HAPPY 30th ANNIVERSARY ESB!!!
- Thread starter GINO
- Start date
jedimaster
Sr Member
I think Empire had the best posters too.
GINO
Sr Member
I think for me this is the case as well.
The movie ended in shambles. Han was gone and Luke just got his *$$ handed to him. And as a bonus kick to the nuts, we find out Ben lied to Luke, and Vader is Luke's father.
I remember as a kid wondering how this very grim situation could ever be rectified.
And that's the point right?
That end sequence of ESB, especially with the music etc... is so hauntingly full of the uncertainty of whats to come.
And back then, there were no spoilers, no internet. Three hard long years (which seemed like an eternity as a kid) everyone was speculating, playing out possible resolution scenarios with their action figures, and we didn't know what was going to happen until actually sitting in the theatre for ROTJ.
I think it's great when a particular movie in a series ends under dire curcumstances.
Leaves you on the edge of your seat desperate for a resolution.
sebastian
Well-Known Member
I have to echo Gino. My favorite part of ESB was being left hanging with so much in shambles and having to wait so long for some resolution. I still remember seeing my first preview for ROTJ and seeing Leia looking around the side of the bunker-was she hot or what?
I also remember getting into a fight with a 'friend' who had read the ROTJ book before I saw the movie and told me about 'sister'.
Anyway, I like ANH the best for many reasons primarily because it has influenced my life in so many ways. I also liked the dice hanging from the cockpit in the MF, I have a pair in my truck to remind me of that on a daily basis.
Cheers
Sebastian
I also remember getting into a fight with a 'friend' who had read the ROTJ book before I saw the movie and told me about 'sister'.
Anyway, I like ANH the best for many reasons primarily because it has influenced my life in so many ways. I also liked the dice hanging from the cockpit in the MF, I have a pair in my truck to remind me of that on a daily basis.
Cheers
Sebastian
Empire is the *perfect* middle act.
Characters, setting, conflicts, plot have all been established by ANH (and I still don't like that term! :lol)
I remember having an 'unofficial' day of school with a friend to see the first screening in my home town.
For me, the asteroid sequence is one of, if not the most pure forms of science fiction / fantasy ever committed to film.
A hero, a princess, a robot and an alien aboard a ship chased though the asteroids at break-neck speed.
The scene where the falcon sweeps up to the camera with that tell-tale roar - the TIE fighter pilot flung from his ship as it impacts an asteroid, only to tumble across the frame head over heels, busting into flames.
The magnificent Williams score.
The characters all saying, 'Closer?!' in turn.
Absolutely brilliant, sadly never to be matched in any SW movie by either style, direction, editing or substance.
Bravo!
Of course there are a few niggles with the film - not that I'm prepared to go into them now, as this is a celebration thread, not a critique thread.
Saying that - there are flaws in all films, whatever their subject - there's no such thing as perfection, although SW and TESB come very close! :cool
And, I'll admit it - after all of the above, I'm still an ANH guy. Simply because viewing that movie as a 12 year old changed me, made me into the fan I am today, led me along the dark path to this place! :lol
Many soon to be happy returns, THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK.
Characters, setting, conflicts, plot have all been established by ANH (and I still don't like that term! :lol)
I remember having an 'unofficial' day of school with a friend to see the first screening in my home town.
For me, the asteroid sequence is one of, if not the most pure forms of science fiction / fantasy ever committed to film.
A hero, a princess, a robot and an alien aboard a ship chased though the asteroids at break-neck speed.
The scene where the falcon sweeps up to the camera with that tell-tale roar - the TIE fighter pilot flung from his ship as it impacts an asteroid, only to tumble across the frame head over heels, busting into flames.
The magnificent Williams score.
The characters all saying, 'Closer?!' in turn.
Absolutely brilliant, sadly never to be matched in any SW movie by either style, direction, editing or substance.
Bravo!
Of course there are a few niggles with the film - not that I'm prepared to go into them now, as this is a celebration thread, not a critique thread.
Saying that - there are flaws in all films, whatever their subject - there's no such thing as perfection, although SW and TESB come very close! :cool
And, I'll admit it - after all of the above, I'm still an ANH guy. Simply because viewing that movie as a 12 year old changed me, made me into the fan I am today, led me along the dark path to this place! :lol
Many soon to be happy returns, THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK.
