getting heard and some important prop and replica collecting history is now getting documented here for all to see.

I apologize but I'll always be a child at heart - I don't think l'll ever really "grow up" - and the child in me wants to believe that people who originally came up with the idea of giving everyone a chance to "own a piece of movie magic" straight out of the movies they so beloved, wouldn't actually go through all the sheer trouble if in the end all they really wanted was just to "run with the money".

But that may be just me - heh, the kid in me still looks at every single prop I have like it's the greatest thing in the world, better than any toys I ever saw... actual pieces from my favorite movies, somehow making them seem "more real".

And now this:

The Rise & Fall of "Peerless" collectibles, which followed the demise of Timeless, involves a colorful group of characters, a suicide. Playboy, Hugh Hefner and a convicted Felon.

...This I gotta hear! Been wondering about Peerless for years now, finally some light to be shed!

Best Regards,
Petsku
("Zorger")

 

[propmaster2000]

edit 02-21-12

 

[micdavis]

07 has to be Al Z.

...and "my" robot is in there.

 

[micdavis]

From my perspective.

I had a dozen professional parts manufacturers lined up to make B9 parts. All I had to do was make a dozen phone calls and I would have had 25 sets of parts ready to assemble every two weeks delivered to Icons. I had all the toolng and artwork (some of which Icons used later with my permission) in hand as I had already made two of them.

When Doug Conaway, not James Latta decided to make them in house I knew it would put them under and it did.

I stood toe to toe with Conaway in a meeting and told him so. He had no idea what he was getting into. Jim knew what he was doing when he called me.

If it weren't for a mere $35,000 down payment there would be 250 LIS B9 Robots in the world. I could have extended, on my own authority, all the credit they would have needed to finish the parts. I had that much control on what I did at my job. Just needed the start-up money.

Now I know virtually nothing about the internal working of Icons, but from my perspective it was Conaway that was the weasel. Just my impression.

I wasn't the highest grossing sales guy because I don't know how to read people.

 

[James Latta]

Propmaster - Thanks for putting some names to the numbers on Tone's drawings. I am making a list too of the others, unless someone beats me to it. A great group of people. A family at that point.

Mike, I 100% remember that day when you stood toe to toe with Doug Conway at Icons ( the founding President & CEO 1995-1998) and tried to set him straight. I always believed that Icons needed someone with your engineering and fabrication knowledge to make the full-size B-9 Lost in Space Robot dream a reality. The amazing work you were doing professionally at the time for massive corporate clients spoke for itself.

When Doug could not come to terms with you Mike, on what was a very fair and logical proposal on your part and your design & fabrication company in San Diego, my heart literally sunk in my chest. And the rest is history. We were too backed up with prototyping and backorders at Icons as everyone knows, and we really needed outsouring supervised under very capable hands. And your skill and capabilities were very well respected by our entire fabrication and manufacturing team. And your passion for the B-9 was very evident in the functioning B-9 you built and displayed at Comic Con in 1996. Which lead to my asking you to come in to Icons.

What happend to Doug after the fall of Icons, and his activities at his next start-up company supports your opinion of him. A 20 MILLION dollar fine from the California Department of Corporations.