Last edited:
DeLucks Designs
Well-Known Member
It's gotta be ESB. At the time, you just didn't know where the story was going. It could have gone in many directions, and left you craving more. It was SO dark, and each character was in peril. It's rare the "the bad guys" get thier day, but they certainly did here.
On a personal note, that particular moment when Fett is first seen, BAD A$$. My Fett obsession hasn't let up a bit since....
On a personal note, that particular moment when Fett is first seen, BAD A$$. My Fett obsession hasn't let up a bit since....
Pro’s/Props: ESB Darth Vader
Sophisticated glossy look
The ESB Vader props show a more refined and sophisticated look to the dark lord. With more complexity compared to a more basic ANH costume. Some may prefer the glossier image over a more subdued and partly hand painted beaten up paint scheme.
Chestbox is more complex
The Chestbox is a significant set up from ANH. It is far more complex with greeblies (parts) and it lights up giving the dark lord some apparatus that looks like it is functional and breathing for him. This ESB Chestbox is amongst many people’s favourite design which further inspired the ROTJ Chestbox.
Armour worn over the robes
After the original Vader display was in the Star Wars Room at the World science convention in Kansas in 1976 some of the feedback was that the set up looked meaner and better showing the armour over the robes. Although the original ANH costume went on tour for some time after with the robes displayed how they were in ANH, the look came about in Empire featuring the new dress code, which has since featured for Vader in all the other movies. Some like the unique ANH style but Vader is associated with the robes under the armour.
ESB look carried over
The props from Return of the JedI and to a small extent Revenege of the Sith (Glossy paint scheme, armour over robes, etc) follow more in line to the look of ESB Vader when compared to A New Hope. Meaning they get to see similar style props on screen for a greater period of time which extends the ESB look to Vader in 2 out of the 3 original movies.
Con’s:
Inconsistency
The true Hero set up is very scattered on screen to a point of not sharing much screen time. 2 different helmets and 2 cape sets make up the ESB hero as well as things like the armour subtle differences so linking a particular favourite look to a scene is harder than it is compared to ANH. The stunt set takes up a more consistent chunk in one go and inter-cut with hero shots, featuring some props mixed with the wrong piece. The Hero’s are also mixed at times due to later edited material being inserted. To cover all the ESB Vader’s you have to give credit to 3 predominantly different set ups give or take , unlike ANH which is mainly just one costume.
Refined Look
The helmet is more refined to an extent than ANH. The brows show more which makes the Empire Vader look softer with the cut peak and raised dome. The dome is more polished than ANH in appearance without it being dulled down. Both tusks have been installed and the armour is outside and more shiny than ANH Vader. Accommodating this look is the more handsome chestbox and more up to date looking belt box components. However, this look shows Vader isn’t as battle worn and may be perceived like he doesn’t do as much, even though the costume is far from pristine. It's actually fairly beat up. The movie shows us Vader just doesn't sit around in it that's for sure.
Flipped scenes relating to paint
Empire suffers from various flipped scenes, although ANH also features them it is not to the severe degree of Empire. These are shown in some Star Destroyer scenes, the Palpatine Hologram conference, the duel and later on at the end with Luke. This also may be why some companies have painted the gunmetal on the incorrect cheek, as they used one of these scenes as a guide, once again it‘s inconsistency.
Pro’s/Movie: ESB Darth Vader
Killing Admiral Ozzel
Some may say the little finger gesture to Motti was impressive, but here Vader causally chats with his new Admiral while strangling his victim without raising a finger, they aren't even in the same room.
Hoth
Like in ANH, Vader gets to go to Hoth himself to collect his rebels, displaying on from ANH that he isn’t one to let the hired help do all the work.
Dagobah
While definitely not a moment for Vader the darkness of this scene and the defeat of the Dark Lord is impressive, sometimes you like to see you’re favourite bad guy defeated, even for a brief moment to know how much they can tolerate before they are finally defeated, even if an illusion.
Killing Captain Needa
Another effortless performance from Vader. Displaying that he won’t tolerate failure, if this is hinted at in ANH he really shows who the boss is by killing people in his own team. You just knew as soon as Needa was going to “personally apologise” face to face that Vader was going to kill him.
Bounty Hunters
This shows yet again that Vader thinks outside the box and where he think’s the Empire is failing him he recruit’s the help of Bounty Hunters. The addition of the hunters is a bonus to the movie but shows Vader is the one controlling everything.
Bespin Confrontation
One of my favourite scenes of all time. There’s such a calmness and confidence to Vader. We had seen laser bolts kill a vast majority of people throughout the movies up till then where as on Vader, he causally sticks out one hand and absorbs/deflects the effect with ease, removing Solo’s weapon with the force followed by the delivery “We would be honoured if you would join us”. And you thought Han was cocky, Classic!
Duel
The duel picks up pace from ANH. Vader is causal for much of the start (as he has been the whole movie while not breaking a sweat, until now), toying with Luke, using one hand, looking effortless, before Luke starts passing his tests. The 2nd act of the 3 act duel shows Vader’s power with his mind making the character of Darth Vader ever more powerful. Forget the Prequels, go back to 1980 and compare the movies. This was a great display from Vader. Cue round 3 he starts turning up the heat and after a point of frustration it’s time to end the game. Great duel and a massive step up in action on from the ANH Duel.
Confession
This normally rates in the top 10 of movie shockers in many polls around the world. Before the Prequels this put a vital twist on the original movies. It gave another dimension to Vader. Some thought he was lying just to get Luke to join the Darkside and over throw the Emperor until it was confirmed 3 years later in Jedi.
One Liners
Some die hard fans may not care for the in cheek humour that Vader displays but some of his quotes from Empire go hand in hand as the most memorable. Vader’s timing of his actions with the delivery is priceless. It gave the ESB Vader a more human image although wicked streak. Enhancing his evilness as a villain.
Character Development (regarding 1980)
You get to see another side of Vader that is more established thanks to the story line. We now know he is not a complete cyborg but a human. The mystique is still present as you don't see him unmasked while we've been teased in the Med Chamber shot.
Con’s:
One Liner’s
Some may view the Vader one liners as classic, others view them as corny and non humorous.
I am your Father
We have all had time to adjust to George Lucas’s developed storyline but back in 1980, some people preferred the idea of Vader killing Luke’s Father, Not being his Father.
Most memorable lines in the movie:
“He’s as clumsy as he is stupid“.
“Apology Excepted, Captain Needa”
“Don’t fail me again, Admiral”.
“There will be a substantial reward for the one who finds the Millennium Falcon. You are free to use any methods necessary but I want them alive - No disintegrations“!
“We would be honoured if you would join us“.
“I am altering the deal. Pray I don't alter it any further”
“The force is with you, young Skywalker, but you are not a Jedi yet“.
“All too easy”.
“Impressive, most impressive”.
“There is no escape. Don't make me destroy you.”
“If you only knew the power of the Dark Side”
“Join me, and together we can rule the galaxy as father and son“.
“No! I, am your Father”.
Movie Portrayal Summary- ESB Vader:
Some say ANH is Luke’s movie, ESB is Vader’s movie and ROTJ is the Emperor’s movie. Those would be the guys that would receive Oscars.
Picking up 3 years after ANH, Vader is back and meaner than ever. When Star Wars first came on the scene in 1977 villains like Vader took off far more than what George Lucas expected. However, I wonder if not for the portrayal in Empire though whether Vader would be amongst the best villains of all time today? Vader would’ve still been considered a great villain I have no doubt there but not perhaps as cementing his role in our minds as he did after Empire. In Return of the JedI, while still the evil guy that we know it’s only off the back foot of Empire that he gets that form of credibility. Empire set it up so that in JedI (apart from the duel )he didn’t have to do anything other than to develop into the torn Anakin Vader while he isn’t bowing at the Emperor’s feet, he just has to hint at being Vader and we recall what a nasty **** he can be. Credit still goes to ANH Vader with the character building from that foundation.
Vader is free to reign without Tarkin in ESB. Doing evil deeds, in his flashy Star Destroyer containing his little Meditation Chamber, with his own theme (Imperial March) playing every time he’s on screen. He almost seems at times not in control and he paints a picture of a villain throughout, so much so that many people thought for 3 years until JedI came out that he was lying about being Luke’s Father.
The deflection of Han’s lazer bolts, the finger pointing to “All too easy” and imperial officers dropping like flies (well), it’s Vader at his best with a combination of many points that make up a truly great Villain. With the exception of the ANH Vader face (perhaps costume additionally) being meaner looking, this movie is what propelled the character of Darth Vader into one of the best Villains of all time still more than 30 years on and perhaps the epitome of what he represents if you ignore the Prequels.
ESB Vader Is definitely the reason why I personally liked Vader throughout my childhood and continue to naturally do so (along with ANH I might add).
Sophisticated glossy look
The ESB Vader props show a more refined and sophisticated look to the dark lord. With more complexity compared to a more basic ANH costume. Some may prefer the glossier image over a more subdued and partly hand painted beaten up paint scheme.
Chestbox is more complex
The Chestbox is a significant set up from ANH. It is far more complex with greeblies (parts) and it lights up giving the dark lord some apparatus that looks like it is functional and breathing for him. This ESB Chestbox is amongst many people’s favourite design which further inspired the ROTJ Chestbox.
Armour worn over the robes
After the original Vader display was in the Star Wars Room at the World science convention in Kansas in 1976 some of the feedback was that the set up looked meaner and better showing the armour over the robes. Although the original ANH costume went on tour for some time after with the robes displayed how they were in ANH, the look came about in Empire featuring the new dress code, which has since featured for Vader in all the other movies. Some like the unique ANH style but Vader is associated with the robes under the armour.
ESB look carried over
The props from Return of the JedI and to a small extent Revenege of the Sith (Glossy paint scheme, armour over robes, etc) follow more in line to the look of ESB Vader when compared to A New Hope. Meaning they get to see similar style props on screen for a greater period of time which extends the ESB look to Vader in 2 out of the 3 original movies.
Con’s:
Inconsistency
The true Hero set up is very scattered on screen to a point of not sharing much screen time. 2 different helmets and 2 cape sets make up the ESB hero as well as things like the armour subtle differences so linking a particular favourite look to a scene is harder than it is compared to ANH. The stunt set takes up a more consistent chunk in one go and inter-cut with hero shots, featuring some props mixed with the wrong piece. The Hero’s are also mixed at times due to later edited material being inserted. To cover all the ESB Vader’s you have to give credit to 3 predominantly different set ups give or take , unlike ANH which is mainly just one costume.
Refined Look
The helmet is more refined to an extent than ANH. The brows show more which makes the Empire Vader look softer with the cut peak and raised dome. The dome is more polished than ANH in appearance without it being dulled down. Both tusks have been installed and the armour is outside and more shiny than ANH Vader. Accommodating this look is the more handsome chestbox and more up to date looking belt box components. However, this look shows Vader isn’t as battle worn and may be perceived like he doesn’t do as much, even though the costume is far from pristine. It's actually fairly beat up. The movie shows us Vader just doesn't sit around in it that's for sure.
Flipped scenes relating to paint
Empire suffers from various flipped scenes, although ANH also features them it is not to the severe degree of Empire. These are shown in some Star Destroyer scenes, the Palpatine Hologram conference, the duel and later on at the end with Luke. This also may be why some companies have painted the gunmetal on the incorrect cheek, as they used one of these scenes as a guide, once again it‘s inconsistency.
Pro’s/Movie: ESB Darth Vader
Killing Admiral Ozzel
Some may say the little finger gesture to Motti was impressive, but here Vader causally chats with his new Admiral while strangling his victim without raising a finger, they aren't even in the same room.
Hoth
Like in ANH, Vader gets to go to Hoth himself to collect his rebels, displaying on from ANH that he isn’t one to let the hired help do all the work.
Dagobah
While definitely not a moment for Vader the darkness of this scene and the defeat of the Dark Lord is impressive, sometimes you like to see you’re favourite bad guy defeated, even for a brief moment to know how much they can tolerate before they are finally defeated, even if an illusion.
Killing Captain Needa
Another effortless performance from Vader. Displaying that he won’t tolerate failure, if this is hinted at in ANH he really shows who the boss is by killing people in his own team. You just knew as soon as Needa was going to “personally apologise” face to face that Vader was going to kill him.
Bounty Hunters
This shows yet again that Vader thinks outside the box and where he think’s the Empire is failing him he recruit’s the help of Bounty Hunters. The addition of the hunters is a bonus to the movie but shows Vader is the one controlling everything.
Bespin Confrontation
One of my favourite scenes of all time. There’s such a calmness and confidence to Vader. We had seen laser bolts kill a vast majority of people throughout the movies up till then where as on Vader, he causally sticks out one hand and absorbs/deflects the effect with ease, removing Solo’s weapon with the force followed by the delivery “We would be honoured if you would join us”. And you thought Han was cocky, Classic!
Duel
The duel picks up pace from ANH. Vader is causal for much of the start (as he has been the whole movie while not breaking a sweat, until now), toying with Luke, using one hand, looking effortless, before Luke starts passing his tests. The 2nd act of the 3 act duel shows Vader’s power with his mind making the character of Darth Vader ever more powerful. Forget the Prequels, go back to 1980 and compare the movies. This was a great display from Vader. Cue round 3 he starts turning up the heat and after a point of frustration it’s time to end the game. Great duel and a massive step up in action on from the ANH Duel.
Confession
This normally rates in the top 10 of movie shockers in many polls around the world. Before the Prequels this put a vital twist on the original movies. It gave another dimension to Vader. Some thought he was lying just to get Luke to join the Darkside and over throw the Emperor until it was confirmed 3 years later in Jedi.
One Liners
Some die hard fans may not care for the in cheek humour that Vader displays but some of his quotes from Empire go hand in hand as the most memorable. Vader’s timing of his actions with the delivery is priceless. It gave the ESB Vader a more human image although wicked streak. Enhancing his evilness as a villain.
Character Development (regarding 1980)
You get to see another side of Vader that is more established thanks to the story line. We now know he is not a complete cyborg but a human. The mystique is still present as you don't see him unmasked while we've been teased in the Med Chamber shot.
Con’s:
One Liner’s
Some may view the Vader one liners as classic, others view them as corny and non humorous.
I am your Father
We have all had time to adjust to George Lucas’s developed storyline but back in 1980, some people preferred the idea of Vader killing Luke’s Father, Not being his Father.
Most memorable lines in the movie:
“He’s as clumsy as he is stupid“.
“Apology Excepted, Captain Needa”
“Don’t fail me again, Admiral”.
“There will be a substantial reward for the one who finds the Millennium Falcon. You are free to use any methods necessary but I want them alive - No disintegrations“!
“We would be honoured if you would join us“.
“I am altering the deal. Pray I don't alter it any further”
“The force is with you, young Skywalker, but you are not a Jedi yet“.
“All too easy”.
“Impressive, most impressive”.
“There is no escape. Don't make me destroy you.”
“If you only knew the power of the Dark Side”
“Join me, and together we can rule the galaxy as father and son“.
“No! I, am your Father”.
Movie Portrayal Summary- ESB Vader:
Some say ANH is Luke’s movie, ESB is Vader’s movie and ROTJ is the Emperor’s movie. Those would be the guys that would receive Oscars.
Picking up 3 years after ANH, Vader is back and meaner than ever. When Star Wars first came on the scene in 1977 villains like Vader took off far more than what George Lucas expected. However, I wonder if not for the portrayal in Empire though whether Vader would be amongst the best villains of all time today? Vader would’ve still been considered a great villain I have no doubt there but not perhaps as cementing his role in our minds as he did after Empire. In Return of the JedI, while still the evil guy that we know it’s only off the back foot of Empire that he gets that form of credibility. Empire set it up so that in JedI (apart from the duel )he didn’t have to do anything other than to develop into the torn Anakin Vader while he isn’t bowing at the Emperor’s feet, he just has to hint at being Vader and we recall what a nasty **** he can be. Credit still goes to ANH Vader with the character building from that foundation.
Vader is free to reign without Tarkin in ESB. Doing evil deeds, in his flashy Star Destroyer containing his little Meditation Chamber, with his own theme (Imperial March) playing every time he’s on screen. He almost seems at times not in control and he paints a picture of a villain throughout, so much so that many people thought for 3 years until JedI came out that he was lying about being Luke’s Father.
The deflection of Han’s lazer bolts, the finger pointing to “All too easy” and imperial officers dropping like flies (well), it’s Vader at his best with a combination of many points that make up a truly great Villain. With the exception of the ANH Vader face (perhaps costume additionally) being meaner looking, this movie is what propelled the character of Darth Vader into one of the best Villains of all time still more than 30 years on and perhaps the epitome of what he represents if you ignore the Prequels.
ESB Vader Is definitely the reason why I personally liked Vader throughout my childhood and continue to naturally do so (along with ANH I might add).
Yeah, I must be :lol.
Thanks fellas.
Thanks fellas.
Best lines out of any Star Wars movie:
Leia "I love you"
Han Solo "I Know"
What a pimp! I love that! Brings a smile to my face whenever I think about it.
Leia "I love you"
Han Solo "I Know"
What a pimp! I love that! Brings a smile to my face whenever I think about it.
Darth Niob
Sr Member
Great review Paul
thumbsup:thumbsup
thumbsup:thumbsup
Darth Lars
Master Member
This is me in my (still rare) Hoth/Snowspeeder variant of the Rebel Pilot costume. I will be trooping with this in Finse later this year!
The chest box has an ESB-specific color scheme and positions of greeblies. The jacket and soft helmet are also specific for this variant.
These pictures were taken last summer, and since then I have replaced the chest box straps with screen-accurate Nato spec straps and added loops on the belt for "belt flares". I have yet to get/make myself some snow boots, but the black ones are also screen-accurate. (within the hangar at least ...). Of the non-real world items, I have bought only the chest badge (CE), flight suit and parts of the helmet -- the rest is my make. :cool
Check out my tutorial for the jacket.
I will be offering casts of the wrist comm pad in the Junkyard soon.
Darth Lars
Master Member
You know that Harrison Ford ad lib'd it, don't you. He was supposed to have said "I love you too", but they had retaken that scene so many times and he got quite tired of doing it ... :lol
Luke's classic line "You're lucky you don't taste very good" after R2 had been spat out was also ad lib'd ... but was sadly included only in the original 35 mm version of the movie. The 70 mm version ... and the Special Edition, had the line from the script, but nobody remembers that.:rolleyes
Cpl Potter
Sr Member
my first movie memory ( seeing c3p0 on the big screen) i can remember it like it was yesterday , i was seven . we walked into the theatre in madison wisconsin . just a tad after it started ,and there was this huge gold robot on the screen , i was mesmorized , so anh to me is the greatest movie ever made , that being said esb is the greatest sequel ever made ( followed ever so closely by aliens ) , and boba fett is my all time favorite star wars character .. so its hard to pick , but my love for star wars started with anh , so thats where its at for me ..
Keith
Sr Member
I remember going to see ESB like it was yesterday.
It was a saturday afternoon, my Mum and Dad had a big argument about something. My Dad grabbed my hand, stormed out of the house with me and we drove off in his van.
We ended up in Manchester town center and he said lets go and see the new star wars film.
I thought it was a fantastic film and still do. The best film EVER in fact.
I remember saying to my Dad "where are all the stormtroopers?" I was glad to see them when they did show up. I remember thinking it was a very scary film, nothing like ANH. Back then kids wasn't as used to scary stuff as kids are today.
I also remember thinking that my Mum must be wondering where we are once or twice.
After the film he took me to a toy shop in the arndale center in Manchester and bought me the Darth Vader figure for 99 pence. The only figures i had at that point were two stormtroopers.
Keith.
It was a saturday afternoon, my Mum and Dad had a big argument about something. My Dad grabbed my hand, stormed out of the house with me and we drove off in his van.
We ended up in Manchester town center and he said lets go and see the new star wars film.
I thought it was a fantastic film and still do. The best film EVER in fact.
I remember saying to my Dad "where are all the stormtroopers?" I was glad to see them when they did show up. I remember thinking it was a very scary film, nothing like ANH. Back then kids wasn't as used to scary stuff as kids are today.
I also remember thinking that my Mum must be wondering where we are once or twice.
After the film he took me to a toy shop in the arndale center in Manchester and bought me the Darth Vader figure for 99 pence. The only figures i had at that point were two stormtroopers.
Keith.
Davy Jones
Sr Member
I dont have any finished ESB props to show yet but my favorite is Fett.
Come on people more of you must have ESB props/images to post? Lets see some straight up ESB goodness!
Come on people more of you must have ESB props/images to post? Lets see some straight up ESB goodness!
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